Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 00:04:00 -0800 (PST) From: kenneth broomfield Subject: [PRR] Steam Engine Couplers X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6603.0 Subject: [PRR] Mutaul and Pennsy Magazines Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 06:20:03 -0500 Message-ID: <428BC948616D534DA0860EDF33F542AB027A34@INDYSMAIL02.am.thmulti.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [PRR] Savannah Prototype Modeelrs Meet April 8 and 9 Thread-Index: AcUeBOV89o5TVcsZRmmc9045UkdkugAS16Vg From: "Colman Gerald \(TTE\)" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Mar 2005 11:20:05.0970 (UTC) FILETIME=[9EC2A320:01C51E50] Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net To List: Wanted: Mutual Magazines March 1956 Isssue of Pennsy Magazine December 1956 Issue of Pennsy Magazine Please contact me off-list if you have any to sell. Thanks, Jerry Colman ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Park Varieties" Subject: [PRR] Bowser Ho Cars For Sale Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 07:50:21 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net I have the following surplus mint Bowser HO undecorated round roof kits = available for sale: 2 #55300 40' single door; inset roof 1 #55310 40' single door; flush roof 1 #55363 40' "turtle roof" single door 1 #55340 40' double door; inset roof 2 #55350 40' double door; flush roof 4 #55400 50' double door; flush roof All cars are $6.75 each plus actual Parcel Post shipping to your ZIP = Code. No minimum quantity requirement. Please respond directly to me = including your ZIP Code so I can quote shipping cost. Buy with = confidence; my curent Ebay rating (parkvarieties) is 950. Thanks. Frank Brua ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Message-Id: <9e0219c9b68a563f6468c0bb39409186@pennsyrr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed To: Conrail-Talk LIST , PRR-Talk LIST From: Jerry Britton Subject: [PRR] FOR SALE -- HO and N Scale HARRIS Tower Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 08:04:01 -0500 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net 1st of the month "For Sale" post... Merchandise Service has commissioned The N Scale Architect to produce HARRIS tower in HO and N scales. The N Scale Architect recently produced ALTO tower and the response was excellent. HARRIS is a brick tower and protected the western end of the Harrisburg, Pa., passenger station. It was built by the PRR and was succeeded by Penn Central and Amtrak. Today it is restored by the Harrisburg Chapter of the NRHS. This will be a limited release and is the first in a series of anticipated tower projects. For more information, please see... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com/ms_harris.html Thank you. ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Cc: PRR From: Bruce Smith Subject: Re: [PRR] Steam Engine Couplers Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 07:56:07 -0600 To: kenneth broomfield X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net On Mar 1, 2005, at 2:04 AM, kenneth broomfield wrote: > Hello everyone. I have several steamers in my fleet all from IHC, > Broadway Limited, Mantua, and Spectrum. Is there anyway that you can > put operating couplers instead of the dummy couplers on there? > Obviously it does not matter if they are KD or Horn Hook. Kenneth, Your last comment doesn't really make sense to me, since there are a wide variety of different shanks available in Kadee couplers, but not in "horn hook". In addition, if you are interested in making these conversion, surely you are not using BOTH styles? Finally, each of these makers has different issues, and in fact, sometimes w/in a maker things change, like BLI - who now seems to offer locos with WORKING front couplers (yipee!). So, as a general reference, I suggest the Kadee conversion guide at: http://www.kadee.com/conv/ho.htm And when you have specific questions... just ask! Regards Bruce Bruce F. Smith Auburn, AL http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/ "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin __ / \ __<+--+>________________\__/___ ________________________________ |- ______/ O O \_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ | | / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 \ | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__|| |/_____________________________\|_|________________________________| | O--O \0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Chany, Christopher" Subject: [PRR] Bethlehem Car Works PRR heavyweight Parlor car Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 11:47:48 -0500 From: "Park Varieties" Subject: [PRR] For Sale: BLI N&W Hoppers For Your J1 Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 11:53:10 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Need some N&W hoppers to put behind your J1 for West End coal hauling?=20 I have a consignment sale of three sets of Broadway Limited N&W triple = hoppers from the first production run. These 6-car sets have the 17" = lettering and are new in the box in mint condition. Sets are: #804 (set A), #806 (set C) and #807 (set D) Each set has 6 different car numbers. Price is $99.95 per set plus = Parcel Post to your ZIP Code. You can buy one, two or all three sets.. Please reply to me directly = including your ZIP Code so I can quote shipping cost. Buy with = confidence; my current Ebay rating (parkvarieties) is 950. Thanks. Frank Brua ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Claus Schlund" Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 08:54:23 -0800 Subject: Re: [PRR] Sunnyside Yard From: "Chany, Christopher" Subject: [PRR] Sunnyside Yard From: "STEPHEN HOXIE" Subject: Re: [PRR] Bethlehem Car Works PRR heavyweight Parlor car Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 12:54:36 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Hi Chris--I just looked at http://www.bethlehemcarworks.com/Products/Craftsman_Kit_Cars/index.html but I didn't see a PRR Parlor Car. Do you know something that isn't on the website? Steve Hoxie Pensacola FL ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chany, Christopher" To: "PRR-Talk" Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 10:47 AM Subject: [PRR] Bethlehem Car Works PRR heavyweight Parlor car > Listers, > > Please excuse if a repeat but I didn't see it post. > > Anyone have a copy of the instructions for the Bethlehem Car Works PRR > heavyweight Parlor car that uses brass sides? > > Thanks > > Chris Chany > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] Bethlehem Car Works PRR heavyweight Parlor car Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 14:43:12 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 In-reply-to: <015f01c51e90$1d434940$6401a8c0@hoxiecomp> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 Thread-index: AcUeklYwD+fEw4d1Rh+YFaAail+gRwABAqNg Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net I don't know why its not listed. Perhaps they no longer offer the kit. The car was a PRR Parlor-Restaurant car. Cars in the class were Guardian, Defender, Enterprise, B'nai Brith, and Courageous (variant with end windows). Bethlehem did not offer Courageous. The decals are still listed! regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of STEPHEN HOXIE Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 1:55 PM To: PRR-Talk Subject: Re: [PRR] Bethlehem Car Works PRR heavyweight Parlor car Hi Chris--I just looked at http://www.bethlehemcarworks.com/Products/Craftsman_Kit_Cars/index.html but I didn't see a PRR Parlor Car. Do you know something that isn't on the website? Steve Hoxie Pensacola FL ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chany, Christopher" To: "PRR-Talk" Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 10:47 AM Subject: [PRR] Bethlehem Car Works PRR heavyweight Parlor car > Listers, > > Please excuse if a repeat but I didn't see it post. > > Anyone have a copy of the instructions for the Bethlehem Car Works PRR > heavyweight Parlor car that uses brass sides? > > Thanks > > Chris Chany > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 15:22:16 -0500 From: "Richard Poole" Subject: [PRR] ONE INCH SCALE FREIGHT CARS FOR SALE From: PKMac101@aol.com Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 16:07:23 EST Subject: [PRR] ITEMS for SALE Part 1 X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net List I have the following items for sale. Please contact OFF list with the above subject with questions. Prices DO NOT incl shp. A couple of the items are big and heavy.I do work out of town so responses may not be right away. PRR CT 1000E Nov 1,1945 - Good used cond $30 PRR CT 1000E Nov 1,1945 - New ,never issued,Excellent Cond $40 PRR CT 1000E Nov 1,1923-Very good cond $ 95 PRR CT 4001 6-1-1964,Excellent Cond.,never issued $20 PRR Altoona Shops & Yards,1905,Shows shop layout & complete yd $25 PRR Middle Division Interlocking Plants, Copy of 1914-1917 plans,Banks to Slope, Hollidaysburg Br,Morison Cove Br, 50 pgs,8-1/2 x 14 $25 PRR Map of 1881 MainLine from Alt. to Johnstown,Alleg. Portage RR & inclines, New Portage Br,Blue print copied from original linen. $9 PRR Mine Card & Revenue Waybill,has 3 copies with carbon paper $1 PRR Pocket calenders-1957 & 1960 $ 6 PRR Land Book of 1890 for South West Pennsylvania RailWay $350.00 PRR CT1515 Qualification Card-New,never issued $6 PRR MW200 Machinery Qualification Card- New,never issued $5 PRR MW52(D) Manual of Instructions for MW Equip. NO COVER, dated 1-1-60,very good cond. $21 PRR MW52(D) Unused,Excellent Cond $30 PRR C.E. 78 Manual for construction,unused, excellent cond. $30 PRR Gen. Notice No. 207-B, Clearances,7-1-1966, Excellent Cond. $40 PRR Demurrage Card-pad, unused $5 PRR Application for Position-Pad of 100 unused,for bidding on jobs $5 PRR Deposit Slip book-Pad,unused $5 PRR Annual Report-1925 $30 PRR Annual Report-1945 $25 PRR Annual Report - 1945,Hardbound cover,10 page Trans.& Progress,10 color pics incl 1946 cal picture,44 pg annual report,Good used cond. $50 PRR Annual Reports-1953,58 $12 PRR Annual Reports-1952,55,59,60,61,62 $15 PRR 1st Annual Report 1848 (1894 reprint)Front cover loose,pages brittle $45 PRR Locomotive Test Plant Book #18,test of K2sa-1914,Good cond. $25 PRR Locomotive Test Plant Book #32,test of I1s-1924,Good cond. $25 PRR Mid. Div ETT No.30 9-24-39 $40 PRR Mid. Div ETT No.31 4-28-40,Some G.O.'s,VG used $40 PRR Mid. Div ETT No.32 9-29-40,No G.O.'s, VG used $40 PRR Mid. Div ETT No.33 4-27-41,No G.O.'s,VG used $40 PRR Mid. Div ETT No.3 12-6-42,Some G.O.'s VG used $40 PRR Mid. Div ETT No.4 11-14-43,No G.O.'s,VG used $40 PRR Mid. Div ETT No.1 9-30-51,Some G.O.'s,pencil notes & marks,VG used $30 PRR Pgh. Reg. ETT No.5, 4-27-58,G.O.'s,VG used $25 PRR Pgh. Reg. ETT No.6, 10-26-58,VG used,unissued $25 PRR Pgh. Reg. ETT No.8, 10-25-59,VG used cond,not issued $25 PRR Pgh. Reg. ETT No.11,10-29-61,VG used cond,w/G.O.'s $20 PRR Pgh. Reg. ETT No.12,10-28-62, VG used cond,w/G.O.'s $20 PRR Cent. Reg.ETT No.4, 10-27-67,Good used cond,has all G.O.'s $20 PRR Hiring Manual - Nov,1956 Very good cond, $20 PRR Elec. Opr. Inst.,1960 rev.,VG cond, unissued $9 PRR Book of Rules,10-28-56,VG cond,unissued $9 PRR Storage stamps for baggage-full book of 100 - 5 cents, 35 cents, 75 cents $10 ea.bk PRR Grab bag assrtmnt of over 23 items in brown interoffice evlp - $25 PRR Leather Conductors wallet,Excellent Cond,slight wear on gold "RAILROAD" $30 PRR Leather Conductors wallet (well used)name still visible $5 PRR 25 year Bronze service pin $30 PRR 40 year Silver service pin $30 PRR Brite-Star Flashlight,Black,heavily used cond,Name very hard to read but there, works $12 PRR Flag & Fusee Case, Good used cond,Paint chipped from use $45 PRR Lounge Car Smoking Stand,Good used cond,not perfect,as it came out of the lounge car,Heavy $450.00 PRR Stainless Steel water can,Very Good cond $45, also 1 W/O lid - $40 PRR Keystone Whistle Sign,Excellent cond,Repainted( had to as old paint was falling off and was very rusty),Heavy $250 Thank you Pat McKinney PKMac101@aol.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: PKMac101@aol.com Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 16:07:28 EST Subject: [PRR] ITEMS for SALE Part2 X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net List I have the following items for sale. Please contact OFF list with the above subject with questions. Prices DO NOT incl shp. A couple of the items are big and heavy.I do work out of town so responses may not be right away. PC CT-225-G Haz. Mtl. Reg-plastic cover,good cond $12 PC 1969 Annual Report-Fair cond-water marks on cover only $5 PC 1967 Annual Report - good used cond $10 PC 1968 Annual Report - good used cond $10 PC Cent. Reg. ETT No.4 5-1-70,New,no G.O.'s $17 PC Cent. Reg. ETT No.4 5-1-70,with G.O.'s $15 PC Cent. Reg. ETT No.5 12-15-72,with green vinyl cover $18 PC Leather Conductors Wallet,Well used but still nice cond $10 PC MW1-New Unused $ 15 PC MW4-Used but excellent cond,field notes on some pages,1section for inspection,2nd section for construction $12 PC Grab Bag assrmnt of 14 items in Lrg PC 11 x 14 envlp - $20 PC MW4 - New cond,no cover $10 PC MW4 - New Cond,unused $15 PC Hand towel,Green logo and name sewn in - $18 PC Trainman Hat Badge - Excellent Cond - $45 PC Lapel pins for Cond. & Trainman uniform $40 PC Long neck Journal oil can,VG used cond $45 CR C&S Signal plans,Blue CR logo on cover,NEW,not issued $100 CR Lapel pins for Cond. & Trainman uniform $40 CR Annual Report-1982,83,85,86,87 $12 CR MW-4,NEW,never used, excellent cond. $30 CR Safety Committee sewn patch,blue background,white logo and letters $10 CR First Aid Kit,Opened,one or two packets used,VG cond,a must for train room $35 Pullman Brass Car Door handles-From Heavyweight PRR Sleepers,old former camp cars,some dinges and dents mostly to door knob,latchs move,heavy $35 Pullman Hand Towel,has PC & UP logo stamped in black ink over ea.other,gd cond - $18 Great Northern Atlas N scale FA1 (2 units)-older stock,not run,tested only $50pr Atlas SD7,w/DB, undec,new ,tested only,cracked plastic box $45 Atlas SD9,NKP,no DB,new ,tested only,w/plastic box $45 Unmarked Kero can,used good cond. - $35 Unmarked Battery Flashing Markers - New, Orange plastic body,yellow lens - $40ea or$70pr Unmarked Battery Flashing Markers,good used cond,not perfect but still work fine,plastic body,1-yellow, 1-orange $30ea or $50pr Unmarked STARR Car Insp blue lite,non-Flashing,orange body - $25 Thank you. Pat McKinney PKMac101@aol.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Ted Andrews" Subject: [PRR] September 6, 1965; Warsaw, Indiana Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 22:21:47 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net PRR Listers: Here is a somber entry in the Warsaw Tower (KS) on the Fort Wayne Line = for September 6, 1965: "CG-2 (GP-9 7062) hit auto at Youngs crossing 6:39pm. Killed Brenda = Lombardi psgr. Sent Gerald A. Lombardi sent to hospital. Murphy Medical = Center. Address 1125 Erie St. Logansport, Ind. 1st release 7:25pm 2nd release at 7:52pm" =20 ...these accidents still happen today despite Operation Lifesaver. =20 Ted ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "J W Box" Subject: [PRR] PRR Turntable Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 22:47:18 -0500 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4927.1200 In-reply-to: <11952-3EA43264-511@storefull-2113.public.lawson.webtv.net> Importance: Normal Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Dear Listers: Someday, I'd like to make a PRR turntable. Does anyone know where I can find plans for the table itself? I can find plans for the foundations and the wood decking, but not for the table, the gantry or the control house. Any guidance would be appreciated. Bill Box ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 21:42:13 -0600 (CST) Subject: [PRR] For Sale: Sunset I1 w/long haul tender From: smithbf@vetmed.auburn.edu X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Importance: Normal References: In-Reply-To: Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Hi Folks, I am offering a Sunset Models Prestige Series I1, unpainted for $300 plus shipping and insurance (required). I bought this loco before I knew what a "modern" front end was . This is a GREAT "starter" brass engine. The loco has had very little use and shows no tread wear. It runs well on my test track. Almost no tarnish (see photos). This loco features: -Sprung drivers -Drivers 2,3 and 4 are "blind" -"Modern" front end -air pumps on fireman's and engineer's sides -Long haul tender with 3 man doghouse and 8 wheel trucks -Parallel hatches on tender deck, no train phone (but the correct hatch arrangement for one) -Rear kadee #5, front dummy coupler -Can motor -Stamped backhead detail -Original box (moderate wear) Photos: http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/BFSpages/Models/I101.jpg http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/BFSpages/Models/I102.jpg http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/BFSpages/Models/I103.jpg http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/BFSpages/Models/I104.jpg I want to "thin the herd" a bit, and since this loco is after my time, it needs to go! This might be a great project for you to do when PRRPro starts the I1 project. The easiest approach would be to simply paint it. However, some of the details can be replaced or upgraded to make a truely unique loco, and with that BIG tender, its a cinch for a soundtraxx installation. Regards Bruce Bruce Smith Auburn, AL ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Douglas Nelson" Subject: RE: [PRR] Sunnyside Yard Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 19:46:04 -0800 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <1102426429-19459863@dsop.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-ELNK-Trace: 6b73c4bfaee5d95e1a2467d70233b1a70a9da525759e2654c27fa030e395f110330e913a52989da1f966978d6047df59350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 165.121.199.114 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net This is one of Claus' and my favorite subjects, but I may have to = suggest a slight disagreement. I agree that these lattice poles are from the = original 1910 construction of Sunnyside Yard. My initial thought was that they transmitted power for the third rail electrification, but these poles carried 28 closely spaced separate wires that were present at least = through the 1950s, some 30 years after the 1933 conversion to overhead catenary. Therefore, I think that these poles carried telegraph/telephone wires = rather than electric power. Or maybe they carried both? They remain a great relic. Doug Nelson -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Claus Schlund Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 8:54 AM To: Chany, Christopher Cc: prr-talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] Sunnyside Yard Hi, These were for the 1906 DC electrification. Remember, when Sunnyside first openen, there was no catenary. Everything = was third rail until the early 1930's. There are similar lattice poles at the Hackensack River swing bridge in NJ. They are still there today, but devoid of wires. - Claus From: "Chany, Christopher" To: 'PRR-Talk LIST' Subject: [PRR] Sunnyside Yard Date sent: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 15:52:45 -0500 > Listers, >=20 > A friend was out taking photos of Sunnyside yard the other day. In=20 > the photos there are what look like large telephone pole type=20 > structures. They are higher than the catenary poles, have cross arms = like telephone poles, > but have metal lattice "poles". Currently they have no wires on = them. > Anyone know what they were used for, and when the wires were removed? >=20 >=20 > Chris Chany >=20 >=20 > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > - > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. >=20 >=20 >=20 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "J W Box" Subject: [PRR] Loco cab coverings Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 22:57:23 -0500 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4927.1200 In-reply-to: <11952-3EA43264-511@storefull-2113.public.lawson.webtv.net> Importance: Normal Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Listers: I have an old issue of "The High Line" that has a great photo of a B8 and an H class loco (If I remember right) on the turntable in Philadelphia. Both of their cab roofs are clearly covered with a cloth-like material. You can see the wrinkles. Does anyone know if this was standard practice? I have never seen this modeled. It would make for a distinctive feature and almost completely obliterates the rivets. Bill Box ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Ken Hough " Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2005 21:52:08 -0600 Subject: Re: [PRR] PRR Turntable From: "Robert Kessler" Subject: RE: [PRR] Bethlehem Car Works PRR heavyweight Parlor car Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 20:18:05 -0800 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 Thread-Index: AcUeo8tYXBH69jdPQjyxhlZXDmC7YgANfEHw In-Reply-To: <38132.75859@dsop.com> Message-ID: <1102385384-21922790@dsop.com> Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Chris: Bethlehem Car Works listed the car sides as part #441 in the past. They are no longer offered on the web site. The sides were not part of a kit, but, to be used in place of the original sides of the Rivarossi 12-1 Pullman. I will be building my model later this year and visualize the process as being similar to using brass car sides with a "core" kit. Model Railroader has what looks like a pretty good series going on this topic in their March and April 2005 issues. I can answer detailed questions off-list. Bob Kessler ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "John Peters" Subject: Re: [PRR] Sunnyside Yard Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 08:58:44 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net You may have forgotten the third rail remained in place on many yard tracks into the 1960's inclusing all traversed by LIRR passenger into Penn Sta. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Douglas Nelson" To: "'Claus Schlund'" ; "'Chany, Christopher'" Cc: Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 10:46 PM Subject: RE: [PRR] Sunnyside Yard This is one of Claus' and my favorite subjects, but I may have to suggest a slight disagreement. I agree that these lattice poles are from the original 1910 construction of Sunnyside Yard. My initial thought was that they transmitted power for the third rail electrification, but these poles carried 28 closely spaced separate wires that were present at least through the 1950s, some 30 years after the 1933 conversion to overhead catenary. Therefore, I think that these poles carried telegraph/telephone wires rather than electric power. Or maybe they carried both? They remain a great relic. Doug Nelson -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Claus Schlund Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 8:54 AM To: Chany, Christopher Cc: prr-talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] Sunnyside Yard Hi, These were for the 1906 DC electrification. Remember, when Sunnyside first openen, there was no catenary. Everything was third rail until the early 1930's. There are similar lattice poles at the Hackensack River swing bridge in NJ. They are still there today, but devoid of wires. - Claus From: "Chany, Christopher" To: 'PRR-Talk LIST' Subject: [PRR] Sunnyside Yard Date sent: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 15:52:45 -0500 > Listers, > > A friend was out taking photos of Sunnyside yard the other day. In > the photos there are what look like large telephone pole type > structures. They are higher than the catenary poles, have cross arms like telephone poles, > but have metal lattice "poles". Currently they have no wires on them. > Anyone know what they were used for, and when the wires were removed? > > > Chris Chany > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > - > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Ted Andrews" Subject: [PRR] U-25B Question.....THANK YOU Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 21:45:15 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Thank you for all who responded to my question a few days ago. I will = model accordingly. Ted ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Ted Andrews" Subject: [PRR] Trailer Train question Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2005 21:52:54 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Listers: While this is not strictly on PRR subject matter, the Pennsy did haul = allot of these cars in their Truc Trains. Does anyone make decals for = Trailer Train flat cars for the mid-60's era? Specifically, I am looking = the those decals used on 85', 86', and 89' long flat cars that were = painted boxcar red. I know that Champ made some (part no. HC-296) but = these are few and far between. One other question on these cars. What was the color used on the top = (wearing) surface of these cars? Some shade of light gray? Also, were = the wooden skids that straddled the fifth wheel painted this gray color = as well? Thanks in advance! ...now off to run my 1965 TT-1 headed by 3 GP-35's! Ted ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: John Frantz Subject: [PRR] Queen Mary Pix Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 07:15:08 -0500 X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at suscom.net Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Listers, I've been trying to find some pictures of the Queen Mary in th 1950's. So far all i've found are ones from the 1960's. I'm trying to see if the letterboard ever had Pennsylvania on it. 1960's pictures show it had two keystones on either end, with standard dulux striping, and its name "Queen Mary" centered on the car. I'm planning on modeling the car based on its 1950's appearance. Thanks for any help. Best Regards, John York, PA Crossroads of the Pennsylvania Railroad, Western Maryland, and Maryland & Pennsylvania. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5.7226.0 Subject: RE: [PRR] Queen Mary Pix Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 07:44:52 -0600 Message-ID: <2261A19CD8CAD8449EFD62CAA311A748D12806@EXCHANGE.herzogcompanies.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [PRR] Queen Mary Pix thread-index: AcUf7GeXny9eZbNES1KwfvT//irdegACoqYg From: "Bill Volkmer" To: "John Frantz" Cc: Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net When I was at Penn Coach Yard from April 1961 to April 1962 the QM had the standard Pennsylvania lettering. It was repainted sometime around the middle of 1963, probably in time for the Army Navy Game, about the only place it was ever used after 1960 or so. WDV -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of John Frantz Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 7:15 AM To: PRR-talk@dsop.com Subject: [PRR] Queen Mary Pix Listers, I've been trying to find some pictures of the Queen Mary=20 in th 1950's. So far all i've found are ones from the=20 1960's. I'm trying to see if the letterboard ever had=20 Pennsylvania on it. 1960's pictures show it had two=20 keystones on either end, with standard dulux striping, and=20 its name "Queen Mary" centered on the car. I'm planning on=20 modeling the car based on its 1950's appearance. Thanks for any help. Best Regards, John York, PA Crossroads of the Pennsylvania Railroad, Western Maryland,=20 and Maryland & Pennsylvania. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: John Frantz Subject: Re: [PRR] Queen Mary Pix Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 09:24:51 -0500 X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at suscom.net Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Bill, Thanks. My dad has a poster size picture on the wall of a Stockholders Special being pushed into the new warehouse facilities in York, PA of McCrory Stores in 1963. Although consisting of about 5 Budd coaches, the QM was on the rear end. I can check the exact date when I get home. The paint scheme was after the re-paint. Regards, John "Bill Volkmer" wrote: > When I was at Penn Coach Yard from April 1961 to April >1962 the QM had > the standard Pennsylvania lettering. It was repainted >sometime around > the middle of 1963, probably in time for the Army Navy >Game, about the > only place it was ever used after 1960 or so. > > WDV ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5.7226.0 Subject: RE: [PRR] Trailer Train question Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 08:26:08 -0600 Message-ID: <2261A19CD8CAD8449EFD62CAA311A748D1281B@EXCHANGE.herzogcompanies.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [PRR] Trailer Train question thread-index: AcUfmuMQEgVhPLLpTX+YBfRoUJesOAAYfZJw From: "Bill Volkmer" To: "Ted Andrews" , "PRR Talk" Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Truc Train was started by PRR. JP Newell was VP PRR and Pres. Truc Train. So this is NOT off topic. -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Ted Andrews Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2005 9:53 PM To: PRR Talk Subject: [PRR] Trailer Train question Listers: While this is not strictly on PRR subject matter, the Pennsy did haul allot of these cars in their Truc Trains. Does anyone make decals for Trailer Train flat cars for the mid-60's era? Specifically, I am looking the those decals used on 85', 86', and 89' long flat cars that were painted boxcar red. I know that Champ made some (part no. HC-296) but these are few and far between. One other question on these cars. What was the color used on the top (wearing) surface of these cars? Some shade of light gray? Also, were the wooden skids that straddled the fifth wheel painted this gray color as well? Thanks in advance! ...now off to run my 1965 TT-1 headed by 3 GP-35's! Ted ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Cc: "PRR Talk" , "Ted Andrews" From: Jerry Britton Subject: Re: [PRR] Trailer Train question Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 09:53:07 -0500 To: "Bill Volkmer" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net On Mar 3, 2005, at 9:26 AM, Bill Volkmer wrote: > Truc Train was started by PRR. JP Newell was VP PRR and Pres. Truc > Train. So this is NOT off topic. Some time ago I started a "Overview of Truc Train" on Keystone Crossings... http://kc.pennsyrr.com/freightops/tructrain_overview.ws4d A formal announcement will be made at the PRRT&HS annual meeting in May that will give cause for prospective N scale TrucTrain modelers to be happy! ;-) ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: John Frantz Subject: Re: [PRR] Trailer Train question Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 10:01:17 -0500 X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at suscom.net Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Ted, Microscale makes appropriate decals for the boxcar red cars. http://www.microscale.com/decals/HO_scale/87552.jpg These also cover the TTX reporting that were used on F30d's. Regards, John > -----Original Message----- >From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On >Behalf Of Ted > Andrews > Sent: Wednesday, March 02, 2005 9:53 PM > To: PRR Talk > Subject: [PRR] Trailer Train question > > Listers: > > While this is not strictly on PRR subject matter, the >Pennsy did haul > allot of these cars in their Truc Trains. Does anyone >make decals for > Trailer Train flat cars for the mid-60's era? >Specifically, I am looking > the those decals used on 85', 86', and 89' long flat >cars that were > painted boxcar red. I know that Champ made some (part >no. HC-296) but > these are few and far between. > > One other question on these cars. What was the color >used on the top > (wearing) surface of these cars? Some shade of light >gray? Also, were > the wooden skids that straddled the fifth wheel painted >this gray color > as well? > > Thanks in advance! > > ...now off to run my 1965 TT-1 headed by 3 GP-35's! > > Ted > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- >For assistance with this list, please visit >http://lists.dsop.com. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- >For assistance with this list, please visit >http://lists.dsop.com. > York, PA Crossroads of the Pennsylvania Railroad, Western Maryland, and Maryland & Pennsylvania. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: ndbprr@att.net Subject: [PRR] Power usage Date: Thu, 03 Mar 2005 17:46:35 +0000 X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net As I understand engine usage the motors were assigned by the Philadelphia power director. Who determined where the steam and diesels were used? ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5.7226.0 Subject: RE: [PRR] Power usage Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 12:38:34 -0600 Message-ID: <2261A19CD8CAD8449EFD62CAA311A748D12844@EXCHANGE.herzogcompanies.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [PRR] Power usage thread-index: AcUgGtiFVcujJyOoRuK5n7n5alp3dgABGfeA From: "Bill Volkmer" To: , "PRR-Talk" Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net There was a diesel bureau in Philadelphia that assigned power to the trains systemwide. They had to keep track of the "due" dates for Monthly inspections and had to make sure, for example, that a GP9 making a turn in Chicago and due for MI in Enola the next day, was not dispatched to Logansport. The power bureau also had to look ahead at the anticipated tonnage in a particular direction which accounted for the need to frequently operate lite engine moves in the electrified territory. I believe that the steam locos were all assigned to a particular division and there was no opportunity for them to stray more than one division point away from their assigned maintenance base. Thus a locomotive at, say, Enola that was assigned to East Altoona, would not be assigned to a train going to Buffalo. -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of ndbprr@att.net Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 12:47 PM To: PRR-Talk Subject: [PRR] Power usage As I understand engine usage the motors were assigned by the Philadelphia power director. Who determined where the steam and diesels were used? ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Chany, Christopher" Subject: RE: [PRR] Bethlehem Car Works PRR heavyweight Parlor car Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2005 14:14:31 -0500 From: STEPHEN HOXIE [mailto:stevehprr@cox.net] Subject: Re: [PRR] Bethlehem Car Works PRR heavyweight Parlor car From: "Chany, Christopher" Subject: [PRR] Bethlehem Car Works PRR heavyweight Parlor car From: "John Peters" Subject: Re: [PRR] Power usage Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 15:15:32 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net The power bureau I remember also took care of motors as well as diesel and covered the entire Eastern Region pass and Freight (1970's). In the '50s and before, Jake Grosmick handled all P-RSL and Altantic Div. from 22 Federal St. Camden and was called "power clerk". I remember the Philly operation was on the 4th floor west side 30th st. and had a large board with magnetic tags for each locomotive and a general layout of assignments and yards............... not to be confused with "power director", another office in charge of the big catenery board ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Volkmer" To: ; "PRR-Talk" Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 1:38 PM Subject: RE: [PRR] Power usage There was a diesel bureau in Philadelphia that assigned power to the trains systemwide. They had to keep track of the "due" dates for Monthly inspections and had to make sure, for example, that a GP9 making a turn in Chicago and due for MI in Enola the next day, was not dispatched to Logansport. The power bureau also had to look ahead at the anticipated tonnage in a particular direction which accounted for the need to frequently operate lite engine moves in the electrified territory. I believe that the steam locos were all assigned to a particular division and there was no opportunity for them to stray more than one division point away from their assigned maintenance base. Thus a locomotive at, say, Enola that was assigned to East Altoona, would not be assigned to a train going to Buffalo. -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of ndbprr@att.net Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 12:47 PM To: PRR-Talk Subject: [PRR] Power usage As I understand engine usage the motors were assigned by the Philadelphia power director. Who determined where the steam and diesels were used? ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5.7226.0 Subject: RE: [PRR] Power usage Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 14:35:31 -0600 Message-ID: <2261A19CD8CAD8449EFD62CAA311A748D12864@EXCHANGE.herzogcompanies.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [PRR] Power usage thread-index: AcUgLcpGkvQEKhdhS16CQHj2aupd+AAAl6Fg From: "Bill Volkmer" To: "John Peters" , , "PRR-Talk" Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Tom Flanagan, (deceased) was one of the railfans who worked that Bureau. He had an apartment across the street from #6 Penn Center and rode two elevators to and from work. His boss was R.E. Pinkham who later went over to PATCO. -----Original Message----- From: John Peters [mailto:boomerjdpeters@snip.net]=20 Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 3:16 PM To: Bill Volkmer; ndbprr@att.net; PRR-Talk Subject: Re: [PRR] Power usage The power bureau I remember also took care of motors as well as diesel and=20 covered the entire Eastern Region pass and Freight (1970's). In the '50s and=20 before, Jake Grosmick handled all P-RSL and Altantic Div. from 22 Federal=20 St. Camden and was called "power clerk". I remember the Philly operation was on the 4th floor west side 30th st. and=20 had a large board with magnetic tags for each locomotive and a general=20 layout of assignments and yards............... not to be confused with "power director", another office in charge of the=20 big catenery board ----- Original Message -----=20 From: "Bill Volkmer" To: ; "PRR-Talk" Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 1:38 PM Subject: RE: [PRR] Power usage There was a diesel bureau in Philadelphia that assigned power to the trains systemwide. They had to keep track of the "due" dates for Monthly inspections and had to make sure, for example, that a GP9 making a turn in Chicago and due for MI in Enola the next day, was not dispatched to Logansport. The power bureau also had to look ahead at the anticipated tonnage in a particular direction which accounted for the need to frequently operate lite engine moves in the electrified territory. I believe that the steam locos were all assigned to a particular division and there was no opportunity for them to stray more than one division point away from their assigned maintenance base. Thus a locomotive at, say, Enola that was assigned to East Altoona, would not be assigned to a train going to Buffalo. -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of ndbprr@att.net Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 12:47 PM To: PRR-Talk Subject: [PRR] Power usage As I understand engine usage the motors were assigned by the Philadelphia power director. Who determined where the steam and diesels were used? ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: LAMAassoc@aol.com Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 15:37:15 EST Subject: Re: [PRR] Power usage - Side Issue X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Mac sub 46 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net In a message dated 3/3/05 6:41:52 PM, bvolkmer@herzogcompanies.com writes: > They had to keep track of the "due" dates for Monthly >inspections ************ Long after the departure of steam, these were still called "boiler washes." In fact, the annual physical that many Pennsy executives had to take were called "boiler washes." Is the term "boiler wash" still used today to mean personal physical examination? Regards, Marty ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5.7226.0 Subject: [PRR] Annual Boiler Washes (non-locomotive type) Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 14:49:35 -0600 Message-ID: <2261A19CD8CAD8449EFD62CAA311A748D12869@EXCHANGE.herzogcompanies.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Annual Boiler Washes (non-locomotive type) thread-index: AcUgMM4+72takqeORHK62opP7PAXDgAAEVpg From: "Bill Volkmer" To: , , Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Long after the departure of steam, these were still called "boiler washes."=20 In fact, the annual physical that many Pennsy executives had to take were=20 called "boiler washes." Is the term "boiler wash" still used today to mean personal physical=20 examination? OK Trivia Buffs, ARE YOU READY FOR ANOTHER bunch of useless PRR trivia? Here goes: The reason that the PRR executives referred to their annual physical exams as "boiler washes" was because everyone over the age of 40 was required to submit themselves to a proctoscope examination as part of the physical. Because the instrument that was used in those days resembled a sword with a light on the end of it, (not today's painless tools) the annual boiler wash was the most dreaded day of the year. Every Pennsy executive over the age of 40 could recite the date of his next "boiler wash" as quickly as he could his wife's birthday or his wedding anniversary! (he could also tell you how many days it was to his next boiler wash) That was one of the reasons I, myself, quit at age 32! My peers said it wouldn't be quite so bad if they didn't keep the danged thing in the FREEZER before they shoved it "home." Now aren't you glad you asked? WDV PS: This is NOT a side issue, it is a rear issue. -----Original Message----- From: LAMAassoc@aol.com [mailto:LAMAassoc@aol.com]=20 Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 3:37 PM To: Bill Volkmer; ndbprr@att.net; Prr-Talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] Power usage - Side Issue In a message dated 3/3/05 6:41:52 PM, bvolkmer@herzogcompanies.com writes: > They had to keep track of the "due" dates for Monthly >inspections=20 ************ Long after the departure of steam, these were still called "boiler washes."=20 In fact, the annual physical that many Pennsy executives had to take were=20 called "boiler washes." Is the term "boiler wash" still used today to mean personal physical=20 examination? Regards, Marty ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "John Peters" Subject: Re: [PRR] Power usage Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 15:51:18 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Roger that, another railfan, Larry Pulk (sp), worked in the same department middle trick but he was at 30th St. and that board was manned 24/7. boomer ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Volkmer" To: "John Peters" ; ; "PRR-Talk" Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 3:35 PM Subject: RE: [PRR] Power usage Tom Flanagan, (deceased) was one of the railfans who worked that Bureau. He had an apartment across the street from #6 Penn Center and rode two elevators to and from work. His boss was R.E. Pinkham who later went over to PATCO. -----Original Message----- From: John Peters [mailto:boomerjdpeters@snip.net] Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 3:16 PM To: Bill Volkmer; ndbprr@att.net; PRR-Talk Subject: Re: [PRR] Power usage The power bureau I remember also took care of motors as well as diesel and covered the entire Eastern Region pass and Freight (1970's). In the '50s and before, Jake Grosmick handled all P-RSL and Altantic Div. from 22 Federal St. Camden and was called "power clerk". I remember the Philly operation was on the 4th floor west side 30th st. and had a large board with magnetic tags for each locomotive and a general layout of assignments and yards............... not to be confused with "power director", another office in charge of the big catenery board ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Volkmer" To: ; "PRR-Talk" Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 1:38 PM Subject: RE: [PRR] Power usage There was a diesel bureau in Philadelphia that assigned power to the trains systemwide. They had to keep track of the "due" dates for Monthly inspections and had to make sure, for example, that a GP9 making a turn in Chicago and due for MI in Enola the next day, was not dispatched to Logansport. The power bureau also had to look ahead at the anticipated tonnage in a particular direction which accounted for the need to frequently operate lite engine moves in the electrified territory. I believe that the steam locos were all assigned to a particular division and there was no opportunity for them to stray more than one division point away from their assigned maintenance base. Thus a locomotive at, say, Enola that was assigned to East Altoona, would not be assigned to a train going to Buffalo. -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of ndbprr@att.net Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 12:47 PM To: PRR-Talk Subject: [PRR] Power usage As I understand engine usage the motors were assigned by the Philadelphia power director. Who determined where the steam and diesels were used? ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "John Peters" Subject: Re: [PRR] Power usage - Side Issue Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 15:57:49 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Never heard of it in reference to physicals, only locomotives. Also never new officials took physicals......even today they are not subject to random drug tests. FYI When the monthly inspections went from 30 to 92 days we (engine service) lost a lot of work gathering due engines up for inspection............................boomer ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; ; Sent: Thursday, March 03, 2005 3:37 PM Subject: Re: [PRR] Power usage - Side Issue > > In a message dated 3/3/05 6:41:52 PM, bvolkmer@herzogcompanies.com writes: > >> They had to keep track of the "due" dates for Monthly >>inspections > > > ************ > > Long after the departure of steam, these were still called "boiler > washes." > In fact, the annual physical that many Pennsy executives had to take were > called "boiler washes." > > Is the term "boiler wash" still used today to mean personal physical > examination? > > Regards, Marty > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Larry Reynolds" Subject: Re: [PRR] Bethlehem Car Works PRR Parlor Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 17:25:17 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Chris: I have the kit for "Matchless". I believe this is the parlor car you're referring to. If you give me your address, off list, I'll be glad to copy the instructions and mail them to you. (Some day I'm going to build this kit) Regards, Larry Reynolds ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chany, Christopher" To: "PRR" Sent: Monday, February 28, 2005 3:23 PM Subject: [PRR] Bethlehem Car Works PRR Parlor > Listers, > > Anyone have a copy of the instructions for the Bethlehem Car Works PRR > heavyweight Parlor car that uses brass sides? > > Thanks > > Chris Chany > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Message-Id: <35e0f88c492a047bcf60a8d298806aca@pennsyrr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed To: PRR-talk From: Jerry @ Pennsy Subject: [PRR] Eastern Car Works Update Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 19:52:18 -0500 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net A few weeks ago Eastern Car Works was active in our subject matter. Their status was voiced as "unknown". I had indicated that supply of their product in the wholesale channel had pretty much dried up. Well, after four months of backorders, last week one of my distributors came through with a decent shipment. I all but filled all of my outstanding customer orders. Today I received a significant shipment from another distributor. Now I am caught up and slightly ahead... finally! Yes, ECW has a pulse!!! ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS jerry@pennsyrr.com Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: John Frantz Subject: [PRR] N Scale GP9b Progress Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 07:19:26 -0500 X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at suscom.net Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Listers, For your viewing and modeling pleasure I posted some pictures of my 95% done N scale GP9b model. Things to do after these pictures are shown, is to add spark arrestors, and a single Leslie "Blat" horn. All modifications are noted on the webpage. This is the first of 3 I plan on modeling. http://www.mountvernonshops.com/Models.html Best Regards, John York, PA Crossroads of the Pennsylvania Railroad, Western Maryland, and Maryland & Pennsylvania. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Chany, Christopher" Subject: RE: [PRR] N Scale GP9b Progress Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 07:56:16 -0500 From: John Frantz [mailto:johnf2384@suscom.net] Subject: [PRR] N Scale GP9b Progress From: Subject: [PRR] Re: PRR-Talk Digest - 03/04/05 Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 11:39:28 -0600 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Bill, Was that the purpose for the seperate Middle Div and Pitt Div engine storage tracks in the East Altoona Engine Facility? They were stored there awaiting assignment? Thanks, Ron > Subject: RE: [PRR] Power usage > From: "Bill Volkmer" > Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 12:38:34 -0600 > > There was a diesel bureau in Philadelphia that assigned power to the > trains systemwide. They had to keep track of the "due" dates for Monthly > inspections and had to make sure, for example, that a GP9 making a turn > in Chicago and due for MI in Enola the next day, was not dispatched to > Logansport. > > The power bureau also had to look ahead at the anticipated tonnage in a > particular direction which accounted for the need to frequently operate > lite engine moves in the electrified territory. > > I believe that the steam locos were all assigned to a particular > division and there was no opportunity for them to stray more than one > division point away from their assigned maintenance base. Thus a > locomotive at, say, Enola that was assigned to East Altoona, would not > be assigned to a train going to Buffalo. > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5.7226.0 Subject: [PRR] RE: PRR-Talk Digest - 03/04/05 Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 12:49:01 -0600 Message-ID: <2261A19CD8CAD8449EFD62CAA311A748D1290F@EXCHANGE.herzogcompanies.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: PRR-Talk Digest - 03/04/05 thread-index: AcUg4R6TnApPqSCiRgmiX98cu5P5wAACYogw From: "Bill Volkmer" To: , "PRR-Talk" Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net I would assume that is a correct assumption. The J-1s were not allowed east of Altoona. I guess the Bald Eagle trains got Middle Division power but they were all retired by the time I arrived on the scene. -----Original Message----- From: rkweinland@charter.net [mailto:rkweinland@charter.net]=20 Sent: Friday, March 04, 2005 12:39 PM To: PRR-Talk Cc: Bill Volkmer Subject: Re: PRR-Talk Digest - 03/04/05 Bill, Was that the purpose for the seperate Middle Div and Pitt Div engine storage tracks in the East Altoona Engine Facility? They were stored there awaiting assignment? Thanks, Ron > Subject: RE: [PRR] Power usage > From: "Bill Volkmer" > Date: Thu, 3 Mar 2005 12:38:34 -0600 >=20 > There was a diesel bureau in Philadelphia that assigned power to the > trains systemwide. They had to keep track of the "due" dates for Monthly > inspections and had to make sure, for example, that a GP9 making a turn > in Chicago and due for MI in Enola the next day, was not dispatched to > Logansport. >=20 > The power bureau also had to look ahead at the anticipated tonnage in a > particular direction which accounted for the need to frequently operate > lite engine moves in the electrified territory. >=20 > I believe that the steam locos were all assigned to a particular > division and there was no opportunity for them to stray more than one > division point away from their assigned maintenance base. Thus a > locomotive at, say, Enola that was assigned to East Altoona, would not > be assigned to a train going to Buffalo. >=20 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Ted Andrews" Subject: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 19:58:16 +0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5.7226.0 Subject: RE: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 14:16:30 -0600 Message-ID: <2261A19CD8CAD8449EFD62CAA311A748D1293A@EXCHANGE.herzogcompanies.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy thread-index: AcUg9l7Ea3eg5fWSRwyxi04DlG+/mgAAIiNw From: "Bill Volkmer" To: "Ted Andrews" , Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net I am not sure UPS even existed in 1968. The "UPS" of the day was REA which did business in Green, not Brown. WDV -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Ted Andrews Sent: Friday, March 04, 2005 2:58 PM To: prr-talk@dsop.com Subject: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy Listers: Were UPS trailers ever seen on Pennsy trains? Was UPS using piggyback=20 service before 1968? Thanks! Ted ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Cc: "Ted Andrews" , From: Jerry @ Pennsy Subject: Re: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 15:23:01 -0500 To: "Bill Volkmer" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net On Mar 4, 2005, at 3:16 PM, Bill Volkmer wrote: > I am not sure UPS even existed in 1968. The "UPS" of the day was REA > which did business in Green, not Brown. That was my first thought also... so I checked the authoritative source... http://www.ups.com/content/corp/about/index.html Founded in 1907!!! I've never seen their trailers in photos of TrucTrains, thought that doesn't mean it didn't happen. Also possible they didn't own the larger trailers -- perhaps owning only local delivery trucks -- and leased generic trailers that travelled by rail. ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS jerry@pennsyrr.com Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Ted Andrews" Subject: Re: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 20:42:18 +0000 From: ndbprr@att.net Subject: Re: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 21:08:24 +0000 X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net A little off subject but I had a friend who worked in long distance moves for North American Van Lines and I asked why they didn't use trains for cross country moves. he said they tried it but the slack action destroyed most of the load and the claims were astornomical. Maybe that is why UPS never went in for it. Now that slack action is minimized it may have changed their thinking. -------------- Original message from Jerry @ Pennsy : -------------- > On Mar 4, 2005, at 3:16 PM, Bill Volkmer wrote: > > > I am not sure UPS even existed in 1968. The "UPS" of the day was REA > > which did business in Green, not Brown. > > That was my first thought also... so I checked the authoritative > source... > > http://www.ups.com/content/corp/about/index.html > > Founded in 1907!!! > > I've never seen their trailers in photos of TrucTrains, thought that > doesn't mean it didn't happen. Also possible they didn't own the larger > trailers -- perhaps owning only local delivery trucks -- and leased > generic trailers that travelled by rail. > ----------------------------------------------------------- > Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS jerry@pennsyrr.com > Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. > "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! > http://kc.pennsyrr.com > "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... > http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Jeff Toreki" Subject: RE: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 15:07:49 -0600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 In-Reply-To: Thread-Index: AcUg+wCqaVCNnMOkQsOoST6+5B3EIwAAlAzw Message-ID: <1102151772-1653530@dsop.com> Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net I recall reading somewhere that at that time UPS had a contract with EL/N&W for East/West feeder shipments between NY and Chicago, so you probably wouldn't have seen any of their trailers on PRR. Jeff > -----Original Message----- > From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Ted Andrews > Sent: Friday, March 04, 2005 2:42 PM > To: jerry@pennsyrr.com; bvolkmer@herzogcompanies.com > Cc: prr-talk@dsop.com > Subject: Re: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy > > Jerry wrote: > > ..."Also possible they didn't own the larger trailers -- perhaps owning only > local delivery trucks -- and > leased generic trailers that travelled by rail." > > That is what I was suspected too. I just was not sure. > > Ted > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Al Buchan" Subject: RE: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 16:21:16 -0500 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Will, et al., >From my book on the E&P, which hopefully will finally be published one day.. Al "In 1918, the federal government, having already gained control of the railroads through the United States Railroad Administration (USRA), decided to also extend its control over the express business. So, on May 28, 1918, the operating express companies of the day - Adams, American, Southern, Wells-Fargo and the express subsidiaries of the Great Northern, Northern Pacific, and SOO Line were merged into the Consolidated Express Company. This name was short-lived and was changed to the American Railway Express Company (ARE). On June 28, 1918, ARE became the sole express operator on the American railroads. On March 1, 1929 the old USRA contracts with ARE expired and the Railway Express Agency, Inc. (REA), a private company owned cooperatively by the railroads, was formed to take over the business of and acquire the assets of ARE. On August 1, 1938, REA purchased the Southeastern Express Company, which had operated over lines of several southern railroads and was the only other company at that time engaged in the rail express business. REA was designed to attract time sensitive and high value package freight and its traffic moved almost exclusively on solid mail-express trains or as head-end traffic on passenger trains. When passenger began disappearing ca. 1959, REA established its own truck routes as replacements. Its primary competitor was Parcel Post and United Parcel Service but REA accepted larger packages than the post office and also accepted "labeled" commodities such as fireworks, which the post office didn't. REA loaded solid cars from major points to break bulk at other points and performed all of their own transfer service. On local trains they had all of or a portion of a head-end car staffed by a messenger who handled the on and off shipments. REA also operated refrigerator cars in some passenger trains for high priority perishables. However, the railroad handled milk through their baggage operations. In later years they were in the trailer leasing business with reporting marks REAZ. In many small towns that could not support a separate full-time REA staff, the railroad agent also represented the express company. Those agents worked on a commission basis getting ten percent of the gross sale with a few minor exceptions. On the later day E&P this arrangement applied to Wheatland, Jamestown and Linesville. In June 1970 the REA changed its name to REA Express Inc., disassociated itself with the railroads and became involved in the air express business. In 1974 the Civil Aeronautics Board ordered them out of air express operations, which by then accounted for two-thirds of its business. REA Express filed for Chapter 11 on February 18, 1975, and was liquidated on November 11, 1975." ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: bobsin@nac.net Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 16:37:18 -0500 Subject: RE: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy From: "Gregg Mahlkov" Subject: Re: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 16:34:36 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net List, UPS was United Parcel Service and initially was the delivery service used by department stores to deliver to customer's homes. Many of you are probably too young to remember when K-Mart and Wal-Mart did not exist. Many grocery stores delivered your groceries not to the car, but to your house, free. Same with department stores. I grew up on Long Island, and if you shopped in Manhattan you had to pay 3 percent sales tax, unless you had the department store deliver to your house on Long Island (by UPS), in which case the sales tax did not apply. When the ICC ruled that REA could not engage in transportation without using railroads for at least part of the haul, UPS applied for and received authority to transport parcels under 70 lbs. nationally. Amtrak absolutely killed REA, as its service was depended on passenger trains. Gregg Mahlkov ----- Original Message ----- From: "Will Enser" To: Sent: Friday, March 04, 2005 4:06 PM Subject: RE: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy > > Can anyone give me a timeline of the REA. When did it actually disappear? > Did it actually "become" UPS or did UPS come after REA was already gone? > Everything I have seen says that REA just sort of "faded" away and UPS > came on the scene after that > > Are there any good books that covers the REA? > > Thanks > > Will in Buffalo > > > On Fri, 4 Mar 2005, Bill Volkmer wrote: > >> I am not sure UPS even existed in 1968. The "UPS" of the day was REA >> which did business in Green, not Brown. >> >> WDV >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Ted >> Andrews >> Sent: Friday, March 04, 2005 2:58 PM >> To: prr-talk@dsop.com >> Subject: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy >> >> Listers: >> >> Were UPS trailers ever seen on Pennsy trains? Was UPS using piggyback >> service before 1968? >> >> Thanks! >> >> Ted >> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: KEMACPRR@aol.com Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 16:56:03 EST Subject: Re: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net My first job after high school back in 1967 was in a local speed shop in Berwyn Pa. We used UPS daily to send mail order items out all over the U.S. They did have the brown delivery vans back then but have no recollection of any over the road trucks or rail use. ------------------Ken McCorry ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 16:56:36 -0500 (EST) From: Will Enser Subject: RE: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy From: "Rob Schoenberg" Subject: RE: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 17:39:52 -0500 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <142.40d5332c.2f5a3373@aol.com> X-PMX-Version: 4.7.1.128075, Antispam-Engine: 2.0.3.0, Antispam-Data: 2005.3.4.14 X-PerlMx-Spam: Gauge=IIIIIII, Probability=7%, Report='__CT 0, __CTE 0, __CTYPE_CHARSET_QUOTED 0, __CT_TEXT_PLAIN 0, __HAS_MSGID 0, __HAS_MSMAIL_PRI 0, __HAS_X_MAILER 0, __HAS_X_PRIORITY 0, __MIME_VERSION 0, __SANE_MSGID 0' Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net UPS started shipping their own trailers on the EL starting sometime around 1970. An EL fan friend mentioned that they used third party trailers over the EL before that but he's not sure of the start date. Rob -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com]On Behalf Of KEMACPRR@aol.com Sent: Friday, March 04, 2005 4:56 PM To: PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy My first job after high school back in 1967 was in a local speed shop in Berwyn Pa. We used UPS daily to send mail order items out all over the U.S. They did have the brown delivery vans back then but have no recollection of any over the road trucks or rail use. ------------------Ken McCorry ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: k4sb@niia.net Subject: RE: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 22:51:24 -0000 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net See: http://www=2Eups=2Ecom/content/us/en/about/ UPS has been around nearly 100 years! REA History: http://www=2Etrains=2Ecom/Content/Dynamic/Articles/000/000/003/132swiza=2E= as p Ken Paste both lines > > >---- Original Message ---- >From: alcoman@net=2Ebluemoon=2Enet >To: prr-talk@dsop=2Ecom >Subject: RE: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy >Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 16:06:03 -0500 (EST) > >> >>Can anyone give me a timeline of the REA=2E When did it actually >disappear=3F=20 >>Did it actually "become" UPS or did UPS come after REA was already >gone=3F=20 >>Everything I have seen says that REA just sort of "faded" away and >UPS=20 >>came on the scene after that >> >>Are there any good books that covers the REA=3F >> >>Thanks >> >>Will in Buffalo >> >> >>On Fri, 4 Mar 2005, Bill Volkmer wrote: >> >>> I am not sure UPS even existed in 1968=2E The "UPS" of the day was >REA >>> which did business in Green, not Brown=2E >>> >>> WDV >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: PRR-Talk@dsop=2Ecom [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop=2Ecom] On Behalf Of >Ted >>> Andrews >>> Sent: Friday, March 04, 2005 2:58 PM >>> To: prr-talk@dsop=2Ecom >>> Subject: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy >>> >>> Listers: >>> >>> Were UPS trailers ever seen on Pennsy trains=3F Was UPS using >piggyback >>> service before 1968=3F >>> >>> Thanks! >>> >>> Ted >>> >>-------------------------------------------------------------------- >--- >>For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists=2Edsop=2Ecom=2E= >> >> ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: RDG2124@aol.com Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 22:00:26 EST Subject: RE: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Just for the record, United Parcel Service began in 1907 in Seattle, WA as a messenger service. It later expanded to parcels serving the commercial sector (retailers). In 1952 UPS expanded into the common carrier service to tap both the commercial and private sectors. 1975 was the company's "Hallmark Year" when it was granted permission for interstate service. That year was when "Brown" became a familiar coast-to-coast sight on the nations highways. Prior to that, interstate parcels were primarily in the hands of contract cartage companies and could change carriers several times to get to the final destination. They also tried air parcel service in 1929 using commercial carriers but the Depression killed the service the same year. In 1952 or 1954 (cob webs here), the air parcel service was again instituted again using commercial carriers for it parcels. In 1981 UPS bought their first plane. There were UPS deliver trucks but where there UPS semis on the highways before 1975? There were but only in intrastate service. Will have to do some serious research here to pin down the dates UPS semi vans hit the rails. Evan Leisey RCT&HS 346 PRRT&HS 7487 PRRT&HS (Phila.) 2036 CNJ 2003 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 04 Mar 2005 20:14:42 -0700 From: Sandra & Peter Dawes Subject: Fw: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Sandra & Peter Dawes=20 To: Rob Schoenberg=20 Sent: March 4, 2005 5:08 PM Subject: Re: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy Interesting post, Rob, regarding the E-L and its involvement with UPS. Your posts, and the earlier ones by Greg and Al on the ARE Co., rang a = bell. I have the August 1928 Official Guide of the Railways, and there = is this note at the bottom of page 141 in the Eire section: AMERICAN RAILWAY EXPRESS COMPANY The express package service of the Erie Railroad is handled by the = American Railway Express Company. In addition to the express cars on = regular passenger trains, the Eire operates American Railway Express = Trains 13 and 14, as below: Train 13 leaves Jersey City, "Daylight Saving" time, 11 30 p.m. ... = [lists intermediate points]... arrives Chicago 1 30 a.m. Central time. = Train 14 leaves Chicago, Central time, 12 35 p.m. ... [lists = intermediate points] ... arrives Jersey City 12 30 a.m., "Daylight = Saving" time. There is no indication of frequency, so these trains probably ran daily. = Apparently, Jersey City was on "Daylight Saving" time; all the other = places on Standard time, and this note, as well as the actual Eire = tables in this Guide, reflects this. Does anyone recall ever seeing the schedules of other dedicated parcel = express trains (meaning no passengers handled) mentioned in the Guide, = or in public timetables? Peter Dawes=20 ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Rob Schoenberg=20 To: KEMACPRR@aol.com ; PRR-Talk@dsop.com=20 Sent: March 4, 2005 3:39 PM Subject: RE: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy UPS started shipping their own trailers on the EL starting sometime = around 1970. An EL fan friend mentioned that they used third party trailers = over the EL before that but he's not sure of the start date. Rob -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com]On Behalf Of KEMACPRR@aol.com Sent: Friday, March 04, 2005 4:56 PM To: PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy My first job after high school back in 1967 was in a local speed shop = in Berwyn Pa. We used UPS daily to send mail order items out all over the = U.S. They did have the brown delivery vans back then but have no recollection of = any over the road trucks or rail use. ------------------Ken McCorry = ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. = ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: RDG2124@aol.com Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 22:59:10 EST Subject: [PRR] REA - and the Pennsy X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net REA Timeline: In 1929 sixty-nine railroads purchased American Railway Express Co. then organized the Railway Express Agency on March 1, 1929. Only the Southern Railway's Southeastern Express Co. remained independent until 1938 when it was absorbed by REA. REA declared bankruptcy Feb. 1, 1975 and was liquidated the same year. There were originally one thousand shares of stock divided amongst the owning railroads on a revenue generating basis. The PRR received over one hundred of these shares. Also, none owner railroads were allowed to participate via routing agreements. RAILWAY EXPRESS An Overview by Victor S. Roseman is an excellent book on the REA. Copyrighted 1992 by Rocky Mountain Publishing, Inc. ISBN 0-9612692-5-1 There supposedly is a "complete" book on the REA being written by a gentlemen in North (or is it South) Carolina, but have heard nothing of this book's progress for a few years. Evan Leisey RCT&HS 346 PRRT&HS 7487 PRRT&HS (Phila.) 2036 CNJ 2005 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 23:59:39 -0800 (PST) From: kenneth broomfield Subject: [PRR] Steam Engine Couplers and other things. Date: Sat, 5 Mar 2005 00:10:41 -0800 (PST) From: kenneth broomfield Subject: RE: [PRR] UPS and the Pennsy From: "Dominic Mazoch" Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2005 01:30:07 GMT Subject: [PRR] REA From: "Dominic Mazoch" Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2005 01:38:18 GMT Subject: [PRR] UPS From: Prr1187@aol.com Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2005 12:17:49 EST Subject: Re: [PRR] diner and kitchen car X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net The two PRR cars: full length diner kitchen/dormitory are available in plastic sides from Laser Horizons to be used with core kits like those from Train Station Products and Eastern Car Works. Regards, Dennis Sautters PRRT&HS 1974 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: RickTipton@aol.com Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2005 12:26:03 EST Subject: [PRR] ARE and REA X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net In a message dated 3/5/2005 1:11:56 AM Eastern Standard Time, PRR-Talk@dsop.com writes: Subject: REA - and the Pennsy From: Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 22:59:10 EST REA Timeline: In 1929 sixty-nine railroads purchased American Railway Express Co. then organized the Railway Express Agency on March 1, 1929. Only the Southern Railway's Southeastern Express Co. remained independent until 1938 when it was absorbed by REA. REA declared bankruptcy Feb. 1, 1975 and was liquidated the same year. ARE had absorbed all the other express companies (e.g. Adams on the Pennsy) by the Twenties. With motor carrier competition and the Post Office's parcel post operations, ARE's margins were being squeezed. The American Railway Express Company knew before 1929 that the profit was exiting the railroad express business. Thus, they did what good businessmen do -- they sold Railway Express Agency off to the "sixty-nine suckers," changed the company name to American Express, and expanded their financial services, such as travelers' checks. Being married to the passenger train, once Amtrak arrived, Railway Express was in big trouble. REA's been gone for 30 years, but American Express is still pelting me with ads for their @#$$#$# card! I count this 1929 sale and the highly advantageous 1869 lease of the Little Miami Railroad to the supposedly intelligent Pennsy interests as two of the greatest con games in railroad history... The PRR was led by smart operators. But even they could be had from time to time... Rick Tipton - Louisville Kentucky Pennsylvania Railroad Technical & Historical Society Remembering the Pennsylvania Railroad and PRR Lines West of Pittsburgh ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Lee French" Subject: [PRR] Buttonwood Train Yard Wilkes Barre Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2005 17:17:05 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Looking for anyone with pictures or who may have worked/visited the PRR = Buttonwood yard. My relative John Curran worked there for many years = with the PRR, and would be interested in corresponding with anyone who = worked there during that same time frame. Also, the Keystone Crossing site yard diagrams show the ice = house/station near the north western end of the yard, is this where the = stock pens were also located? I believe so, but would like to confirm. Tks for any help it. Lyinel ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: RickTipton@aol.com Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2005 12:26:03 EST Subject: [PRR-FAX] ARE and REA In a message dated 3/5/2005 1:11:56 AM Eastern Standard Time, PRR-Talk@dsop.com writes: Subject: REA - and the Pennsy From: Date: Fri, 4 Mar 2005 22:59:10 EST REA Timeline: In 1929 sixty-nine railroads purchased American Railway Express Co. then organized the Railway Express Agency on March 1, 1929. Only the Southern Railway's Southeastern Express Co. remained independent until 1938 when it was absorbed by REA. REA declared bankruptcy Feb. 1, 1975 and was liquidated the same year. ARE had absorbed all the other express companies (e.g. Adams on the Pennsy) by the Twenties. With motor carrier competition and the Post Office's parcel post operations, ARE's margins were being squeezed. The American Railway Express Company knew before 1929 that the profit was exiting the railroad express business. Thus, they did what good businessmen do -- they sold Railway Express Agency off to the "sixty-nine suckers," changed the company name to American Express, and expanded their financial services, such as travelers' checks. Being married to the passenger train, once Amtrak arrived, Railway Express was in big trouble. REA's been gone for 30 years, but American Express is still pelting me with ads for their @#$$#$# card! I count this 1929 sale and the highly advantageous 1869 lease of the Little Miami Railroad to the supposedly intelligent Pennsy interests as two of the greatest con games in railroad history... The PRR was led by smart operators. But even they could be had from time to time... Rick Tipton - Louisville Kentucky Pennsylvania Railroad Technical & Historical Society Remembering the Pennsylvania Railroad and PRR Lines West of Pittsburgh ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> In low income neighborhoods, 84% do not own computers. At Network for Good, help bridge the Digital Divide! http://us.click.yahoo.com/EpW3eD/3MnJAA/cosFAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PRR/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: PRR-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Benjamin Hom" Subject: [PRR] The Keystone Modeler - March 2005 Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2005 18:31:33 -0500 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook CWS, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net The March 2005 issue of The Keystone Modeler is available at http://www.prrths.com/Keystone%20Modeler/TKM_Images/Keystone_Modeler_NO20_fi les/TKM%20No.%2020%2003-05%20PDF.pdf Articles of interest include: - Modeling Activities Planned for the 2005 Annual Meeting - Pennsylvania Railroad Class K7A Stock Cars - Broadway Limited Imports K7A Review - Modifying the Broadway Limited Imports K7A - Modeling the Pennsylvania Railroad’s Gondola Fleet Part 13 - G33’s - Locomotive and Tender Electric Marker Lamps Part 2 - Clawfoot Arrangement Drawings for Locomotives - 37th Annual Meeting Program and Registration Forms Ben Hom ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 09:06:48 +0000 From: "John H. Wright" Subject: [PRR] USA 2004 .... pics uploaded Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Just uploaded a big pile of photos from last year's trip to the USA .... Ohio, Indiana, Michigan & Ontario. Subjects include: PRRTHS meeting at Cincinnati : numerous shots including the Railroad Museum where 'they' left me behind for 5 hours. A day at Fostoria, OH Railroad Museums ... Whitewater Valley, Elkhart, Nobelsville Layouts .... Jerry Macri, Doug Tagshold, the Blissfield MRC Short Line .... the Connellsville & Newcastle plus its huge collection of old diesels awaiting repair. Dayton USAF museum Lima NKP display Sarnia yard, Ontario and bits of miscellaneous stuff Go to: http://www.xclent.freeuk.com and click on the 'Scrapbook' button Have fun -- Regards, John H. Wright Washington, England ( Home of the Lucky Wax Dog in a Basket ) Web Site: http://www.xclent.freeuk.con Visit Andy Reichert's Proto 87 Stores: http://www.proto87stores.com -- Internal Virus Database is out-of-date. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.5.1 - Release Date: 27/02/2005 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Message-Id: <7eeeb961fb54d94df2a0d82ef745217c@pennsyrr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed To: PRR-talk From: Jerry @ Pennsy Subject: [PRR] PRRT&HS Annual Meeting Layout Tours Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 06:34:02 -0500 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net The March issue of "The Keystone Modeler" contains information about the Society's annual meeting in May. There is some inaccurate, though not bad, information about the layout tours. It indicates that on Sunday tours run from "Noon to 3 p.m." In fact, tours run from noon through 5 p.m. Most are noon through 4 p.m., but as you get farther from Camp Hill, there are a few that will be open later. This will allow a "logical plan of attack" on the part of the traveller to get in as many layouts as possible on their way home. There is also a comment about the registration for the "sign up required" operating sessions on Saturday. In fact, the layouts involved are still working out the details, so the information in the TKM is premature. The layout tour information will be available online by mid-April so you can preview the schedule and the layouts, many of which have excellent web sites. All for now... ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS jerry@pennsyrr.com Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Dominic Mazoch" Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 12:16:58 GMT Subject: [PRR] Little Miami RR From: "Dominic Mazoch" Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 12:17:12 GMT Subject: [PRR] Little Miami RR Cc: Conrail-Talk LIST From: Jerry Britton Subject: [PRR] Train Show in Harrisburg This Saturday (3/12/05) Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 07:48:36 -0500 To: PRR-Talk LIST X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net For those of you in the greater Harrisburg (Pa.) area, the Harrisburg Chapter of the National Railway Historical Society (NRHS) sponsors its 19th Annual Railroad Show and Collectors Market. The show runs 9 a.m. to 3 p.m. at the I.W. Abel Unnion Hall (Steelworkers Union) at 200 Gibson Street, Steelton, PA 17113. It's one mile south of I-83 in Harrisburg; use exit 44B, south on 19th Street. Donation at door: $4. Children under 12: Free. There will be railroad/railroadiana vendors, on-site layouts, movies, and workshops and seminars. (This is no Timonium, but if you are close and you want to do "the train thing" it's not a bad place to be!) I'll be there, with two tables, under the "PENNSYRR.COM" sign. Stop by and say hello! ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Al Buchan" Subject: RE: [PRR] PRRT&HS Annual Meeting Layout Tours Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 08:49:48 -0500 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 In-Reply-To: <7eeeb961fb54d94df2a0d82ef745217c@pennsyrr.com> Importance: Normal Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Re: There is some inaccurate, though not bad, information about the layout tours. Thanx for the layout update. That's one of the reasons the schedule sez - "Schedule and locations subject to change." Unfortunately, we also now have one presenter that cannot show up but his program will still go on. Al ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Message-Id: <2b8d4711df293de1fe20e41536c53667@vetmed.auburn.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed To: PRR talk From: Bruce Smith Subject: [PRR] Ashtabula, 1941 Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 08:01:57 -0600 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Morning Folks, Tim O'Connner posted this link to the STMFC list. I couldn't pass it up! http://webapp1.dlib.indiana.edu/collections/cushman/full/P02410.jpg We were talking about variety in PRR hopper trains... There is an H22 along with some H21As and a variety of gons in he empties yard. In the loads yard you can see a GLC/GLCA, H21A, GLA (?), and GS and GR series gons. Also, look at the weathering variations, from the nearly new paint on the GLC to some pretty beat cars! BTW, the search engine for this collection is at: http://webapp1.dlib.indiana.edu/cushman/search/index.jsp Regards Bruce Bruce F. Smith Auburn, AL http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/ "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin __ / \ __<+--+>________________\__/___ ________________________________ |- ______/ O O \_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ | | / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 \ | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__|| |/_____________________________\|_|________________________________| | O--O \0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed To: PRR-Talk LIST From: Jerry Britton Subject: [PRR] Annual Meeting Op Sessions Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 09:40:13 -0500 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net As you know, the program and registration materials for the PRRT&HS annual meeting have been released. I'm organizing the layout tours and we should have the layout tour guide available online in about four weeks for your planning purposes. It will be printed for attendees. We have three layouts open for Friday night (7 - 9) and nine open for Sunday afternoon (noon - 5). I'm please to say that we are also trying something new, with the blessing of the BoD... operating sessions on Saturday afternoon! The op sessions are planned to allow the novice to experience what an op session involves... wearing a headset (or using telephones), using a throttle, and performing a task (such as running a through train or switching cars using car cards). Regular crew on the respective layouts will mentor the participants. Because the mentor/participant arrangement will result in a lot of bodies in a basement, these op sessions will require sign-ups in advance, and only those that sign-up will be permitted to attend. There will be no option for spectators. The op sessions will be Saturday afternoon and will last for several hours. If you attend an op session, you will be missing the opportunity to attend the following events back at the annual meeting venue... 1:00-3:00 The PRR in Renovo - Greg Stone 3:15-5:00 Modeling Committee Forum - Elden Gatwood Op sessions would be over by late afternoon, so there would be no conflict with the banquet. The exact sign-up process is still being worked out, but the layouts involved have asked me to gauge interest. If you would be interested in participating, please e-mail me privately. And note that this DOES NOT denote signing up! ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: [PRR] A prototype for everything Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 10:23:42 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Note in the following jpeg the PRR box car on the left. It's a single door car with the door on the "wrong side"! Can anyone identify this car and its history? http://webapp1.dlib.indiana.edu/collections/cushman/full/P02405.jpg regards, Andy Miller ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Cc: "'PRR-Talk'" , From: Jerry Britton Subject: Re: [PRR] A prototype for everything Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 10:35:57 -0500 To: "Andy Miller" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net On Mar 7, 2005, at 10:23 AM, Andy Miller wrote: > Note in the following jpeg the PRR box car on the left. It's a single > door > car with the door on the "wrong side"! Can anyone identify this car > and its > history? > > http://webapp1.dlib.indiana.edu/collections/cushman/full/P02405.jpg > I don't think the door is backwards... I think the negative is!!! ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: b.hom@att.net Subject: Re: [PRR] A prototype for everything Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 15:39:03 +0000 From: b.hom@att.net Subject: Re: [PRR] A prototype for everything Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 15:43:01 +0000 Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 08:43:18 -0800 From: Ed Workman Subject: [PRR] Re: PRR-Talk Digest - 03/06/05 Cc: PRR talk From: Bill Subject: Re: [PRR] Ashtabula, 1941 Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 17:19:16 -0500 To: Bruce Smith X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net On Mar 7, 2005, at 9:01 AM, Bruce Smith wrote: > Morning Folks, > > Tim O'Connner posted this link to the STMFC list. I couldn't pass it > up! > http://webapp1.dlib.indiana.edu/collections/cushman/full/P02410.jpg > > We were talking about variety in PRR hopper trains... There is an H22 > along with some H21As and a variety of gons in he empties yard. In > the loads yard you can see a GLC/GLCA, H21A, GLA (?), and GS and GR > series gons. > > Also, look at the weathering variations, from the nearly new paint on > the GLC to some pretty beat cars! > > BTW, the search engine for this collection is at: > http://webapp1.dlib.indiana.edu/cushman/search/index.jsp > > Regards > Bruce > Bruce, Thanks a lot. Great stuff to come home to after a long day at work. Bill Morlitz ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 18:32:51 -0500 From: "Dr. Edmond L. Freed" Subject: [PRR] Inn Series Conversions to P85L Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Listers, Does anybody have a list of the car numbers assigned to the P85L's after they were converted from the "Inn" series cars? Even some of them would help if the list is not complete. Thanks for any help offered. Regards, Eddie Dr. Edmond L. Freed PRRT&HS # 156 Modeling Harrisburg & the C&PD in HO ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Dr. Edmond L. Freed" Date: Mon, 07 Mar 2005 18:32:51 -0500 Subject: [PRR-FAX] Inn Series Conversions to P85L Listers, Does anybody have a list of the car numbers assigned to the P85L's after they were converted from the "Inn" series cars? Even some of them would help if the list is not complete. Thanks for any help offered. Regards, Eddie Dr. Edmond L. Freed PRRT&HS # 156 Modeling Harrisburg & the C&PD in HO ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> What would our lives be like without music, dance, and theater? Donate or volunteer in the arts today at Network for Good! http://us.click.yahoo.com/Tcy2bD/SOnJAA/cosFAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PRR/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: PRR-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed To: PRR-talk From: Jerry @ Pennsy Subject: [PRR] InterMountain PRR Structures Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 20:03:12 -0500 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net In the March releases from InterMountain, posted today, are two structure kits for the Pennsylvania Railroad. One is called "Lineside Structures" and the other is "Interlocking Cabin". Unfortunately, IM has not detailed "what" they are exactly. I was asked for an opinion several months ago about several options they were considering, based on drawings in the Jeff Serb books, but I am as yet unaware of what their final selections were. Now that the announcement is public, anyone out there "in the know"? ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS jerry@pennsyrr.com Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed To: PRR-talk From: Jerry @ Pennsy Subject: [PRR] InterMountain P85b's -- Second Run Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 20:04:36 -0500 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Forgot to mention in my last post... Among InterMountain's March releases is the second run of the HO scale P85b's in PENNSYLVANIA scheme... in another 12 road numbers. They'll arrive in about three weeks. ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS jerry@pennsyrr.com Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Message-Id: <90df7de0b1c701bc7e74e31b43fac216@pennsyrr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed To: PRR-talk From: Jerry @ Pennsy Subject: [PRR] NMRA Calendar / PRR / 2007 Annual Meeting Date: Mon, 7 Mar 2005 20:08:47 -0500 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: eclipse.net Today, for the first time, I was looking ahead on the 2005 NMRA calendar. I was amazed to discover that there were PRR layout photos for 3 of the 12 months! There was also an additional photo of PRR. I was further amazed to see that three pics came from two layouts and that the photo credit for all three was from Greensburg, Pa. So my next speculation is, since the 2007 annual meeting is in Greensburg, does the Pittsburgh Chapter know of these guys in order to arrange layout tours with them? A fourth picture was Dave Johnson's layout out in Solon, Oh. Hmmm, close enough to the annual meeting for a road trip? And then there's Bob McKay, in DuBois, in N scale... now how far away is that from Greensburg? There I go, planning waaaay to far ahead again! ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS jerry@pennsyrr.com Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchan