From: abendschein@comcast.net Subject: [PRR] PRR Calendars - Equivalent Years Date: Wed, 01 Dec 2004 03:37:31 +0000 From: "Ted Andrews" Subject: [PRR] Steam Locomotive Engineers question Date: Wed, 1 Dec 2004 00:24:01 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com PRR Listers: What all the neat PRR steam stuff that has come out in HO scale, which = model firm makes the best and most accurate engineer figures to be = placed in the cab?=20 PRR-specific, are there any engineer figures that would be more "Pennsy" = than others? I don't know if I would go as far as to ask if the Pennsy = had a dress code but did they? (vbg) TIA Ted Andrews ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: mittner@webtv.net (Gary Mittner) Date: Wed, 1 Dec 2004 07:25:38 -0500 Subject: Re: [PRR] Steam Locomotive Engineers question MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Ted, Here is a good photo of what I take as a typical PRR Crew. http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/jcrew.jpg Sadly, no good ones exsist in HO Scale that copies these guys.. Artista however makes some pretty good figures in O Scale.....Gary Come visit my PRR Pages: Photos, Models, Historical Items and Art Work! PRR K4s Loco Pics: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/ PRR G5s, T1, J1 J1a, M1, M1a, N1s, etc. etc.: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/prr_loco_index.html PRR N5c #477974 Restoration (ongoing) http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/BVJCN5c.html and...... PRR Pics, P&LE Pics, PRR Memorabilia and Misc. Models: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/indexpics.html ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: RDG2124@aol.com Date: Wed, 1 Dec 2004 09:11:50 EST Subject: Re: [PRR] UP power on NS X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Carl & List, UP power has been traveling east over the former Pennsy lines since Conrail. UP, SOO, CN and BNSF power has been showing up in Reading, Pa. for several years. To reach Reading it comes in from Harrisburg, Pa., which means it comes east on the mainline from Pittsburgh or sometimes off the north-south lines into Harrisburg. Just after the Conrail was split between NS and CSX, my brother took me for a visit to NS's Harrisburg Yard, across the Susquehanna River from Enola Yard. On one TOFC train coming up from Hagerstown, Md. there was a NS unit in the lead followed by a SOO unit and a BNSF unit. I know that UP units began showing up in Pa. during the first months of Conrail as my brother sent me a few snap shots of Conrail trains with foreign power taken at CP Valley. CP Valley is a heavily used junction for Philadelphia and New York City freight traveling east-west. Back in the "good old days" of the Pennsy, it was not uncommon for CB&Q units to be seen running in Pennsy trains through Harrisburg. Evan Leisey RCT&HS 346 PRRT&HS 7487 PRRT&HS (Phila.) 2036 CNJ 2003 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: RDG2124@aol.com Date: Wed, 1 Dec 2004 09:17:41 EST Subject: [PRR] Steam Engineer & Fireman X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com LaBelle makes a but very nicely done engineer and fireman in HO. Also, check out Branchline's extensive line of figures as they may also make engine crew figures. Will check the local hobby shop for in-stock engine crewmen and post stock numbers if they fit the bill. Evan Leisey RCT&HS 346 PRRT&HS 7487 PRRT&HS (Phila.) 2036 CNJ 2003 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 1 Dec 2004 09:20:46 -0500 Subject: Re: [PRR] UP power on NS From: Jerry Britton In-Reply-To: Message-Id: <31160ECC-43A4-11D9-968C-000393835C88@pennsyrr.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com This subject is a bit too tangent to the intended topic at hand. Please discontinue or move discussion to an NS forum. Thanks. ---------------------------------------- Listmaster Desktop Solutions of Pennsylvania, Inc. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Personal" Subject: [PRR] Need Colors Date: Wed, 1 Dec 2004 09:47:14 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Dear Group, I would really appreciate some help. I am taking a Black & White picture that is on my computer, and wanting to add Tuscan Red & the PRR Green that most Diesels came in to the two Diesels in the picture by using Photoshop. Our Daughter is a very accomplished and noted Graphic Designer,=20 who said she would make it a color picture if I could get the = correct/exact Pennsy colors. This is not some kind of authentic anything, it is for my personal = enjoyment. When I get it done, I will post it for everyone's viewing. It is a very rare picture of something that never was, but it looks = really pretty. I paid to have it scanned and sent to me. The help I need from any of you is where can I get the most accurate = color paletts? I would appreciate your help. Website link, if applicable, would be = great. Best regards, Eric Trenga ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Cc: "PRR-Talk" From: Don Harper Subject: Re: [PRR] UP power on NS Date: Wed, 1 Dec 2004 09:09:25 -0600 To: "Carl Izzo" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) Return-Path: harperd@tamug.edu X-OriginalArrivalTime: 01 Dec 2004 15:12:49.0300 (UTC) FILETIME=[38603540:01C4D7B8] Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I photographed SP power at Rochester, on the Ft. Wayne line in the past. And on the 28th of Nov. I photographed two NS engines pulling a double stack through Alpine in West Texas, on the former SP east-west line. The RR companies lease power back and forth all the time. Don Harper Texas A&M Marine Lab 5007 Avenue U Galveston, TX 77551 409/740-4540 harperd@tamug.edu On Nov 30, 2004, at 8:26 PM, Carl Izzo wrote: > A friend claims to have seen Union Pacific Power pulling a train on > the NS mainline near Greensburg, PA. DId NS buy or lease UP > locomotives? > > Carl Izzo > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: MLiebeskin@aol.com Date: Wed, 1 Dec 2004 13:11:04 EST Subject: [PRR] Re: PRR-Talk Digest - 12/01/04: N&W on the PRR X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Al Staufer describes the arrival of a Class A on the PRR in one of his books, the name of which escapes me momentarily. John Liebeskind ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: ndbprr@att.net Subject: Re: [PRR] Re: PRR-Talk Digest - 12/01/04: N&W on the PRR Date: Wed, 01 Dec 2004 18:26:00 +0000 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com If I'm not mistaken I think Pennsy Power has a picture or two and the Ball book The PRR in the 40's and 50's has a fairly extensive disertation in the beginning regarding the testing of the A class on the PRR and the T1 on the N&W. Since I am in the middle of relocating neither is available to me at the moment. However they are two different topics as the Stauffer pictures are of the y-3's sold to the PRR (HH-1 class?) as I recall. Norm Bell -------------- Original message from MLiebeskin@aol.com: -------------- > Al Staufer describes the arrival of a Class A on the PRR in one of his > books, the name of which escapes me momentarily. John Liebeskind > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 01 Dec 2004 13:41:23 -0500 From: dave pierson Subject: [PRR] PRR On Milwaukee Road Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com PRR Trivia: What was the PRR Clearance Car doing in Montana? ca 1961, Milwaukee Rd embarked on a tunnel lowering project, for auto racks etc. As part of this effort, a PRR Clearance Car was leased to assist. Current 'Milwaukee Railroader' (MRHA magazine) has story of tunnel project, with extended sidebar on PRR 497125. http://www.mrha.com/ best dwp ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: dave pierson Date: Wed, 01 Dec 2004 13:41:23 -0500 Subject: [PRR-FAX] PRR On Milwaukee Road PRR Trivia: What was the PRR Clearance Car doing in Montana? ca 1961, Milwaukee Rd embarked on a tunnel lowering project, for auto racks etc. As part of this effort, a PRR Clearance Car was leased to assist. Current 'Milwaukee Railroader' (MRHA magazine) has story of tunnel project, with extended sidebar on PRR 497125. http://www.mrha.com/ best dwp ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PRR/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: PRR-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 01 Dec 2004 16:54:05 -0500 From: Drew McGhee Subject: Re: [PRR] What's not in Arranged Freight? From: Tom Kane Subject: [PRR] Re: N&W on the PRR Date: Wed, 1 Dec 2004 14:08:20 -0800 From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Subject: Re: [PRR] Re: PRR-Talk Digest - 12/01/04: N&W on the PRR From: RDG2124@aol.com Date: Wed, 1 Dec 2004 22:55:42 EST Subject: Re: [PRR] Re: PRR-Talk Digest - 12/01/04: N&W on the PRR X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com In Don Ball's book on the Pennsy of the 1940s -1950s, he describes the arrival of the N&W Class A loco at Altoona for testing. He goes into a little detail on about the Pennsy's reasons for not pursuing articulate locos. Evan Leisey RCT&HS 346 PRRT&HS 7487 PRRT&HS (Phila.) 2036 CNJ 2003 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: RickTipton@aol.com Date: Thu, 2 Dec 2004 00:20:54 EST Subject: [PRR] Re: PRR-Talk Digest - 12/01/04 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com In a message dated 12/1/04 1:12:08 AM Eastern Standard Time, PRR-Talk@dsop.com writes: > Subject: N&W Steam on PRR > From: "Robert Troop" > Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2004 01:32:00 -0500 > > During May 1943 the Pennsy purchased six 1919 vintage Norfolk &Western class > Y3, 2-8-8-2 Mallets and became PRR class HH1. Staufer's book Pennsy Power > indicates these spent the war years in transfer and hump duty at Enola. Later > they were transferred to Columbus. > > Bob > > Continuing the tradition of sending all the unusual stuff to Lines West. At least in Columbus they had plenty of other N&W power for company -- from little 4-8-0 Mastodons on up. Rick Tipton - Louisville KY Member, Pennsylvania Railroad Technical & Historical Society Remembering the Pennsylvania Railroad and especially PRR Lines West ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Walter Prusick" Subject: [PRR] Pennsy details Date: Thu, 2 Dec 2004 07:47:11 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Guys, Does anyone out there have a quick/easy/inexpensive way that they would like to share on fabricating the circular windows seen on Pennsy RPO and baggage car doors? (I'm kit bashing AHM's RPO following the article by Bob Kessler's article in the Nov '95 RMC.) Thanks ahead of time. Walt Prusick ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: mittner@webtv.net (Gary Mittner) Date: Thu, 2 Dec 2004 08:04:29 -0500 Subject: Re: [PRR] Pennsy details MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Walt, Is this a trick question? Just use a round drill bit instead of a square drill bit....... Actually this is what I did on my large scale N5c Cabin Car. I first drilled an appropriate sized whole for the window in the car side. Then I glued a small square sheet of styrene to the back side of the car side at the drilled out opening. Then with a tad smaller drill bit, drill another hole into the center of the first hole. This will give you a window with a window rim. I am guessing the Baggage windows were this type as well. No need for rivet detail as found on the N5c window, at least I don't think so....Gary Come visit my PRR Pages: Photos, Models, Historical Items and Art Work! PRR K4s Loco Pics: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/ PRR G5s, T1, J1 J1a, M1, M1a, N1s, etc. etc.: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/prr_loco_index.html PRR N5c #477974 Restoration (ongoing) http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/BVJCN5c.html and...... PRR Pics, P&LE Pics, PRR Memorabilia and Misc. Models: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/indexpics.html ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: RickTipton@aol.com Date: Thu, 2 Dec 2004 00:20:54 EST Subject: [PRR-FAX] Re: N&W Steam on PRR In a message dated 12/1/04 1:12:08 AM Eastern Standard Time, PRR-Talk@dsop.com writes: > Subject: N&W Steam on PRR > From: "Robert Troop" > Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2004 01:32:00 -0500 > > During May 1943 the Pennsy purchased six 1919 vintage Norfolk &Western class > Y3, 2-8-8-2 Mallets and became PRR class HH1. Staufer's book Pennsy Power > indicates these spent the war years in transfer and hump duty at Enola. Later > they were transferred to Columbus. > > Bob > > Continuing the tradition of sending all the unusual stuff to Lines West. At least in Columbus they had plenty of other N&W power for company -- from little 4-8-0 Mastodons on up. Rick Tipton - Louisville KY Member, Pennsylvania Railroad Technical & Historical Society Remembering the Pennsylvania Railroad and especially PRR Lines West [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PRR/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: PRR-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] Pennsy details Date: Thu, 2 Dec 2004 10:53:10 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-reply-to: <004301c4d86d$0bbbabe0$a6699b04@stargate.net> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcTYbVV1OQe1LXqZQUa6cWkXErFU4gAGUVjA Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I understand. If you use a prototypically thin door, drilling a clean hole is very difficult. Paper hole punches are available in a variety of sizes at good crafts stores. The office standard .25" hole is too big, but 3/16 should be about right. Anyone know the diameter of those round windows? regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Walter Prusick Sent: Thursday, December 02, 2004 7:47 AM To: PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: [PRR] Pennsy details Guys, Does anyone out there have a quick/easy/inexpensive way that they would like to share on fabricating the circular windows seen on Pennsy RPO and baggage car doors? (I'm kit bashing AHM's RPO following the article by Bob Kessler's article in the Nov '95 RMC.) Thanks ahead of time. Walt Prusick ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Thu, 2 Dec 2004 16:35:20 -0800 (PST) From: Doug Kisala Subject: [PRR] Steam to Diesel in New Jersey From: John Frantz Subject: [PRR] BLI K4s Headlight Date: Thu, 02 Dec 2004 22:38:04 -0500 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new .250 at suscom.net Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Listers, I just recieved my BLI K4s, undec w/slat pilot. I saw the=20 headlight cord was attached when shipped, but not inserted=20 into the boiler front. I know it was designed to ship like=20 this, but how does the headlight weave into the headlght=20 housing. It's obvious that the hole is big enough for it,=20 but without cutting a groove into either the boiler plate=20 or top of the smokebox i don't see how it would fit. Any help is appreciated. Until then i'll be running=20 unsafely for the railroad, sans-headlight. Regards, John ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Thu, 2 Dec 2004 19:50:34 -0800 (PST) From: Bill Daniels Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Headlight From: RDG2124@aol.com Date: Thu, 2 Dec 2004 23:15:21 EST Subject: [PRR] Engine Crew Figures X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com This is in response to a list member's request for steam loco crewmen. Precision Scale Co. - Engineer/fireman set 058531281, engineer alone 05855863, fireman alone 05855864. These must be Lines West crewmen as they are too slim for the Lines East engine crews (Have you ever seen a slim Pennsylvania Dutchman? ). The fireman is a little unusual in that he is holding a clipboard. Also, figures are unpainted metal and the engineer has his right arm as a separate piece so that it can be positioned. Branchline's Towns People - 0181101 Engine Bart and 0181114 Fireman Fred are very nice and painted. Fred is shoveling coal. Woodland Scenics - Did not have time to scope out this line but with all the new figure sets released in the past half year there are probably figures suitable for cabs. LaBelle - both steam and diesel loco crews prepainted. Evan Leisey RCT&HS 346 PRRT&HS 7487 PRRT&HS (Phila.) 2036 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Jerry Breon" Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Headlight Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 07:27:16 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I would just add to what Bill explained by mentioning that it is = probably best to get the headlight removal started by pushing on the = backside of the headlight mounting pins (they are in thru-holes and = exposed) with a small punch so as not to risk breaking them by pulling = on the plastic headlight casting. These suggestions, of course, refer to = the version with the headlight mounted on the smokebox front. The = versions with the headlight on top of the smokebox come from the factory = with the lamp already in place.=20 Jerry Breon Birdsboro, PA ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Bill Daniels=20 To: John Frantz ; = PRR-Talk@dsop.com=20 Sent: Thursday, December 02, 2004 10:50 PM Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Headlight John, The way you do this is to gently remove the headlight and bracket from the smokebox front. It is NOT glued in, just a snug fit. Once the headlight is off, run the bulb and wire through the hole in the smokebox, then put the bulb into the back of the headlight casting, then replace the casting back on the smokebox front. You can then mount the smokebox front onto the boiler (well, actually the smokebox). You should be good to go. Bill Daniels Tucson, AZ ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Walter Prusick" Subject: [PRR] Pennsy Details 2 Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 07:46:15 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Ok guys, First off let me thank you for your quick responses. Guess my quandry now has two parts: A) what is the diameter of said windows. All of the drawings show square/rectangular openings. B) I have 6 cars in the paint stripper and the only class of BM which follows the window arrangement of the AHM car is the BM70nb. How "common" were these cars? ( Doing BM70m, ma or n would require modification of the windows, and I doubt my skills on pulling that one off). Thanks again, Walt Prusick ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: mittner@webtv.net (Gary Mittner) Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 09:06:22 -0500 Subject: Re: [PRR] Pennsy Details 2 MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Walt, Hopefully someone can come up with a drawing showing the true size as I don't seem to have any documentation here. However, I was once told, and not sure how true it is, that all the porthole windows used on the PRR (B60 Baggage, N5c, etc) were all the same size and it happened to coincide with the diameter of the glass used in the electric headlights. I was told 18 inches. I can confirm the diameter of the N5c window tomorrow when I am there for our restoration work session. It may or not be exactly 1 inches but I believe it is very close. I know someone with a B60 Baggage that I can ask for a measurment as well....Gary Come visit my PRR Pages: Photos, Models, Historical Items and Art Work! PRR K4s Loco Pics: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/ PRR G5s, T1, J1 J1a, M1, M1a, N1s, etc. etc.: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/prr_loco_index.html PRR N5c #477974 Restoration (ongoing) http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/BVJCN5c.html and...... PRR Pics, P&LE Pics, PRR Memorabilia and Misc. Models: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/indexpics.html ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] Pennsy Details 2 Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 09:14:34 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-reply-to: <002b01c4d936$14b84ae0$dc699b04@stargate.net> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcTZNtDuipoq/XmDS3C9wyLbh3OTzQACzIhw Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I have built 2 BM70m's from the AHM car. I used Grant Line narrow gauge windows, six wheel trucks, scratch built porthole doors, and the Bethlehem M70 roof. The BM70m was the most common RPO in my era, the early 50s. Now, anyone have clue as to how to do an HO BM70k ? regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Walter Prusick Sent: Friday, December 03, 2004 7:46 AM To: PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: [PRR] Pennsy Details 2 Ok guys, First off let me thank you for your quick responses. Guess my quandry now has two parts: A) what is the diameter of said windows. All of the drawings show square/rectangular openings. B) I have 6 cars in the paint stripper and the only class of BM which follows the window arrangement of the AHM car is the BM70nb. How "common" were these cars? ( Doing BM70m, ma or n would require modification of the windows, and I doubt my skills on pulling that one off). Thanks again, Walt Prusick ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 03 Dec 2004 09:19:03 -0500 From: Rod Schaffter Subject: [PRR] RE: Pennsy details X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 0449-1, 12/02/2004), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Not-Tested Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Assuming you are making the holes in styrene, sharpen the end of a brass tube of proper diameter, and use it with pressure and a wood block backing to punch out the hole. Filing a couple of notches in the end of the tube might enable you to use it as a drill(haven't tried it myself!). Cheers, Rod Schaffter -- "1918's now just another year we won the World Series." -- Red Sox GM Theo Epstein. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 09:23:34 -0500 Subject: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam A friend of mine recently showed me a picture of an H6sb and asked if I could determine when it was taken. The only clue I could find was the train control box on the fireman's side running board. I told him this made it likely that the picture was taken after WWII. Does anyone know the date when the PRR started to put this device on steam locos? regards, Andy Miller ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PRR/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: PRR-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: [PRR] Train control on PRR steam Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 09:23:34 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-reply-to: <9b.53e0b3be.2ee0e8b0@aol.com> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcTY0U+xGY1oxjXMSECIK0EpARSPCwAceFUw Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com A friend of mine recently showed me a picture of an H6sb and asked if I could determine when it was taken. The only clue I could find was the train control box on the fireman's side running board. I told him this made it likely that the picture was taken after WWII. Does anyone know the date when the PRR started to put this device on steam locos? regards, Andy Miller ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: ndbprr@att.net Subject: [PRR] Broad Street Frieght House Date: Fri, 03 Dec 2004 16:51:47 +0000 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Does anybody know the approximate date the Broad Street freight house just east of North Philadelphia station was removed from service? This was on the north side of the tracks on the east side of Broad Street and was serviced off the #5 track. Thank you, Norm Bell ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: [PRR] RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 12:17:59 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-reply-to: X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcTZVsNJQjPv1va8Tv+2sNe4Qb4nPQABO0eA Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Lin, Thanx. You answered a lot of my questions. Now the only piece of the puzzle is to identify the box on my friend's H6 picture. Unfortunately, his post cars is not online (yet) but a similar box is on this K4: http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/prr383.jpg On the running board just aft of the steam delivery pipe. Is that the ASC? regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: H BONGAARDT [mailto:linbongaardt@msn.com] Sent: Friday, December 03, 2004 11:27 AM To: PRR@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam Andy, et. al., Some quick answers; I don't have my library here at work. The initial Automatic Train Control (ATC) installation on the PRR was the test setup on the Lewistown Branch installed in about 1923-4. This was a true ATC system in that train speed was controlled as a result of the cab signal aspect received. It also was the earlier "loop system", rather than the later and much more widely used "coder system." There were only three cab signal aspects with this system. It was dismantled in 1926. The first two "production" installations (both with four cab-signal aspects) were on the Northern Central Branch (loop system) and on the West Jersey & Seashore between Camden and Atlantic City (coder system) installed in 1926-7. The coder system was deemed superior and was used in all subsequent installations on the PRR (and soon replaced the loop system on the NC Branch). Interestingly, the Santa Fe had a three-aspect loop system ATC installation without fixed automatic block signals between Pequot and East Fort Madison that was installed in 1925-6 and evidently lasted into the 1960s. The PRR began an extensive installation of cab signals but petitioned the ICC to allow it to install just cab signals without the train control feature, in return for the extensive installation of cabs. The ICC agreed ca. 1931. From ca. 1931 until ca. 1951, there were very few if any engines that had ATC on the PRR. On account of a couple rearend collisions (most recently the Rosemont accident), the PRR decided to install Automatic Speed Control (ASC) on passenger engines only. The installation began in ca. 1951. Note that freight engines were not equipped with ASC, at least not in great numbers with the possible exception of electric engines. Regarding your other questions, the steam-operated turbo-generator on steam engines provided the power for lights and the cab-signal package. When engines were equipped with ATC or the later ASC, they were equipped with a speed recorder that was driven from an axle on the pilot truck. The engine sensed the appropriate speed that it should operate from a pickup bar on the front that received energy from the coded track circuit in the rails. The brakes were applied if the train was exceeding the appropriate speed and crew was warned of the overspeed by a warning whistle. Back to work!! Best regards, Lin Bongaardt >From: "Andy Miller" >Reply-To: PRR@yahoogroups.com >To: >Subject: RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam >Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 10:34:59 -0500 > > > >Al, > >When I passed you answer to my friend, he asked the interesting >question of how a ATC system worked on a steam loco. AFAIK the only >electrical device was the headlight. How did the ATC sense speed or signals? How did it >control the loco? Did it dump the steam? Apply the air brakes? Or did >it >just alert the crew? > >regards, > >Andy Miller > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PRR/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: PRR-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 12:17:59 -0500 Subject: RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam Lin, Thanx. You answered a lot of my questions. Now the only piece of the puzzle is to identify the box on my friend's H6 picture. Unfortunately, his post cars is not online (yet) but a similar box is on this K4: http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/prr383.jpg On the running board just aft of the steam delivery pipe. Is that the ASC? regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: H BONGAARDT [mailto:linbongaardt@msn.com] Sent: Friday, December 03, 2004 11:27 AM To: PRR@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam Andy, et. al., Some quick answers; I don't have my library here at work. The initial Automatic Train Control (ATC) installation on the PRR was the test setup on the Lewistown Branch installed in about 1923-4. This was a true ATC system in that train speed was controlled as a result of the cab signal aspect received. It also was the earlier "loop system", rather than the later and much more widely used "coder system." There were only three cab signal aspects with this system. It was dismantled in 1926. The first two "production" installations (both with four cab-signal aspects) were on the Northern Central Branch (loop system) and on the West Jersey & Seashore between Camden and Atlantic City (coder system) installed in 1926-7. The coder system was deemed superior and was used in all subsequent installations on the PRR (and soon replaced the loop system on the NC Branch). Interestingly, the Santa Fe had a three-aspect loop system ATC installation without fixed automatic block signals between Pequot and East Fort Madison that was installed in 1925-6 and evidently lasted into the 1960s. The PRR began an extensive installation of cab signals but petitioned the ICC to allow it to install just cab signals without the train control feature, in return for the extensive installation of cabs. The ICC agreed ca. 1931. From ca. 1931 until ca. 1951, there were very few if any engines that had ATC on the PRR. On account of a couple rearend collisions (most recently the Rosemont accident), the PRR decided to install Automatic Speed Control (ASC) on passenger engines only. The installation began in ca. 1951. Note that freight engines were not equipped with ASC, at least not in great numbers with the possible exception of electric engines. Regarding your other questions, the steam-operated turbo-generator on steam engines provided the power for lights and the cab-signal package. When engines were equipped with ATC or the later ASC, they were equipped with a speed recorder that was driven from an axle on the pilot truck. The engine sensed the appropriate speed that it should operate from a pickup bar on the front that received energy from the coded track circuit in the rails. The brakes were applied if the train was exceeding the appropriate speed and crew was warned of the overspeed by a warning whistle. Back to work!! Best regards, Lin Bongaardt >From: "Andy Miller" >Reply-To: PRR@yahoogroups.com >To: >Subject: RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam >Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 10:34:59 -0500 > > > >Al, > >When I passed you answer to my friend, he asked the interesting >question of how a ATC system worked on a steam loco. AFAIK the only >electrical device was the headlight. How did the ATC sense speed or signals? How did it >control the loco? Did it dump the steam? Apply the air brakes? Or did >it >just alert the crew? > >regards, > >Andy Miller > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PRR/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: PRR-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Jerry Shickler" Subject: Re: [PRR] RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 13:08:30 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-MDRemoteIP: 192.0.1.150 X-Return-Path: geshick@velocity.net X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: PRR-Talk@dsop.com Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Could that be the NYC train stop equipment for locos where the PRR had trackage rights? Andy, have you checked to see if the BLI tired driver will work on the Bachmann yet? ----- Jerry Shickler Visit the PRR E&P, P&E, & Chautauqua branch web page at: http://www.velocity.net/~geshick/prr/prrmain.htm ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Miller" To: ; Sent: Friday, December 03, 2004 12:17 PM Subject: [PRR] RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam > Lin, > > Thanx. You answered a lot of my questions. Now the only piece of the > puzzle is to identify the box on my friend's H6 picture. Unfortunately, > his post cars is not online (yet) but a similar box is on this K4: > http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/prr383.jpg > > On the running board just aft of the steam delivery pipe. Is that the ASC? > > regards, > > Andy Miller > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 13:31:33 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-reply-to: <002401c4d963$18591ee0$960100c0@ges> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcTZY9+fo97+eBu/Sy+oYU1vWfAlZAAAjUWA Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com 1. I don't believe that that box is related to NYC operation. It appears on almost all K4s. The earliest photo I can find of it on-line is 1946. 2. I don't own a Bachman, but the traction tired driver does wonders on my BLI. regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Jerry Shickler Sent: Friday, December 03, 2004 1:09 PM To: PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam Could that be the NYC train stop equipment for locos where the PRR had trackage rights? Andy, have you checked to see if the BLI tired driver will work on the Bachmann yet? ----- Jerry Shickler Visit the PRR E&P, P&E, & Chautauqua branch web page at: http://www.velocity.net/~geshick/prr/prrmain.htm ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Miller" To: ; Sent: Friday, December 03, 2004 12:17 PM Subject: [PRR] RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam > Lin, > > Thanx. You answered a lot of my questions. Now the only piece of the > puzzle is to identify the box on my friend's H6 picture. Unfortunately, > his post cars is not online (yet) but a similar box is on this K4: > http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/prr383.jpg > > On the running board just aft of the steam delivery pipe. Is that the ASC? > > regards, > > Andy Miller > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 13:39:05 -0500 Subject: RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam Lin, The earliest photo I can find on-line with that box is dated 1945. http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/prr5346.jpg It is mounted on the pilot beam rather than the running board. It appears to have been moved to the running board location with the post war front end "beautification" treatment. I can find no photos of locos with that box pre-war. So I think I am safe in telling my friend that his H6sb photo was taken after WWII. regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: H BONGAARDT [mailto:linbongaardt@msn.com] Sent: Friday, December 03, 2004 1:07 PM To: PRR@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam Andy, Yes, that is the box that contained the cab-signal (also speed control if equipped) apparatus. Lin >From: "Andy Miller" >Reply-To: PRR@yahoogroups.com >To: , >Subject: RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam >Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 12:17:59 -0500 > > > >Lin, > >Thanx. You answered a lot of my questions. Now the only piece of the >puzzle is to identify the box on my friend's H6 picture. Unfortunately, >his post cars is not online (yet) but a similar box is on this K4: >http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/prr383.jpg > >On the running board just aft of the steam delivery pipe. Is that the ASC? > >regards, > >Andy Miller > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PRR/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: PRR-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "STEPHEN HOXIE" Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 12:43:57 -0600 Subject: Re: [PRR] RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam Hi Andy--Here is a photo of a K4 which I think is equipped with the ATC or ASC speed recorder driven from the front axle of the pilot truck. http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/k43747.JPG Lacking the speed recorder drive, I assume the box you are referring to contains the electronics for the cab signals. >From photos I have seen, the vast majority of steam road engines in the 50's were equipped with these boxes. In HO CalScale has an excellent casting which they call a "Train Control Box w/bracket,Union 3-Speed" 190-252. Steve Hoxie Pensacola FL ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Miller" To: ; Sent: Friday, December 03, 2004 11:17 AM Subject: [PRR] RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam > Lin, > > Thanx. You answered a lot of my questions. Now the only piece of the > puzzle is to identify the box on my friend's H6 picture. Unfortunately, > his post cars is not online (yet) but a similar box is on this K4: > http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/prr383.jpg > > On the running board just aft of the steam delivery pipe. Is that the ASC? > > regards, > > Andy Miller > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PRR/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: PRR-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: [PRR] RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 13:39:05 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-reply-to: X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcTZY/ioJFZLEFvnQwufcyi1VNSm6gAAs3EQ Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Lin, The earliest photo I can find on-line with that box is dated 1945. http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/prr5346.jpg It is mounted on the pilot beam rather than the running board. It appears to have been moved to the running board location with the post war front end "beautification" treatment. I can find no photos of locos with that box pre-war. So I think I am safe in telling my friend that his H6sb photo was taken after WWII. regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: H BONGAARDT [mailto:linbongaardt@msn.com] Sent: Friday, December 03, 2004 1:07 PM To: PRR@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam Andy, Yes, that is the box that contained the cab-signal (also speed control if equipped) apparatus. Lin >From: "Andy Miller" >Reply-To: PRR@yahoogroups.com >To: , >Subject: RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam >Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 12:17:59 -0500 > > > >Lin, > >Thanx. You answered a lot of my questions. Now the only piece of the >puzzle is to identify the box on my friend's H6 picture. Unfortunately, >his post cars is not online (yet) but a similar box is on this K4: >http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/prr383.jpg > >On the running board just aft of the steam delivery pipe. Is that the ASC? > >regards, > >Andy Miller > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PRR/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: PRR-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "STEPHEN HOXIE" Subject: Re: [PRR] RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 12:43:57 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-ELNK-Trace: 65fbc22f705d6e9971639b933de7ae6f7e972de0d01da940f0ae72cb9130a49873ea2acaacd5bca8350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 199.174.135.110 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hi Andy--Here is a photo of a K4 which I think is equipped with the ATC or ASC speed recorder driven from the front axle of the pilot truck. http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/k43747.JPG Lacking the speed recorder drive, I assume the box you are referring to contains the electronics for the cab signals. >From photos I have seen, the vast majority of steam road engines in the 50's were equipped with these boxes. In HO CalScale has an excellent casting which they call a "Train Control Box w/bracket,Union 3-Speed" 190-252. Steve Hoxie Pensacola FL ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Miller" To: ; Sent: Friday, December 03, 2004 11:17 AM Subject: [PRR] RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam > Lin, > > Thanx. You answered a lot of my questions. Now the only piece of the > puzzle is to identify the box on my friend's H6 picture. Unfortunately, > his post cars is not online (yet) but a similar box is on this K4: > http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/prr383.jpg > > On the running board just aft of the steam delivery pipe. Is that the ASC? > > regards, > > Andy Miller > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 13:51:43 -0500 Subject: RE: [PRR] RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam Steve, I use that Cal Scale part on all my super detailed Bowser K4s. But I don't believe the box contains "electronics". This is the 1940s. Transistors are yet to be invented, and vacuum tubes probably can't hold up to the rigors of RR operation. Relays and electromechanical devices are far more likely. And yes AFAIK that box on the lead truck axle end is a speed reading device. regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: STEPHEN HOXIE [mailto:stevehprr@earthlink.net] Sent: Friday, December 03, 2004 1:44 PM To: PRR@yahoogroups.com; PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam Hi Andy--Here is a photo of a K4 which I think is equipped with the ATC or ASC speed recorder driven from the front axle of the pilot truck. http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/k43747.JPG Lacking the speed recorder drive, I assume the box you are referring to contains the electronics for the cab signals. >From photos I have seen, the vast majority of steam road engines in the 50's were equipped with these boxes. In HO CalScale has an excellent casting which they call a "Train Control Box w/bracket,Union 3-Speed" 190-252. Steve Hoxie Pensacola FL ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Miller" To: ; Sent: Friday, December 03, 2004 11:17 AM Subject: [PRR] RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam > Lin, > > Thanx. You answered a lot of my questions. Now the only piece of the > puzzle is to identify the box on my friend's H6 picture. Unfortunately, > his post cars is not online (yet) but a similar box is on this K4: > http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/prr383.jpg > > On the running board just aft of the steam delivery pipe. Is that the ASC? > > regards, > > Andy Miller > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PRR/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: PRR-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "STEPHEN HOXIE" Subject: Re: [PRR] RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 12:49:16 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-ELNK-Trace: 65fbc22f705d6e9971639b933de7ae6f7e972de0d01da9400371a1d8418a5c60ed1ec1910abb23bc350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 199.174.135.110 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hi Andy--Here is a photo of a K4 which I think is equipped with the ATC or ASC speed recorder driven from the front axle of the pilot truck. http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/k43747.JPG Lacking the speed recorder drive, I assume the box you are referring to contains the electronics for the cab signals. >From photos I have seen, the vast majority of steam road engines in the 50's were equipped with these boxes. In HO CalScale has an excellent casting which they call a "Train Control Box w/bracket,Union 3-Speed" 190-252. Steve Hoxie Pensacola FL ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 13:51:43 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-reply-to: <009301c4d968$0d2c74e0$a58baec7@hoxiecomp> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcTZaAzuF9qmOh92STWgCHkYCjwF7wAAIcVg Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Steve, I use that Cal Scale part on all my super detailed Bowser K4s. But I don't believe the box contains "electronics". This is the 1940s. Transistors are yet to be invented, and vacuum tubes probably can't hold up to the rigors of RR operation. Relays and electromechanical devices are far more likely. And yes AFAIK that box on the lead truck axle end is a speed reading device. regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: STEPHEN HOXIE [mailto:stevehprr@earthlink.net] Sent: Friday, December 03, 2004 1:44 PM To: PRR@yahoogroups.com; PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam Hi Andy--Here is a photo of a K4 which I think is equipped with the ATC or ASC speed recorder driven from the front axle of the pilot truck. http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/k43747.JPG Lacking the speed recorder drive, I assume the box you are referring to contains the electronics for the cab signals. >From photos I have seen, the vast majority of steam road engines in the 50's were equipped with these boxes. In HO CalScale has an excellent casting which they call a "Train Control Box w/bracket,Union 3-Speed" 190-252. Steve Hoxie Pensacola FL ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Miller" To: ; Sent: Friday, December 03, 2004 11:17 AM Subject: [PRR] RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam > Lin, > > Thanx. You answered a lot of my questions. Now the only piece of the > puzzle is to identify the box on my friend's H6 picture. Unfortunately, > his post cars is not online (yet) but a similar box is on this K4: > http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/prr383.jpg > > On the running board just aft of the steam delivery pipe. Is that the ASC? > > regards, > > Andy Miller > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PRR/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: PRR-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Chany, Christopher" Subject: [PRR] Walthers trucks Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 14:44:23 -0500 From: "STEPHEN HOXIE" Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 15:17:23 -0600 Subject: Re: [PRR] RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam Hi Andy--I absolutely agree. I was using "electronics" in its very broadest sense. And it is somewhat more concise than "electro-mechanical device." In any event, the CalScale part is a non-operable device....... Steve Hoxie Pensacola FL ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Miller" To: ; Sent: Friday, December 03, 2004 12:51 PM Subject: RE: [PRR] RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam > Steve, > > I use that Cal Scale part on all my super detailed Bowser K4s. But I don't > believe the box contains "electronics". This is the 1940s. Transistors are > yet to be invented, and vacuum tubes probably can't hold up to the rigors of > RR operation. Relays and electromechanical devices are far more likely. > And yes AFAIK that box on the lead truck axle end is a speed reading device. > > > regards, > > Andy Miller > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PRR/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: PRR-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "STEPHEN HOXIE" Subject: Re: [PRR] RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 15:17:23 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-ELNK-Trace: 65fbc22f705d6e9971639b933de7ae6f7e972de0d01da94092cd5da0cb455d8764322885d54015e4350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 199.174.137.139 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hi Andy--I absolutely agree. I was using "electronics" in its very broadest sense. And it is somewhat more concise than "electro-mechanical device." In any event, the CalScale part is a non-operable device....... Steve Hoxie Pensacola FL ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Miller" To: ; Sent: Friday, December 03, 2004 12:51 PM Subject: RE: [PRR] RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam > Steve, > > I use that Cal Scale part on all my super detailed Bowser K4s. But I don't > believe the box contains "electronics". This is the 1940s. Transistors are > yet to be invented, and vacuum tubes probably can't hold up to the rigors of > RR operation. Relays and electromechanical devices are far more likely. > And yes AFAIK that box on the lead truck axle end is a speed reading device. > > > regards, > > Andy Miller > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed To: PRR-Talk From: Don Harper Subject: [PRR] Annual meeting of the Penn Texas chapter Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 17:04:05 -0600 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) Return-Path: harperd@tamug.edu X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Dec 2004 23:07:33.0679 (UTC) FILETIME=[DF3703F0:01C4D98C] Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com The Penn Texas chapter of the PRRT&HS will meet at the model railroad club in Galveston, corner of 27th and Market. Set up so far are double headed T1's with passenger consist, double headed M1's with an 80 car hopper consist and and A-B-A Erie built series with a mixed freight consist. We will probably set up double headed K4's with passenger consist. Anyone in the area is welcome to join us at 1 pm for the meeting. Train running will commence about 2:30 PM. This weekend is Dickens on the Strand so street parking may be a problem. The Railroad Museum parking lot will be open. The lot entrance is on 28th Street. Don Harper Texas A&M Marine Lab 5007 Avenue U Galveston, TX 77551 409/740-4540 harperd@tamug.edu ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: RDG2124@aol.com Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2004 22:35:50 EST Subject: [PRR] RE: Pennsy details X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com For window panes, once the inside diameter of the window is known, check out American Model Builders extensive line of laser cut HO scale windows. While they also have offerings (no windows) in N, S and O scales, the windows are only listed under HO. They have window sets for the Bowser PRR cabooses, EMD E & F units, etc. They may just have a round window to fit your model. http://www.laserkit.com/ Don't forget Merchandise Service handles AMB. Evan Leisey RCT&HS 346 PRRT&HS 7487 PRRT&HS (Phila.) 2036 CNJ 2003 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Sat, 04 Dec 2004 09:27:17 -0500 From: dave pierson Subject: Re: [PRR] RE: [PRR-FAX] Train control on PRR steam Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com >This is the 1940s. Transistors are yet to be invented, and vacuum > >tubes probably can't hold up to the rigors of RR operation. Vacuum tubes worked just fine, when suitably mounted and protected. They had been in use, tho not widely, since the 1920s. As to the age of the installation, ICC required 'large' RRs to have 'some' 'ATC' installed, from about 1920 on (I'd need to look it up...), This was an attempt, moderately successful, to 'force grow' the technology. best dave pierson ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Ted Andrews" Subject: [PRR] Atlas Train Master question Date: Sat, 4 Dec 2004 10:48:43 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com PRR-Listers: I am considering in purchasing one Atlas Train Master in PRR. There are = 2 types. One with a decoder with sound and one that is decoder ready but = with no sound. Depending on where one shops, there is about a $100 = difference between the two.=20 For those of you who have purchased the sound version, how good is it? = Is the sound pretty accurate? I have never heard a Train Master before. = Is it worth the extra $100? If you were to buy it all over again, would = you but the non-sound version? Thanks in advance! Ted Andrews P.S.: I am not an anti-sound modeller. I do have a number of BLI PRR = steam and diesel engines. It is just that I tend to now run them with = the sound off about half of the time. Sound is a neat feature, but I = tend to look at is as an option rather than a requirement. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: John Frantz Subject: Re: [PRR] Atlas Train Master question Date: Sat, 04 Dec 2004 11:54:37 -0500 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new .250 at suscom.net Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Ted, I had the chance to play with my friend's on his layout=20 this past week. I think the sound is good, but what's=20 better are they factory installed extras. These take=20 effect in both DC and DCC. Thee is momentum or inertia.=20 Also, when the engine is idling it actually "idles"=20 meaning the engine shakes eough to be noticable. I'd go=20 for it if it fir my era and location, but alas it did not. Regards, John "Ted Andrews" wrote: > PRR-Listers: >=20 > I am considering in purchasing one Atlas Train Master in=20 >PRR. There are 2 types. One with a decoder with sound and=20 >one that is decoder ready but with no sound. Depending on=20 >where one shops, there is about a $100 difference between=20 >the two.=20 >=20 >For those of you who have purchased the sound version,=20 >how good is it? Is the sound pretty accurate? I have=20 >never heard a Train Master before. Is it worth the extra=20 >$100? If you were to buy it all over again, would you but=20 >the non-sound version? >=20 > Thanks in advance! >=20 > Ted Andrews >=20 > P.S.: I am not an anti-sound modeller. I do have a=20 >number of BLI PRR steam and diesel engines. It is just=20 >that I tend to now run them with the sound off about half=20 >of the time. Sound is a neat feature, but I tend to look=20 >at is as an option rather than a requirement. >=20 >=20 > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- >For assistance with this list, please visit=20 >http://lists.dsop.com. >=20 Designer, Modeler, Consultant Mount Vernon Shops York, PA www.mountvernonshops.com Specializing in O, HO & N Scale Structures for the Pennsy=20 modeler. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: Northcreek28@aol.com Date: Sat, 4 Dec 2004 15:40:38 EST Subject: [PRR-FAX] Re: backup light on M1/M1a/M1b In vol. 22, no. 4 (winter, 1989) Keystone, a great centerspread photo shows a J1a with a large backup light on the tender. Were any M1/M1a/M1b engines so equipped? Also, in the same photo, I believe the device under the tender slope sheet to be a coal pusher and it does appear on other large PRR steam power. Was this essentially a "one size fits all" for six and eight-axle tenders? Thanks for any information. Robert Mohowski ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> $4.98 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Q7_YsB/neXJAA/yQLSAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PRR/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: PRR-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "STEPHEN HOXIE" Date: Sat, 4 Dec 2004 16:28:32 -0600 Subject: [PRR-FAX] Re: backup light on M1/M1a/M1b Hi Bob--I don't recall seeing any photos of M1/M1a/M1b engines with a backup light on the tender, and a cursory look thru my bookshelves confirms that. Note that the large backup light was not standard for the J1. On p. 112 of "Trackside on the PRR in Central Pennsylvania" is a photo of two J1's eastbound on the Curve; one has the large light, the other a smaller light built into the rear of the tank. I have always assumed the device under the slope sheet to be a coal pusher, but I have only seen it on eight wheel tenders. Steve Hoxie Pensacola FL ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> $4.98 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Q7_YsB/neXJAA/yQLSAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PRR/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: PRR-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "STEPHEN HOXIE" Subject: [PRR] Re: backup light on M1/M1a/M1b Date: Sat, 4 Dec 2004 16:28:32 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-ELNK-Trace: 65fbc22f705d6e9971639b933de7ae6f7e972de0d01da9408b50b17cf6418e5fa0a5f8f170c286e2350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 199.174.137.174 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hi Bob--I don't recall seeing any photos of M1/M1a/M1b engines with a backup light on the tender, and a cursory look thru my bookshelves confirms that. Note that the large backup light was not standard for the J1. On p. 112 of "Trackside on the PRR in Central Pennsylvania" is a photo of two J1's eastbound on the Curve; one has the large light, the other a smaller light built into the rear of the tank. I have always assumed the device under the slope sheet to be a coal pusher, but I have only seen it on eight wheel tenders. Steve Hoxie Pensacola FL ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: mittner@webtv.net (Gary Mittner) Date: Sat, 4 Dec 2004 21:54:30 -0500 Subject: Re: [PRR] Pennsy Details 2 MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Walt, I think you would be safe in making the porthole opening 18 inches, give or take a tad. I measured the window we had cut for our N5c. It measured 18 3/4, probably 18 inch actual viewing area when the gasket is in place. I got word that a BM85 window is 18 inches as well and a B60 porthole is 19 inches where the ring holds the glass in place and the actual opening cut into the door is 20 inches. So you can decide if the little deviations in porthole measurements of several classes is a factor. I would go with 18 inch hole and leave it at that.....Gary Come visit my PRR Pages: Photos, Models, Historical Items and Art Work! PRR K4s Loco Pics: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/ PRR G5s, T1, J1 J1a, M1, M1a, N1s, etc. etc.: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/prr_loco_index.html PRR N5c #477974 Restoration (ongoing) http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/BVJCN5c.html and...... PRR Pics, P&LE Pics, PRR Memorabilia and Misc. Models: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/indexpics.html ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Tom Mahon" Subject: [PRR] On30 Diagram Date: Mon, 6 Dec 2004 22:44:40 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Evening, Setting up the trains under the tree and encountered a problem. I'm looking for the assembly diagram for the Bachmann On30 passenger car. It is PRR (required content :-) ). The car is shorting out the oval and I need to get it apart to see what the problem is. The inside seat and floor assembly is hanging and I don't want to break it. Any assistance is greatly appreciated. Tom Mahon Merrimack, NH ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Tom Mahon" Subject: RE: [PRR] On30 Diagram Date: Mon, 6 Dec 2004 23:15:06 -0500 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.3416 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 In-Reply-To: <28968-41B52AA1-1575@storefull-3117.bay.webtv.net> Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Gary, Thanks for the quick contact. I did pop the tabs and got the body loose from the frame. There is a floor piece and the seats on the floor piece. There are also side tabs that have to be released. My problem is that one end of the floor is free from the frame, but the other end is not. It seems to be hanging up in the truck screw area of one end. I'm trying not to take a "bull in the china shop" approach to disassembly. I'm concerned that end of the floor is anchored by the truck screw. The other aspect of this is, that it's late and I'm tired, so I really don't want to screw it up out of fatigue and impatience; often deadly qualities when I model. Regards, Tom -----Original Message----- From: Gary Mittner [mailto:mittner@webtv.net] Sent: Monday, December 06, 2004 10:59 PM To: Tom Mahon Subject: Re: [PRR] On30 Diagram Tom, I too have this set and I looked for the parts sheet/diagram sheet to help you out. There is none. I looked at the bottom of the car and I see 4 tabs that hold the floor on. I didn't try to take mine apart but these are the key for the floor removal. Probably a screw driver or something to push them to release the floor....Gary Come visit my PRR Pages: Photos, Models, Historical Items and Art Work! PRR K4s Loco Pics: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/ PRR G5s, T1, J1 J1a, M1, M1a, N1s, etc. etc.: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/prr_loco_index.html PRR N5c #477974 Restoration (ongoing) http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/BVJCN5c.html and...... PRR Pics, P&LE Pics, PRR Memorabilia and Misc. Models: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/indexpics.html ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Fred in Vt." Subject: [PRR] interchange cars Date: Mon, 6 Dec 2004 23:37:33 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Listers, For those of you who are seeking cars for mail & express = trains > NYC to Chicago & St.Louis, there are some fine examples of NH = baggage cars available from the NH Society. Check in at this link; www.nhrhs.com; all info & ordering on line. If you model the Middle Divn.,Pitts. Divn., or the Corridor, = there is something you can use. Most are up-graded F&C kits, and are = worth the effort. Fred Freitas, New England Chapter Lining up projects for snow season! ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Mon, 06 Dec 2004 23:00:57 -0800 From: Peter Weiglin Subject: [PRR] New Haven baggage cars Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Fred Freitas wrote: For those of you who are seeking cars for mail & express trains > NYC to Chicago & St.Louis, there are some fine examples of NH baggage cars available from the NH Society. Check in at this link; www.nhrhs.com; all info & ordering on line. If you model the Middle Divn.,Pitts. Divn., or the Corridor, there is something you can use. Most are up-graded F&C kits, and are worth the effort. = = = = Great -- except that the New Haven Society's website is http://www.nhrhta.org/ and there's no immediate mention of baggage cars, until you go to the listing on the right and scroll it down to NHRHTA SALES ITEMS - NEW ITEMS. The list of Craftsman kits includes baggage cars. Internet sites are fun! Peter Weiglin San Mateo, CA ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: MLiebeskin@aol.com Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2004 13:17:18 EST Subject: [PRR] Re: PRR-Talk Digest - 12/07/04 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Tom, Having " been there, done that" I suspect the culprit is probably one or both trucks shorting-out against the chassis. One cure is to install a couple of washers on the truck mounting screw between the chassis and the truck itself. The main drawback with this fix is that you'll probably have to do the same to all the cars. Good luck. John Liebeskind ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Tom Mahon" Subject: RE: [PRR] Re: PRR-Talk Digest - 12/07/04 Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2004 17:44:40 -0500 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.3416 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 In-Reply-To: <27.66ff6fbb.2ee74dae@aol.com> Importance: Normal Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Thanks for the help. It was one of the wheel sets put in backward. Everything is running. Now to fix the light pick-up. -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of MLiebeskin@aol.com Sent: Tuesday, December 07, 2004 1:17 PM To: PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: [PRR] Re: PRR-Talk Digest - 12/07/04 Tom, Having " been there, done that" I suspect the culprit is probably one or both trucks shorting-out against the chassis. One cure is to install a couple of washers on the truck mounting screw between the chassis and the truck itself. The main drawback with this fix is that you'll probably have to do the same to all the cars. Good luck. John Liebeskind ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Tom Mahon" Subject: [PRR] On30 Diagram Follow-up Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2004 18:02:23 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Thanks to all for the responses. Turned out to be one wheel set reversed. Duh! In any event, there are roof tabs that get popped to remove the roof. Then you can get inside the car to get at the electrical connections to the car light. The car body is released by two tabs at each end of the car, then press out the side tabs on the car body to release from the frame. Then the screws for the floor and seat section are accessible which then gets you to the wire that got the wheel pick ups. Hope I'm not repeating something here, but Jerry does archive and someone else may benefit. Tom Mahon ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Tom Mahon" Subject: [PRR] FW: On30 Diagram Follow-up Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2004 18:04:06 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Thanks to all for the responses. Turned out to be one wheel set reversed. Duh! In any event, there are roof tabs that get popped to remove the roof. Then you can get inside the car to get at the electrical connections to the car light. The car body is released by two tabs at each end of the car, then press out the side tabs on the car body to release from the frame. Then the screws for the floor and seat section are accessible which then gets you to the wire that got the wheel pick ups. Hope I'm not repeating something here, but Jerry does archive and someone else may benefit. Tom Mahon ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2004 18:27:27 -0800 (PST) From: MICHAEL MERCURE Subject: [PRR] BLI Offerings From: EMACGIS@aol.com Date: Wed, 8 Dec 2004 10:09:03 EST Subject: [PRR] Hammerhead Info Needed X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Quite some time ago I started a project to build an N-Scale Hammerhead. I have searched everywhere I know of for the roof details on the high hood but have been unable to find pictures or drawings. Can anyone help me out with information, pictures or drawings? Please contact me direct at EMACGIS@aol.com or post to this site. Thanks in advance for any help you could provide. E.J. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Brian J Carlson" Subject: Re: [PRR] Hammerhead Info Needed Date: Wed, 8 Dec 2004 23:35:36 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV 0.80/621/Tue Dec 7 07:55:16 2004 clamav-milter version 0.80j on net.bluemoon.net X-Virus-Status: Clean Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com See pages 52-53 of Pennsy diesel Years V3. All 3 shots show the 8445. Brian J Carlson P.E. Cheektowaga NY ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, December 08, 2004 10:09 AM Subject: [PRR] Hammerhead Info Needed > Quite some time ago I started a project to build an N-Scale Hammerhead. I > have searched everywhere I know of for the roof details on the high hood but have > been unable to find pictures or drawings. Can anyone help me out with > information, pictures or drawings? Please contact me direct at EMACGIS@aol.com or > post to this site. Thanks in advance > for any help you could provide. E.J. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: TGREGMRTN@aol.com Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 02:34:08 EST Subject: Re: [PRR] Hammerhead Info Needed X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com E. J., Withers Publishing make a great book that is very reasonable for under 25 bucks that cover the all the PRR ALCo Road switchers. The Hammerhead was an oddball one of a kind for the PRR, others were produced but it was a truly special purpose locomotive. I know that more modelers have produced this unit than ALCo produced RS-3s. Take careful note that the fuel tank was totally different... There are plenty of photos of this unit in PRR, as well it's after life on the LV. It is a lot of work to get it correct ... good luck and invest in the book, it will save you lots of time... Greg Martin brian@net.bluemoon.net writes: See pages 52-53 of Pennsy diesel Years V3. All 3 shots show the 8445. Brian J. Carlson PE Cheektowaga NY ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, December 08, 2004 10:09 AM Subject: [PRR] Hammerhead Info Needed > Quite some time ago I started a project to build a N-Scale Hammerhead. I have searched everywhere I know of for the roof details on the high hood but have been unable to find pictures or drawings. Can anyone help me out with information, pictures or drawings? Please contact me direct at EMACGIS@aol.com or > post to this site. Thanks in advance for any help you could provide. E. J. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Edmund Lee Burbage" Subject: [PRR] Locomotive Class Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 04:41:44 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Can anyone please tell me what Class Steam Locomotive was assigned PRR = Engine Number 1278 in 1946? Lee Burbage PRRT&HS 1943 leeswitchkey@mchsi.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: abendschein@comcast.net Subject: Re: [PRR] Locomotive Class Date: Thu, 09 Dec 2004 11:31:26 +0000 Date: Thu, 09 Dec 2004 09:19:10 -0500 From: lheintz2@rochester.rr.com Subject: [PRR] Hammerhead info Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 09:21:53 -0600 (CST) Subject: [PRR] Stripping Branchline Pullmans From: smithbf@vetmed.auburn.edu X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Good Morning Folks, Just a quick note for those interested in repainting Branchline Pullmans. Having no use for a Pullman letter PENNSYLVANIA, I wanted to strip and repaint my 12-1 into a pre-divestiture Tuscan scheme. I tried stripping one side in denatured alcohol, and that sort of worked, although an overnight submersion resulted in only partial removal of the paint, with the gold striping proving particularly resistent. I then submerged the other side in Windex. Within 30 minutes, about 90% of the paint came off, mostly as little particles. A brisk brushing with an old toothbrush got the rest of the paint off. The windex also got all of the remaining paint off of the first side. Easy, cheap, pretty non-toxic (if you don't drink it!), seems like Windex is the way to go (and you cvan buy the BIG refills at WalMart etc.) Regards Bruce Bruce Smith Auburn, AL ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Gregg Mahlkov" Subject: [PRR] Dothan, AL, TRAIN SHOW this weekend. Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 11:03:09 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com List members, The Wiregrass Train Show and Sale will be held this weekend, Dec. 11 and 12, at the National Peanut Festival grounds on Highway 231 S. in Dothan, AL. Hours are 9 to 5 on Saturday and 10 to 4 on Sunday. Admission is $4.00 and kids are free. Santa Claus will be there for them. I will have my N scale Pennsylvania Railroad layout there, running mostly steam with possibly a little Diesel. I will be wearing my WGH Ambassador's pin and my Atlas Forum pin. Hope to see some of y'all from the Florida panhandle, South Alabama, and Southwest Georgia there. Gregg Mahlkov ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Message-Id: <326F8527-4A48-11D9-AF54-000A95C04372@pennsyrr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed To: PRR-talk From: Jerry @ Pennsy Subject: [PRR] Reminder to PRRT&HS Members Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 20:09:52 -0500 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com The new issue of The Keystone is out. The mailer page has the membership renewal form for 2005 on the back. Don't throw it out! Don't set it aside to pay later! Get that check in the mail today! Remember the ruckus from last spring... low renewals were blamed on The Keystone Modeler being made available free of charge online. Take away that excuse before it comes up again! ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS jerry@pennsyrr.com Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Al Buchan" Subject: RE: [PRR] Reminder to PRRT&HS Members Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 20:51:32 -0500 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 In-Reply-To: <326F8527-4A48-11D9-AF54-000A95C04372@pennsyrr.com> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Re: The new issue of The Keystone is out. The mailer page has the membership renewal form for 2005 on the back. It's also the last page of the December Keystone Modeler. And will be the last page of the December e-NEWS on December 17th. Al ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Edmund Lee Burbage" Subject: [PRR] Picture Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 02:56:41 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Could anyone help me find a picture of a E 6 Locomotive from the = Pennsylvania RR? leeswitchkey@mchsi.com Thank You Lee Burbage PRRT&HS 1943 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Cc: "Group PRR" From: Bill Morlitz Subject: Re: [PRR] Picture Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 04:21:01 -0500 To: "Edmund Lee Burbage" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Dec 10, 2004, at 2:56 AM, Edmund Lee Burbage wrote: > Could anyone help me find a picture of a E 6 Locomotive from the > Pennsylvania RR? > > leeswitchkey@mchsi.com > > > Thank You > > Lee Burbage > PRRT&HS 1943 Lee, Go to Google and type in "PRR E6 Atlantic 460", I came up with 38 different websites of which more than half have pictures. NorhtEast Rails has about 30 pictures alone. Bill Morlitz ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: Bruce Smith Subject: Re: [PRR] Picture Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 08:53:43 -0600 To: PRR talk X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Dec 10, 2004, at 1:56 AM, Edmund Lee Burbage wrote: > Could anyone help me find a picture of a E 6 Locomotive from the > Pennsylvania RR? > Thank You > > Lee Burbage > PRRT&HS 1943 Lee, Look at the Northeast Railfan site. They have a number of rosters with a huge number of photos. PRR E type steamers, including the E6 are at http://www.northeast.railfan.net/prr_steam3.html Regards Bruce Bruce F. Smith Auburn, AL http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/ "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin __ / \ __<+--+>________________\__/___ ________________________________ |- ______/ O O \_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ | | / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 \ | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__|| |/_____________________________\|_|________________________________| | O--O \0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 15:21:46 -0500 Subject: [PRR] PRR Eastern Region Update & Invitation From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: <1D3BB34A-4AE9-11D9-9DA6-000393835C88@pennsyrr.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com After several years of setbacks requiring my time elsewhere, my N scale PRR Eastern Region is going to be getting a lot more attention real soon. In the coming weeks I will be completing the Crew's Lounge -- the wife would call it a Rec Room -- which has been a pre-requisite to regular work sessions on the layout. As of the first of the year, the PRR ER will have weekly work sessions. Sessions are on Wednesday evenings, subject to change once full operating sessions begin. Though construction of benchwork and RoW will continue for another 12-18 months, the first point-to-point operations will be possible in the early spring. Philadelphia/Baltimore/Reading staging connects to Harrisburg which will be connected at Rockville back into Sunbury staging. I can detour trains up the Susquehanna Division in lieu of the Middle/Pittsburgh divisions to allow about half of the planned trains to run until the upper deck is completed later. A few switching areas will also be ready for use. The layout is DCC (Digitrax) and will use a car card system for locals. The many through freights will not use cards. The layout is expected to be open and running for the PRRT&HS annual meeting open house tour in May. Some aspects of its design and construction will be featured in Kalmbach's "Model Railroad Planning 2005", due out in March. With the Crew's Lounge and the layout's lower level done, there is much more room for moving around so I am opening the doors for additional crew. Potential crew need not have N scale experience; I've converted many HO guys!!! I'm located just off I-83 about half way between York and Harrisburg (Pa.). If you are in the general area (30 mile radius) and would like to become a REGULAR for work and operating sessions, please contact me off-list. Thank you. ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: zootowerprr@webtv.net Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 19:06:41 -0500 Subject: [PRR] T1 Duplex starring in new movie. MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hey Guys, There is a new movie out called "A Series of Unfortunate Events" which features a scene with a PRR T1 about to hit a car at a grade crossing. There's a quick shot of the T1 in the tv commercials. Also the T1 has a five chime airhorn. I guess Hollywood didn't like the whistle. I don't know what scale or what type of model make used in the movie. You can see the Keystone number plate but the number is hard to read. Keep an eye out for the tv ads for this movie. Dave Hopson ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 16:10:01 -0800 (PST) From: Doug Kisala Subject: [PRR] BLI K4s and Digitrax Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 19:40:15 -0500 From: Godfrey Hall Subject: Re: [PRR] T1 Duplex starring in new movie. Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com zootowerprr@webtv.net wrote: Hey Guys, There is a new movie out called "A Series of Unfortunate Events" which features a scene with a PRR T1 about to hit a car at a grade crossing.I don't know what scale or what type of model was used in the movie. Dave Hopson Dave - This is a computer generated image, the same as the train in " Polar Express" - godfrey hall ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: zootowerprr@webtv.net Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 19:58:05 -0500 Subject: Re: [PRR] T1 Duplex starring in new movie. MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Thanks Godfrey, There is a couple of shots showing the side of the T1 and the front truck is shaking as it goes down the track, so I thought it was a model. Dave ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: zootowerprr@webtv.net Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 19:58:05 -0500 Subject: [PRR-FAX] Re: [PRR] T1 Duplex starring in new movie. Thanks Godfrey, There is a couple of shots showing the side of the T1 and the front truck is shaking as it goes down the track, so I thought it was a model. Dave ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> $4.98 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Q7_YsB/neXJAA/yQLSAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PRR/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: PRR-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: zootowerprr@webtv.net Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 19:06:41 -0500 Subject: [PRR-FAX] T1 Duplex starring in new movie. Hey Guys, There is a new movie out called "A Series of Unfortunate Events" which features a scene with a PRR T1 about to hit a car at a grade crossing. There's a quick shot of the T1 in the tv commercials. Also the T1 has a five chime airhorn. I guess Hollywood didn't like the whistle. I don't know what scale or what type of model make used in the movie. You can see the Keystone number plate but the number is hard to read. Keep an eye out for the tv ads for this movie. Dave Hopson ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> $4.98 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Q7_YsB/neXJAA/yQLSAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PRR/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: PRR-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: RDG2124@aol.com Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 23:38:33 EST Subject: [PRR] Altoona Builders Plate X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Correct assumption, Altoona applied the oval builder's plate to the smoke box from day one? Was the Pennsy building locos at another location prior to the Altoona shops? Evan Leisey RCT&HS 346 PRRT&HS 7487 PRRT&HS (Phila.) 2036 CNJ 2003 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Sat, 11 Dec 2004 22:17:13 -0500 From: Rod Schaffter Subject: Re: [PRR] Picture X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 0450-1, 12/09/2004), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Not-Tested Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Bill speaketh... > On Dec 10, 2004, at 2:56 AM, Edmund Lee Burbage wrote: >>> Could anyone help me find a picture of a E 6 Locomotive from the >>> Pennsylvania RR? >>> > Lee, > > Go to Google and type in "PRR E6 Atlantic > 460", I came up with 38 different websites of which more than half have > pictures. > > NorhtEast Rails has > about 30 pictures alone. When I saw Lee's quetion I thought "the Pennsy didn't have anything older than E7s, didn't they?" DOH!! I guess I'll get a well deserved lump of coal in my stocking this Christmas! Cheers, Rod Schaffter -- "1918's now just another year we won the World Series." -- Red Sox GM Theo Epstein. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: Cprrboss@aol.com Date: Sat, 11 Dec 2004 22:35:50 EST Subject: [PRR] Re: PRR-Talk Digest - 12/11/04 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com In a message dated 12/11/04 1:12:34 AM Eastern Standard Time, PRR-Talk@dsop.com writes: > I've converted many HO guys!!! > HA! Fat chance. OK, so I can't see the small stuff. That doesn't mean I'm small minded. BTW, you have the first eastbound local Sat night. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: John Frantz Subject: [PRR] Z74 #7503 Francis L Suter, aka Harrisburg Date: Sun, 12 Dec 2004 09:15:26 -0500 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new .250 at suscom.net Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Listers, Can anyone tell me what they know about the current=20 ownership of fromer PRR business car #7503 "Harrisburg",=20 now known as the Francis L. Suter. From what i've heard=20 the current owner is in jail in Lancaster County. I ask=20 because a good friend is interested in purchasing a PV car=20 and liked the lines, and look of this particular car. Thanks for any help. -John ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Edmund Lee Burbage" Subject: [PRR] Fw: Useful information/terminology update (jailbreak is my Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 09:22:40 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Jay McCarthy=20 To: Craig Hille ; Edmund Lee Burbage ; John Sharp=20 Sent: Monday, December 13, 2004 8:44 AM Subject: Useful information/terminology update (jailbreak is my = favorite)] We've all been there but don't like to admit it. We've all kicked back = in our cubicles and suddenly felt something brewing down below. As much = as we try to convince ourselves otherwise, the WORK POOP is inevitable. = For those who hate pooping at work, following is the Survival Guide for = taking a dump at work.=20 CROP DUSTING=20 When farting, you walk briskly around the office so the smell is not in = your area and everyone else gets a whiff but doesn't know where it came = from. Be careful when you do this. Do not stop until the full fart has = been expelled. Walk an extra 30 feet to make sure the smell has left = your pants.=20 FLY BY=20 The act of scouting out a bathroom before pooping. Walk in and check for = other poopers. If there are others in the bathroom, leave and come back = again. Be careful not to become a FREQUENT FLYER. People may become = suspicious if they catch you constantly going into the bathroom.=20 ESCAPEE=20 A fart that slips out while taking a leak at the urinal or forcing a = poop in a stall. This is usually accompanied by a sudden wave of = embarrassment. If you release an escapee, do not acknowledge it. Pretend = it did not happen. If you are standing next to the farter in the urinal, = pretend you did not hear it. No one likes an escapee. It is = uncomfortable for all involved.=20 Making a joke or laughing makes both parties feel uneasy.=20 JAILBREAK=20 When forcing a poop, several farts slip out at a machine gun pace. This = is usually a side effect of diarrhea or a hangover. If this should = happen, do not panic. Remain in the stall until everyone has left the = bathroom to spare everyone the awkwardness of what just occurred.=20 COURTESY FLUSH=20 The act of flushing the toilet the instant the poop hits the water. This = reduces the amount of air time the poop has to stink up the bathroom. = This can help you avoid being caught doing the WALK OF SHAME.=20 WALK OF SHAME=20 Walking from the stall, to the sink, to the door after you have just = stunk up the bathroom. This can be a very uncomfortable moment if = someone walks in and busts you. As with farts, it is best to pretend = that the smell does not exist. Can be avoided with the use of the = COURTESY FLUSH.=20 OUT OF THE CLOSET POOPER=20 A colleague who poops at work and is damn proud of it. You will often = see an Out Of The Closet Pooper enter the bathroom with a newspaper or = magazine under his or her arm. Always look around the office for the Out = Of The Closet Pooper before entering the bathroom.=20 THE POOPING FRIENDS NETWORK (PFN)=20 A group of co-workers who band together to ensure emergency pooping goes = off without incident. This group can help you to monitor the whereabouts = of Out Of The Closet Poopers, and identify SAFE HAVENS.=20 SAFE HAVENS=20 A seldom-used bathroom somewhere in the building where you can least = expect visitors. Try floors that are predominantly of the opposite sex. = This will reduce the odds of a pooper of your sex entering the bathroom. = TURD BURGLAR=20 Someone who does not realize that you are in the stall and tries to = force the door open. This is one of the most shocking and vulnerable = moments that can occur when taking a poop at work. If this occurs, = remain in the stall until the Turd Burglar leaves. This way you will = avoid all uncomfortable eye contact.=20 CAMO-COUGH=20 A phony cough that alerts all new entrants into the bathroom that you = are in a stall. This can be used to cover-up a WATERMELON, or to alert = potential Turd Burglars. Very effective when used in conjunction with an = ASTAIRE.=20 ASTAIRE=20 A subtle toe-tap that is used to alert potential Turd Burglars that you = are occupying a stall. This will remove all doubt that the stall is = occupied. If you hear an Astaire, leave the bathroom immediately so the = pooper can poop in peace.=20 WATERMELON=20 A poop that creates a loud splash when hitting the toilet water. This is = also an embarrassing incident. If you feel a Watermelon coming on, = create a diversion. See CAMO-COUGH.=20 -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ------- Note: This message is for the named person's use only. It may contain = confidential, proprietary or legally privileged information. The City = of Coconut Creek reserves the right to monitor all e-mail communications = through its networks. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, = except where the message states otherwise and the sender is authorized = to state them to be the views of any such entity. This message has been scanned by Mail Marshal! Thank You.=20 -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ------- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 09:36:37 -0500 Subject: LISTMASTER -- Re: [PRR] Fw: Useful information/terminology update From: Jerry Britton In-Reply-To: <006a01c4e11f$34bc2dc0$4a55db0c@mchsi.com> Message-Id: <6551CDDE-4D14-11D9-ADBF-000393835C88@pennsyrr.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Listers: I apologize for the message recently posted by Mr. Burbage. He has been notified that it was inappropriate content for the PRR-talk list (even if list traffic is light) and will be removed from the archives. This list is not moderated, which speeds delivery of posts. However, if content becomes objectionable on a regular basis, moderation would need to be considered. Thank you. ---------------------------------------- Listmaster Desktop Solutions of Pennsylvania, Inc. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Subject: RE: [PRR] Fw: Useful information/terminology update (jailbreak is my favorite)] Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 08:36:41 -0600 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [PRR] Fw: Useful information/terminology update (jailbreak is my favorite)] Thread-Index: AcThIL9WV6eTc6B+SdWe/V5jwSDdAQAAFEUg From: "Cadwell, Marvin L" To: "Edmund Lee Burbage" , "Allan Socea" , "Bob Lewis" , "Charles Craibe" , "Charles Tarter" , "Clay Spurrier" , "Deloris Burbage" , "Ed Retzer" , "George Burbage" , "George Stevenson" , "Group PRR" , "Herb Kern" , "James Trimble" , "Jerry Giaglio" , "Jerry McDonald" , "John Bates" , "Joseph Santuchi" , "Karl Burkhardt" , "Ken Bontemps" , "Mary Jane Megee" , "Phil Moseley" , "Ray Burbage" , "Robert Peters" Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com This message has no business being sendt to members on this list. -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com]On Behalf Of Edmund Lee Burbage Sent: Monday, December 13, 2004 8:23 AM To: Allan Socea; Bob Lewis; Charles Craibe; Charles Tarter; Clay Spurrier; Deloris Burbage; Ed Retzer; George Burbage; George Stevenson; Group PRR; Herb Kern; James Trimble; Jerry Giaglio; Jerry McDonald; John Bates; Joseph Santuchi; Karl Burkhardt; Ken Bontemps; Mary Jane Megee; Phil Moseley; Ray Burbage; Robert Peters; Steze Zabko; Tammy Collins Subject: [PRR] Fw: Useful information/terminology update (jailbreak is my favorite)] ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Jay McCarthy=20 To: Craig Hille ; Edmund Lee Burbage ; John Sharp=20 Sent: Monday, December 13, 2004 8:44 AM Subject: Useful information/terminology update (jailbreak is my = favorite)] We've all been there but don't like to admit it. We've all kicked back = in our cubicles and suddenly felt something brewing down below. As much = as we try to convince ourselves otherwise, the WORK POOP is inevitable. = For those who hate pooping at work, following is the Survival Guide for = taking a dump at work.=20 CROP DUSTING=20 When farting, you walk briskly around the office so the smell is not in = your area and everyone else gets a whiff but doesn't know where it came = from. Be careful when you do this. Do not stop until the full fart has = been expelled. Walk an extra 30 feet to make sure the smell has left = your pants.=20 FLY BY=20 The act of scouting out a bathroom before pooping. Walk in and check for = other poopers. If there are others in the bathroom, leave and come back = again. Be careful not to become a FREQUENT FLYER. People may become = suspicious if they catch you constantly going into the bathroom.=20 ESCAPEE=20 A fart that slips out while taking a leak at the urinal or forcing a = poop in a stall. This is usually accompanied by a sudden wave of = embarrassment. If you release an escapee, do not acknowledge it. Pretend = it did not happen. If you are standing next to the farter in the urinal, = pretend you did not hear it. No one likes an escapee. It is = uncomfortable for all involved.=20 Making a joke or laughing makes both parties feel uneasy.=20 JAILBREAK=20 When forcing a poop, several farts slip out at a machine gun pace. This = is usually a side effect of diarrhea or a hangover. If this should = happen, do not panic. Remain in the stall until everyone has left the = bathroom to spare everyone the awkwardness of what just occurred.=20 COURTESY FLUSH=20 The act of flushing the toilet the instant the poop hits the water. This = reduces the amount of air time the poop has to stink up the bathroom. = This can help you avoid being caught doing the WALK OF SHAME.=20 WALK OF SHAME=20 Walking from the stall, to the sink, to the door after you have just = stunk up the bathroom. This can be a very uncomfortable moment if = someone walks in and busts you. As with farts, it is best to pretend = that the smell does not exist. Can be avoided with the use of the = COURTESY FLUSH.=20 OUT OF THE CLOSET POOP