From: "Sam Vastano" Subject: [PRR] PRR (S2) Tarnish Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 07:38:31 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Group, I am in the midst of working on a Brass S2 and the engine is very = tarnished... I am talking Black in some areas... I was looking for ideas = to remove the tarnish and not the details.... Any ideas out there? Thanks SamV ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Sam Vastano" Subject: [PRR] PRR (S2) Tarnish Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 07:38:31 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Group, I am in the midst of working on a Brass S2 and the engine is very = tarnished... I am talking Black in some areas... I was looking for ideas = to remove the tarnish and not the details.... Any ideas out there? Thanks SamV ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Dennis" Subject: Re: [PRR] PRR (S2) Tarnish Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 07:49:21 -0700 From: "Sam Vastano" Subject: Re: [PRR] PRR (S2) Tarnish Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 11:02:36 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Aug 2004 15:01:06.0194 (UTC) FILETIME=[894EFF20:01C478A1] Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Bruce, Dennis, Group, I don't have access to a blaster so I will try the Ajax Cleanser. The model doesn't have clear on is so that might work. thanks SamV ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dennis" To: "Sam Vastano" ; "PRR-TALK" Sent: Monday, August 02, 2004 10:49 AM Subject: Re: [PRR] PRR (S2) Tarnish > I have had good luck using Ajax Cleanser and a toothbrush under warm > water. > > Good Luck > > Dennis Terebecki > > > > Group, > > > > I am in the midst of working on a Brass S2 and the engine is very > tarnished... I am talking Black in some areas... I was looking for > ideas to remove the tarnish and not the details.... > > > > Any ideas out there? > > > > Thanks > > > > SamV > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > - > > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > > > > > > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: LAMAassoc@aol.com Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 11:24:17 EDT Subject: Re: [PRR] PRR (S2) Tarnish X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Mac sub 46 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com In a message dated 8/2/04 8:41:52 AM, svastano@hotmail.com writes: << I am in the midst of working on a Brass S2 and the engine is very tarnished... I am talking Black in some areas... I was looking for ideas to remove the tarnish and not the details.... >> Sam - I've never tried it on brass, but when I clean metal, I use the "polishing compound" that is next to the car polish in the auto-motive supply shop. I don't think it is as abrasive as Ajax and shouldn't scratch. The polishing compound has grit in it but it does not seem to scratch. If there is also a splotchy coating, laquer, for example, I'll mix in a splash of mineral spirits. I, too, like to use old toothbrushes and collect them as the family runs through them. But, I use enough of them that I'll stop in a dollar store and, once in a while, pick up inexpensive new brushes for immediate use in the garage. Regards, Marty ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: zootowerprr@webtv.net Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 20:21:49 -0400 Subject: [PRR] PRR-Erie RR crossing at Kouts Ind. MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Greetings, Can anyone tell me if there was an Erie RR tower operator working in KOUTS tower along side of the PRR operators or did the PRR control the Erie-PRR mainline crossings alone? I also noticed (from a movie of the PRR-Erie RR crossing) that there are Erie semaphores signals protecting their main crossing. Are those semaphores control from KOUTS Tower? I have a PRR Chicago Division,Western Region interlocking book from the 1960s and it does say the KOUTS Tower is operated PRR 50% and Erie RR 50%, so maybe there was a Erie RR employee working the tower, but I'm not sure. Any info is appreciated,thanks in advance. Dave Hopson ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: PKMac101@aol.com Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 20:31:40 EDT Subject: [PRR-FAX] PRR E8s on the move east.Left Altoona @ 7:14pm List, 5711 & 5809 are moving east at a rapid pace. They left Altoona at 7:14 pm. Not much daylight left to watch. Pat McKinney [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Yahoo! Domains - Claim yours for only $14.70 http://us.click.yahoo.com/Z1wmxD/DREIAA/yQLSAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PRR/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: PRR-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: PKMac101@aol.com Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 20:31:40 EDT Subject: [PRR] PRR E8s on the move east.Left Altoona @ 7:14pm X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com List, 5711 & 5809 are moving east at a rapid pace. They left Altoona at 7:14 pm. Not much daylight left to watch. Pat McKinney ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: zootowerprr@webtv.net Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 20:21:49 -0400 Subject: [PRR-FAX] PRR-Erie RR crossing at Kouts Ind. Greetings, Can anyone tell me if there was an Erie RR tower operator working in KOUTS tower along side of the PRR operators or did the PRR control the Erie-PRR mainline crossings alone? I also noticed (from a movie of the PRR-Erie RR crossing) that there are Erie semaphores signals protecting their main crossing. Are those semaphores control from KOUTS Tower? I have a PRR Chicago Division,Western Region interlocking book from the 1960s and it does say the KOUTS Tower is operated PRR 50% and Erie RR 50%, so maybe there was a Erie RR employee working the tower, but I'm not sure. Any info is appreciated,thanks in advance. Dave Hopson ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Yahoo! Domains - Claim yours for only $14.70 http://us.click.yahoo.com/Z1wmxD/DREIAA/yQLSAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PRR/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: PRR-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: zootowerprr@webtv.net Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 20:21:49 -0400 Subject: [PRR-FAX] PRR-Erie RR crossing at Kouts Ind. Greetings, Can anyone tell me if there was an Erie RR tower operator working in KOUTS tower along side of the PRR operators or did the PRR control the Erie-PRR mainline crossings alone? I also noticed (from a movie of the PRR-Erie RR crossing) that there are Erie semaphores signals protecting their main crossing. Are those semaphores control from KOUTS Tower? I have a PRR Chicago Division,Western Region interlocking book from the 1960s and it does say the KOUTS Tower is operated PRR 50% and Erie RR 50%, so maybe there was a Erie RR employee working the tower, but I'm not sure. Any info is appreciated,thanks in advance. Dave Hopson ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Yahoo! Domains - Claim yours for only $14.70 http://us.click.yahoo.com/Z1wmxD/DREIAA/yQLSAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PRR/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: PRR-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Gregg Mahlkov" Subject: Re: [PRR] PRR-Erie RR crossing at Kouts Ind. Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 20:55:27 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Dave, I can shed a little light on this as I was the VP-Traffic of the last railroad to operate the old Erie line, The Chicago & Indiana Railroad. The tower operator was a Conrail (by that time) employee and we had to notify CR 8 hours in advance of making a move so that they would be sure to have an employee on duty. I strongly suspect that the PRR always furnished the tower operator, but billed the Erie for half his wages, plus half to the cost of the electricity, light bulbs, pencils, paper, and yes, even toilet paper! We'd tell them we were coming, arrive, flash the headlight, and sound the horn for at least 10 minutes before they'd clear the interlocking, so yes, the tower definitely controlled the Erie signals. Gregg Mahlkov ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Monday, August 02, 2004 8:21 PM Subject: [PRR] PRR-Erie RR crossing at Kouts Ind. > Greetings, > > Can anyone tell me if there was an Erie RR tower operator > working in KOUTS tower along side of the PRR operators or did the PRR > control the Erie-PRR mainline crossings alone? I also noticed (from a > movie of the PRR-Erie RR crossing) that there are Erie semaphores > signals protecting their main crossing. Are those semaphores control > from KOUTS Tower? > I have a PRR Chicago Division,Western Region interlocking book > from the 1960s and it does say the KOUTS Tower is operated PRR 50% and > Erie RR 50%, so maybe there was a Erie RR employee working the tower, > but I'm not sure. > Any info is appreciated,thanks in advance. > > Dave Hopson > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: DWSNRHS@aol.com Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 22:53:48 EDT Subject: Re: [PRR] PRR E8s on the move east.Left Altoona @ 7:14pm X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com In a message dated 08/02/2004 8:39:24 PM Eastern Daylight Time, PKMac101@aol.com writes: List, 5711 & 5809 are moving east at a rapid pace. They left Altoona at 7:14 pm. Not much daylight left to watch. Pat McKinney HI PAT I CAUGHT THE TRAIN AT 24TH ST AND 8TH ST JUNIATA BETWEEN 7 PM AND 7:14. . QUITE A SHOW. DOES ANYONE HAVE A LIST OF THE PRIVATE VARNISH IN THE CONSIST? dave seidel ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Tue, 3 Aug 2004 15:11:13 -0400 Subject: [PRR] "Susquehanna Limited" Excursion Slated From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com The Harrisburg Chapter of the National Railway Historical Society has announced the "Susquehanna Limited" fall foliage excursion for Saturday, October 30th. Bennett's restored PRR E8's will lead an Amtrak fall foliage excursion out of Harrisburg east on the Amtrak main line to Philadelphia, south on the Northeast Corridor to Perryville, north up the "Port Road" through Columbia and across Shocks Mill Bridge, west through Enola, and returning to Harrisburg via the Rockville Bridge. This route was taken a few years ago but was plagued by fog. Here's another chance! Details are on the chapter's web site at http://nrhs-hbg.pennsyrr.com/Events/ ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: Prr1187@aol.com Date: Tue, 3 Aug 2004 22:47:44 EDT Subject: Re: [PRR] PRR E8s on the move east.Left Altoona @ 7:14pm X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Here was the consist in order headed westbound upon arrival at Dennison, Ohio: Engine 5711A Engine 5809A Pointe St. Charles Puget Sound Domed car Sierra Hotel Domed car Caritas Cimarron River Mount Vernon Dover Harbor Warrior Ridge PRR 120 It is my understanding that Pointe St. Charles went from Chicago to Pittsburgh to join the Buckeye Limited at Pittsburgh and was to separate at Pittsburgh on the return and join the Capital Limited back to Chicago. Regards, Dennis Sautters Canton, OH ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 09:18:33 -0400 Subject: [PRR] "Trackside on the PRR in Central Pennsylvania" From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Morning Sun's new book -- "Trackside on the PRR in Central Pennsylvania" -- has shipped. I received mine last evening. I only had time to give it a quick "go through", but I'll toss out these comments: * The MSB ad, despite the title, led you to believe it was more around Horseshoe Curve. Not so. A few pages east of Harrisburg, quite a few of Harrisburg, many up the Buffalo main line, and a lesser quantity out the main line. * Though some photos are out of focus, they are appreciated due to the new/unique content. Many show the structural content of the railroad, rather than just the loco at the head of a train. * Bonus for me... many photos of Harrisburg that I hadn't seen before, including some from October 1954, just one month off from my modeling date! ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Bill Volkmer" Subject: RE: [PRR] "Trackside on the PRR in Central Pennsylvania" Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 10:04:18 -0400 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <3501579F8815D511AEC6009027CCB5D35E3EE5@HERZOGMGMT> Return-Path: bvolkmer@herzogcompanies.com X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Aug 2004 13:51:02.0519 (UTC) FILETIME=[148C9870:01C47A2A] Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com This is a personal note to Dan Cupper because his a.o.l e-mails from me always "bounce". Dan was requesting information (from me) as to what year the Enola Roundhouse was torn down. My message to Dan is that the photo on page 23 of the subject book shows that by 1968 when the photo was taken, the structure had been razed. Hope this helps. Bill Volkmer -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Jerry Britton Sent: Wednesday, August 04, 2004 9:19 AM To: PRR-Talk LIST Subject: [PRR] "Trackside on the PRR in Central Pennsylvania" Morning Sun's new book -- "Trackside on the PRR in Central Pennsylvania" -- has shipped. I received mine last evening. I only had time to give it a quick "go through", but I'll toss out these comments: * The MSB ad, despite the title, led you to believe it was more around Horseshoe Curve. Not so. A few pages east of Harrisburg, quite a few of Harrisburg, many up the Buffalo main line, and a lesser quantity out the main line. * Though some photos are out of focus, they are appreciated due to the new/unique content. Many show the structural content of the railroad, rather than just the loco at the head of a train. * Bonus for me... many photos of Harrisburg that I hadn't seen before, including some from October 1954, just one month off from my modeling date! ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 10:02:28 -0400 Subject: Re: [PRR] "Trackside on the PRR in Central Pennsylvania" From: Jerry Britton X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Wednesday, August 4, 2004, at 10:04 AM, Bill Volkmer wrote: > Dan was requesting information (from me) as to what year the Enola > Roundhouse was torn down. > > My message to Dan is that the photo on page 23 of the subject book > shows > that by 1968 when the photo was taken, the structure had been razed. > Hope this helps. The turntable is still there, and I've seen it in operation, turning diesels! Is it the original bridge, or was it modernized at some point? ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 13:59:15 -0400 Subject: [PRR] TANGENT - John Armstrong Memorial Service From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com If anyone is interested... John Armstrong's Memorial service will be at 3PM on Sunday, August 15th, at Northwood Presbyterian Church in Silver Spring MD. (1200 University Blvd West, at the intersection of University and Arcola.) -- From the LDSIG list. I have seen many PRR layouts based on his plans. ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Ted Andrews" Subject: RE: [PRR] TANGENT - John Armstrong Memorial Service Date: Wed, 04 Aug 2004 18:28:19 +0000 Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 16:50:45 -0400 (Eastern Standard Time) From: "sjlash" Subject: [PRR] John Armstrong X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hi Guys, I probably missed some "posts" on my end after yesterday aftern= oon's weather. Would you be kind enough to furnish the details again abou= t John Armstrong. = Thanks Jim ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Bob Zoeller" Subject: [PRR] RSD15 (AS24m) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 07:44:35 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I note Broadway Limited has announced these. What are the major = spotting differences (besides, I surmise, a steam generator) between = these and the RSD7 (APS24ms)? Bob Zoeller ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Bill Volkmer" Subject: RE: [PRR] RSD15 (AS24m) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 09:20:16 -0400 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <3501579F8815D511AEC6009027CCB5D35E40C0@HERZOGMGMT> Return-Path: bvolkmer@herzogcompanies.com X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Aug 2004 13:06:57.0302 (UTC) FILETIME=[164A4360:01C47AED] Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Externally the RSD-15 did not have the water tank ahead of the fuel tank. Bubt the big difference was INTERNAL. The RSD-7 (APS-24ms) had an (old style) Alco 244-H engine which was a 16 cylinder version of the RS3 or, if you will, a modernized PA-2 engine. The RSD-15 had an Alco 16 cylinder 251 model, which was a stretched RS-11 12-cylinder model. As far as I know, only the C&O and Santa Fe had the 244 models other than the Pennsy. Bill Volkmerm -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Bob Zoeller Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 8:45 AM To: PRR-talk@dsop.com Subject: [PRR] RSD15 (AS24m) I note Broadway Limited has announced these. What are the major spotting differences (besides, I surmise, a steam generator) between these and the RSD7 (APS24ms)? Bob Zoeller ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 06:42:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Bill Daniels Subject: [PRR] Re: Fwd: FW: NEW PRODUCTS: ALCO RSD15 & PRR K4s Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 06:42:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Bill Daniels Subject: [PRR] Re: Fwd: FW: NEW PRODUCTS: ALCO RSD15 & PRR K4s From: "Gatwood, Elden -- Tt, Inc." Subject: RE: [PRR] RSD15 (AS24m) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 07:40:10 -0700 From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Bill Volkmer Subject: RE: [PRR] RSD15 (AS24m) From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Bob Subject: [PRR] RSD15 (AS24m) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 10:35:30 -0400 Subject: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Since complete details were not posted, here is a PSA... Broadway Limited Imports, LLC is proud to announce its newest series of=20= products, "Paragon Series Platinum". PSP products are constructed out=20 of diecast metal for greater weight & heft and are detailed even more=20 immaculately than the original Paragon Series=99 products. All products=20= bearing the PSP seal are designed and built with one concept in=20 mind=97"To be, without question, the highest quality model railroading=20= product money can buy." Broadway Limited Imports is confident that the=20= PSP line of products will define the top-tier of model railroading. The first release in the Paragon Series Platinum line is the much=20 requested PRR K4s. The K-4s=92 were the most outstandingly successful = and=20 recognized class of locomotives on the Pennsylvania Railroad. 425 units=20= were built from 1914 to 1928 and were numbered in random order (a=20 Pennsy practice) from #8 to #8378. Serving through both World Wars and beyond, even the modern Duplexes=20 did not replace them as the mainline steam passenger engines. Our K-4s models are being made of die-cast construction with many, many=20= added-on details to rival in appearance models costing 3 times the=20 price. We also supply a spare driver pair with traction tires for those=20= who operate their trains on steep grades. We are expecting a very limited quantity of our HO PRR K-4s models by=20 October of 2004, and of course, they will be fully decorated and=20 feature our Quantum=99 sound and control system! stk# Item Description 321 PRR K-4s #646 w/slatted pilot, headlight on smokebox front, short=20 lettering, HO 322 PRR K-4s #1453 w/slatted pilot, headlight on smokebox front, short=20= lettering, HO 323 PRR K-4s w/slatted pilot, headlight on smokebox front, unlettered,=20= HO 324 PRR K-4s #5451 w/slatted pilot, generator on smokebox front, HO 325 PRR K-4s #7279 w/slatted pilot, generator on smokebox front, HO 326 PRR K-4s w/slatted pilot, generator on smokebox front, unlettered,=20= HO 327 PRR K-4s #5418 w/cast pilot, generator on smokebox front, HO 328 PRR K-4s #1361 w/cast pilot, generator on smokebox front, HO 329 PRR K-4s w/cast pilot, generator on smokebox front, unlettered, HO MSRP - $450 Expected: October 2004. Preordering=A0is highly recommended as quantities will be very limited. ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com= ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 11:03:02 -0400 Subject: [PRR] Bennett's E8's on Trains Site! From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: <8C3225AC-E6F0-11D8-A168-000393835C88@pennsyrr.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com The "Photo of the Day" on the Trains web site features the excursion train led by Bennett's E8's returning from Dennison, Ohio, on August 2nd... http://www.trains.com/photogallery/ gallery_large.asp?idObjectLibraryGUID=%7BDB3B8E93-BA09-4148-8231- 520FAD411FC1%7D ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: ndbprr@att.net Subject: [PRR] O Winston Link Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2004 15:51:57 +0000 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Nice article on the back page of The Wall Street Journal today regarding the opening of the O. Winston Link museum in Roanoke. Article includes the drive in movie shot with the Y passing in the background. Whoever reviewed his work is admitidly not a railfan but he gushes pretty good about the photography. PRR connection - the railroad station which houses the museum was designed by Raymond Loewy in the forties according to the article and one of my favorite pictures Link shot is of the four side by side GG1 noses from a low angle in Pennsy Power. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 13:17:10 -0400 Subject: [PRR] BLI K4s Road Numbers and 1954 Assignments From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: <491838A4-E703-11D8-A168-000393835C88@pennsyrr.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I checked the road numbers BLI has selected for their K4s offerings and looked them up in the MP229 from March of 1954. They were assigned as follows: #646 Middle Division #1361 New York Division (later moved to Horseshoe Curve; now being restored) #1453 New York Division #5418 Pittsburgh Division #5451 Eastern Division #7279 Atlantic Division Of course, the 1954 assignments have no bearing on the era that BLI is presenting the road number as. Four of the six road numbers will have the slatted pilots and two the cast pilots. ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: Subject: [PRR] RSD_15 alco Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 17:28:36 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com the big alco RSD-15 looks like it will finally be built. YAY !! the = question now is how will they handle the fuel/ water tank arrangement = under the frame. the p.r.r. version had only one ( fuel ) tank under the frame, if i = remember correctly. my guess is that b.l.i. will want to make the = two tank version so that there will be room for the speaker.......then again maybe a smaller = unit could be shoehorned into the single tank. any thoughts on this = ??? ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 07:52:08 -0400 From: Don Murphy Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at out001.verizon.net from [4.41.106.228] at Fri, 6 Aug 2004 06:52:10 -0500 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I own several BLI engines and think they're great but the $450.00 price tag on the K4 makes me think of what a great deal my PFM and Red Ball K4s are! Don Murphy Jerry Britton wrote: > Since complete details were not posted, here is a PSA... > > Broadway Limited Imports, LLC is proud to announce its newest series > of products, "Paragon Series Platinum". PSP products are constructed > out of diecast metal for greater weight & heft and are detailed even > more immaculately than the original Paragon Series™ products. All > products bearing the PSP seal are designed and built with one concept > in mind—"To be, without question, the highest quality model > railroading product money can buy." Broadway Limited Imports is > confident that the PSP line of products will define the top-tier of > model railroading. > > The first release in the Paragon Series Platinum line is the much > requested PRR K4s. The K-4s’ were the most outstandingly successful > and recognized class of locomotives on the Pennsylvania Railroad. 425 > units were built from 1914 to 1928 and were numbered in random order > (a Pennsy practice) from #8 to #8378. > > Serving through both World Wars and beyond, even the modern Duplexes > did not replace them as the mainline steam passenger engines. > > Our K-4s models are being made of die-cast construction with many, > many added-on details to rival in appearance models costing 3 times > the price. We also supply a spare driver pair with traction tires for > those who operate their trains on steep grades. > > We are expecting a very limited quantity of our HO PRR K-4s models by > October of 2004, and of course, they will be fully decorated and > feature our Quantum™ sound and control system! > > stk# Item Description > > 321 PRR K-4s #646 w/slatted pilot, headlight on smokebox front, short > lettering, HO > > 322 PRR K-4s #1453 w/slatted pilot, headlight on smokebox front, short > lettering, HO > > 323 PRR K-4s w/slatted pilot, headlight on smokebox front, unlettered, HO > > 324 PRR K-4s #5451 w/slatted pilot, generator on smokebox front, HO > > 325 PRR K-4s #7279 w/slatted pilot, generator on smokebox front, HO > > 326 PRR K-4s w/slatted pilot, generator on smokebox front, unlettered, HO > > 327 PRR K-4s #5418 w/cast pilot, generator on smokebox front, HO > > 328 PRR K-4s #1361 w/cast pilot, generator on smokebox front, HO > > 329 PRR K-4s w/cast pilot, generator on smokebox front, unlettered, HO > > MSRP - $450 > > Expected: October 2004. > > Preordering is highly recommended as quantities will be very limited. > ----------------------------------------------------------- > Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS > Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. > "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! > http://kc.pennsyrr.com > "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... > http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Bob Zoeller" Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 07:52:56 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Don Murphy" > I own several BLI engines and think they're great but the $450.00 price > tag on the K4 makes me think of what a great deal my PFM and Red Ball > K4s are! The decision to make these "platinum" models at a price 58% higher than the M1b has put me off as well, to the extent I have ordered one instead of the two I had orignally considered. To have to jump $400 (list) over my Bowser or Bachmann to update 50 year old tooling or get a more appropriate tender or pulling power in one loco seems a bit much. This marketing move (further upscale) by BLI has helped me make another decision, though. I had been trying to decide what loco to move my Soundtraxx decoder to from my Bowser M1, now that I have the BLI version. Originally I had hesitated moving it to my I1 as BLI is coming out with one. Since the PFM United I1 runs so flawlessly, now I know. I can only shudder to think what a "platinum" I1 will cost. To those who say the BLI loco is a value, I don't disagree. However, I wonder how closely the two markets, the super-detailed brass collector and the operators, will come together to meet BLI's expectations. I have already cut my purchase in half, being an operator. As previously stated, I don't need superdetail which will get knocked off in operation; I just want an in-scale loco with "satisfactory" detail, appropriate tender, correct driver diameter, and the power to pull more than its own tender. Actually, I originally wanted two of them :-). And by the way, the emphasis on the "limited run" aspect of this offering makes this smell like the collector brass market all over again. Bob Zoeller ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 09:10:14 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-reply-to: <002301c47bb4$4c2f1420$6401a8c0@userrtilb5vp8t> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcR7tGHlwZhlq3D3QjysxC150MxCtwAAcSpA Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Perhaps BLI would consider a marketing experiment. Release two version of the I1, one a Paragon Platinum, and one a lesser detailed Powerhouse series. They could see which version produces the most total profit for BLI. regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Bob Zoeller Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 8:53 AM To: PRR-talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement ----- Original Message ----- From: "Don Murphy" > I own several BLI engines and think they're great but the $450.00 price > tag on the K4 makes me think of what a great deal my PFM and Red Ball > K4s are! The decision to make these "platinum" models at a price 58% higher than the M1b has put me off as well, to the extent I have ordered one instead of the two I had orignally considered. To have to jump $400 (list) over my Bowser or Bachmann to update 50 year old tooling or get a more appropriate tender or pulling power in one loco seems a bit much. This marketing move (further upscale) by BLI has helped me make another decision, though. I had been trying to decide what loco to move my Soundtraxx decoder to from my Bowser M1, now that I have the BLI version. Originally I had hesitated moving it to my I1 as BLI is coming out with one. Since the PFM United I1 runs so flawlessly, now I know. I can only shudder to think what a "platinum" I1 will cost. To those who say the BLI loco is a value, I don't disagree. However, I wonder how closely the two markets, the super-detailed brass collector and the operators, will come together to meet BLI's expectations. I have already cut my purchase in half, being an operator. As previously stated, I don't need superdetail which will get knocked off in operation; I just want an in-scale loco with "satisfactory" detail, appropriate tender, correct driver diameter, and the power to pull more than its own tender. Actually, I originally wanted two of them :-). And by the way, the emphasis on the "limited run" aspect of this offering makes this smell like the collector brass market all over again. Bob Zoeller ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Sam Vastano" Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 09:40:48 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Aug 2004 13:39:15.0949 (UTC) FILETIME=[C43A11D0:01C47BBA] Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Maybe this is the marketing experiment? To see how deep people's pockets are? I can't wait for someone else to come out with a decoder/sound that could be retrofitted to brass etc. that will work DCC or DC and see how far BLI's price will drop! Just my 2 cents SamV ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Miller" To: "'Bob Zoeller'" ; Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 9:10 AM Subject: RE: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement > Perhaps BLI would consider a marketing experiment. Release two version of > the I1, one a Paragon Platinum, and one a lesser detailed Powerhouse series. > They could see which version produces the most total profit for BLI. > > regards, > > Andy Miller > -----Original Message----- > From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Bob Zoeller > Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 8:53 AM > To: PRR-talk@dsop.com > Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Don Murphy" > > > > I own several BLI engines and think they're great but the $450.00 price > > tag on the K4 makes me think of what a great deal my PFM and Red Ball > > K4s are! > > The decision to make these "platinum" models at a price 58% higher than the > M1b has put me off as well, to the extent I have ordered one instead of the > two I had orignally considered. To have to jump $400 (list) over my Bowser > or Bachmann to update 50 year old tooling or get a more appropriate tender > or pulling power in one loco seems a bit much. > > This marketing move (further upscale) by BLI has helped me make another > decision, though. I had been trying to decide what loco to move my > Soundtraxx decoder to from my Bowser M1, now that I have the BLI version. > Originally I had hesitated moving it to my I1 as BLI is coming out with one. > Since the PFM United I1 runs so flawlessly, now I know. I can only shudder > to think what a "platinum" I1 will cost. > > To those who say the BLI loco is a value, I don't disagree. However, I > wonder how closely the two markets, the super-detailed brass collector and > the operators, will come together to meet BLI's expectations. I have > already cut my purchase in half, being an operator. As previously stated, I > don't need superdetail which will get knocked off in operation; I just want > an in-scale loco with "satisfactory" detail, appropriate tender, correct > driver diameter, and the power to pull more than its own tender. Actually, I > originally wanted two of them :-). > > And by the way, the emphasis on the "limited run" aspect of this offering > makes this smell like the collector brass market all over again. > > Bob Zoeller > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Ted Andrews" Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 13:44:31 +0000 From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 10:11:35 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-reply-to: X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcR7vDgwvNvr2+A1TmSHXLkFDeZaCAAApJFg Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Sound and DCC decoders mean nothing to collectors. Many of them never open the box. Certainly they NEVER do anything as foolish putting couplers on their engines! So BLI must still see the model RRers as their primary market. How they imagine that model Rrers will flock to $500 locos is beyond me. They good news is that perhaps the traction tired optional driver will be available separately and that with some work it can be fitted to Bachman K4s to help them pull. regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Ted Andrews Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 9:45 AM To: bobspf@wi.rr.com; PRR-talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Bob Zoeller wrote: "I have already cut my purchase in half, being an operator. As previously stated, I don't need superdetail which will get knocked off in operation; I just want an in-scale loco with "satisfactory" detail, appropriate tender, correct driver diameter, and the power to pull more than its own tender. Actually, I originally wanted two of them :-)." "And by the way, the emphasis on the "limited run" aspect of this offering makes this smell like the collector brass market all over again." I quite agree. The price is making me reconsider my purchases as well. I was thinking of two and may go down to one as well. The retail price is $450 but the price that you will see it for sale will be in the high $300's....still a salty price. I think that BLI must remember that their market is for modelers who, for the most part, want to run the engines on layouts and are interested in performance. Pricey, highly detailed, limited edition engines are more geared towards collectors who rarely run their engines. Ted Andrews ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Edmund Burbage" Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 10:21:54 -0400 Subject: [PRR] Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 08:03:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Bill Daniels Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 11:20:28 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-reply-to: <20040806150322.96671.qmail@web52605.mail.yahoo.com> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcR7x1UeirBP/O0GSRC9n/cV6ngUzQAAM8ZA Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I bought my PFM K4 for list price $49.95 ! I have bought used Bowser K4s for $25, and rebuilt them. Any of these locos can handle a 17 car train over the long 2% grades at my club. With the traction tire, I am sure the BLI K4 will do as well. But neither the T1 or the M1 can match that. It sure would be nice if BLI or an after market maker(Greenway?) Would offer drivers with traction tires for the older BLI locos. The only problem which must be considered is whether the increase in tractive effort would raise the current draw of the motor above the limit of the QSI receiver. regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Bill Daniels Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 11:03 AM To: PRR-talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Bob, List and all... I'm not going to defend BLI's pricing on these but I would like to point out a couple of things... First of all, the street price is shaping up to be $350.00 for these, only slightly less than $30.00 over the T1's and J1's. Secondly, I seem to remember some people on this list complaining about the level of cast-on detail on BLI's previous offerings. Now BLI seems to be responding to these complaints by offering a higher level of detail...(and on the premier passenger locomotive of the PRR to boot... wonder how much ruckus would have been raised if BLI had offered this as a NYC J3 instead?) Note to Bob Z...Where oh where are you buying Bowser K4s's at 50 bucks? I remember paying that much for one back in the late 60's. Today the delux kit (which is the only one to get, since it has most of the proper detail supplied) lists for $239.95...then you have to buy a new motor (Helix Humper/Alco/Realistic Lighting/whoever is selling these now), additional details (to supplement what Bowser dosen't offer), DCC controler/sound card, and THEN you either get to build it or have to build it (depending on your prespective), paint it and letter it, and deal with the pie-tin sized rivet detail. Don't get me wrong...I like my Bowser kits. But I most likely won't be getting another one (well...unless BLI does a straight M1 or B6sb) It just ain't worth it. As for brass...just fuggetabout it. 30 to 40 year old brass models (even the PFM models) are very obsolete by todays standards. Many are in serious need of through rebuilding. They remind me of my 72 MGB...spend 3 or 4 grand on an complete engine build, drive it for maybe 50k miles and do it all over again...with NO air, power assisted steering (somebody's getting spoiled), leaks like a sieve (hell, the Brit's drive the things in the rain with the top DOWN!) poor acceleration and handling. And the faithful just go on and on about "charachter". But they are "good enough" for many of us...(I don't drive mine anymore...bought a used Miata last year and don't regret it ONE BIT.) And I just got an update on a street price (literally just came in as I was writing this) of $330.00...(the RSD15's are also down as well). As for "limited run"...face it, that's a fact of life in today's imported market. I don't like it anymore than you do, but when you import "runs" (to use an old brass importer term)(funny thing...nobody whined about brass being limited run) that's the way it is. Nobody in today's market can afford to sit on inventory for any length of time. I remember when a local hobby shop got a desirable model in we would all want it...and when it sold (six months to a year later) whine that "I wanted that"... looking back to those days I can now understand why that shop (like so many these days) is no longer with us. I'm looking forward to my K4s...I need power for my pre-war Broadway. Who knows, maybe BLI will do the streamlined versions. Looks to me that there is just no pleasing some guys... Bill Daniels __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 50x more storage than other providers! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 08:33:48 -0700 (PDT) From: Bill Daniels Subject: RE: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement > From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] > Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement From: "Bob Zoeller" Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 11:27:32 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Miller" > > They good news is that perhaps the traction tired optional driver will be > available separately and that with some work it can be fitted to Bachman K4s > to help them pull. Unfortunately, the Bachmann K4s driver is undersized, which is what makes it look odd. I hope that a $300 plus loco will have the correct diameter drivers :-). Bob Zoeller ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Bob Zoeller" Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 11:50:38 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Daniels" > Secondly, I seem to remember some people on this list > complaining about the level of cast-on detail on BLI's > previous offerings. Not I > > Note to Bob Z...Where oh where are you buying Bowser > K4s's at 50 bucks? Of course you are right, Bill. They are no bargain today. I am talking about reviving the one in my storage locker :-). > As for brass...just fuggetabout it. 30 to 40 year old > brass models (even the PFM models) are very obsolete > by todays standards. Many are in serious need of > through rebuilding. If you have any PFM United K4s pre beauty treatment around, let me know. I am assuming they on a par with the I1. A simple remotoring for DCC and you are set. My I1 easily runs on a par with the best Atlas and Stewart diesels. I don't have any recent Key steamers around (and neither do my fellow club members ) to compare it to :-). I agree, though, that old brass is hit or miss. I had excellent luck on Gem J1 (which I am now selling) , G5, and H10, even a Red Ball B6s, but my Gem E6s had a lot of brittle solder joints . Still, nice loco with a little bit of resoldering. On the list to remotor for DCC. Bob Zoeller ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Bob Zoeller" Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 11:59:41 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Miller" It > sure would be nice if BLI or an after market maker(Greenway?) Would offer > drivers with traction tires for the older BLI locos. The only problem which > must be considered is whether the increase in tractive effort would raise > the current draw of the motor above the limit of the QSI receiver. Want a totally unproven answer?:-) When I asked, BLI at least verbally suggested the article on adding about 9 ounces or so of lead to the M1b to me. I couldn't find a space for more than 4 ounces (which helps considerably by the way) but I would assume if you can add 9 ounces of lead and not fry the receiver, a traction tire shouldn't harm it either. Another unproven assumption I would make (while I am winging it): maybe the receiver in the T1 and M1b has same limits as J1. I'll ask the question on the QSI list. Bob Zoeller ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: [PRR] Motor insulation for DCC (was:BLI K4s Announcement) Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 13:08:54 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-reply-to: <002b01c47bd5$80cf8270$6401a8c0@userrtilb5vp8t> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcR71pI+9GS/ef5jSKeu+T4qOtr+TgAAN0fA Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com The only motor requirement for DCC is that both brushes be insulated from the frame. On most older locos, one brush was grounded to the motor chassis. Its usually easy to correct that. Sometimes it means nothing more than slipping a piece of tubing over the brush spring. There may be other reasons to change to a can motor, like better tractive force, lower current draw, or smoother operation. But I wouldn't spend $30 -40 just to insulate a brush. regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Bob Zoeller Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 12:51 PM To: PRR-talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Daniels" > Secondly, I seem to remember some people on this list complaining > about the level of cast-on detail on BLI's previous offerings. Not I > > Note to Bob Z...Where oh where are you buying Bowser K4s's at 50 > bucks? Of course you are right, Bill. They are no bargain today. I am talking about reviving the one in my storage locker :-). > As for brass...just fuggetabout it. 30 to 40 year old brass models > (even the PFM models) are very obsolete by todays standards. Many are > in serious need of through rebuilding. If you have any PFM United K4s pre beauty treatment around, let me know. I am assuming they on a par with the I1. A simple remotoring for DCC and you are set. My I1 easily runs on a par with the best Atlas and Stewart diesels. I don't have any recent Key steamers around (and neither do my fellow club members ) to compare it to :-). I agree, though, that old brass is hit or miss. I had excellent luck on Gem J1 (which I am now selling) , G5, and H10, even a Red Ball B6s, but my Gem E6s had a lot of brittle solder joints . Still, nice loco with a little bit of resoldering. On the list to remotor for DCC. Bob Zoeller ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 13:10:54 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-reply-to: <003601c47bd6$c4448860$6401a8c0@userrtilb5vp8t> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcR718jIq2EyTphXQIGHrJSiFXbuIQAAHAFg Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Bob, Where did you put the weight on the M1? The only space I found (and filled with Pb) was behind the motor. regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Bob Zoeller Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 1:00 PM To: PRR-talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Miller" It > sure would be nice if BLI or an after market maker(Greenway?) Would > offer drivers with traction tires for the older BLI locos. The only > problem which > must be considered is whether the increase in tractive effort would > raise the current draw of the motor above the limit of the QSI receiver. Want a totally unproven answer?:-) When I asked, BLI at least verbally suggested the article on adding about 9 ounces or so of lead to the M1b to me. I couldn't find a space for more than 4 ounces (which helps considerably by the way) but I would assume if you can add 9 ounces of lead and not fry the receiver, a traction tire shouldn't harm it either. Another unproven assumption I would make (while I am winging it): maybe the receiver in the T1 and M1b has same limits as J1. I'll ask the question on the QSI list. Bob Zoeller ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: [PRR] PRR Steam loco headlights Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 13:50:48 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com As I work to convert my many locos to DCC I have at least one problem I have not yet resolved. All of my steam engines have been equipped with diode drop constant voltage headlights. These won't work on both DC and DCC. One of the few solutions which will work is to replace them with white LEDS. But putting LEDs in the PRR modern headlights seems almost impossible. How does one fit the square backs of the LEDs with exposed rigid leads into the headlight casting and keep everything insulted from the body? Has anyone succeeded in this? Modelers of other roads don't have this problem for two reasons: first most headlight housings are drum shaped with a flat back, as were the older PR headlights; and second most RRs mounted their headlights on the center of the smokebox, so the lead can just come straight back into the boiler with minimum exposure. regards, Andy Miller ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: [PRR] PRR Steam loco headlights Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 13:50:48 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com As I work to convert my many locos to DCC I have at least one problem I have not yet resolved. All of my steam engines have been equipped with diode drop constant voltage headlights. These won't work on both DC and DCC. One of the few solutions which will work is to replace them with white LEDS. But putting LEDs in the PRR modern headlights seems almost impossible. How does one fit the square backs of the LEDs with exposed rigid leads into the headlight casting and keep everything insulted from the body? Has anyone succeeded in this? Modelers of other roads don't have this problem for two reasons: first most headlight housings are drum shaped with a flat back, as were the older PR headlights; and second most RRs mounted their headlights on the center of the smokebox, so the lead can just come straight back into the boiler with minimum exposure. regards, Andy Miller ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Bob Zoeller" Subject: Re: [PRR] Motor insulation for DCC (was:BLI K4s Announcement) Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 13:01:14 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com My J weighs 3 pounds and when it stalled the first time, it had a smoke unit where the decoder was. I replaced that open frame motor with a low-speed high-torque NWSL for nearly $30. Top speed about 65mph. Ditto for my I1. My E6 and a couple others in line will get a $4 can motor. Seems to have good performance on the bench (I got 10 for $40 including shipping), but I'll see how it holds up in use. At $4 my investment risk is low :-). ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Miller" To: "'Bob Zoeller'" ; ; Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 12:08 PM Subject: [PRR] Motor insulation for DCC (was:BLI K4s Announcement) > There may be other reasons to change to a can motor, like better tractive > force, lower current draw, or smoother operation. But I wouldn't spend $30 > -40 just to insulate a brush. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Dominic Mazoch" Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 18:58:45 GMT Subject: [PRR] Models Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 14:55:05 -0500 Subject: [PRR] Re: BLI K-4s Annoucement From: John Sheets Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 14:55:05 -0500 Subject: [PRR] Re: BLI K-4s Annoucement From: John Sheets Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 16:11:52 -0400 From: TGREGMRTN@aol.com Subject: RE: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Andy writes... ==============================================================Sound and DCC decoders mean nothing to collectors. Many of them never open the box. Certainly they NEVER do anything as foolish putting couplers on their engines! So BLI must still see the model RRers as their primary market. How they imagine that model Rrers will flock to $500 locos is beyond me. The good news is that perhaps the traction tired optional driver will be available separately and that with some work it can be fitted to Bachman K4s to help them pull. regards, Andy Miller ============================================================== Gize, I am cross posting this to PRR-Modeling as well as these folks need to be informred as well. I sent the announcement to AL so he could do the honors of posting the announcement and it will be in TKM as well. I have know for several days now that the DL600b's and the K4's were coming. The folks I buy my BLI from have announced the K4's at $330.00 and the DL600b's at $197.50 (PRR). Tis makes them a lot more affordable and attractive. You might see them a bit lower we shall see. BLI has obviously taken the market by surprise with the announcement and there are those that will banter the products, I call them non-believers. BLI can caputure much more of the market if their prototype research is enhanced and theuir attenton to detail is more closely monitored than with in the past. I think all you need do is look at what Life Like did with the RS-11 in the Proto 1000 series hitting new heights with the extreme attention to detail. We will pay for detail like door latches, see through steps, cut levers and all that we have come to expect first from the brass importers and then from the plastic manufacturers. WE deserve it! The attention to detail justifies the price, and we can only hope they are watchng as we vote with our dollars in this hobby. Andy you are correct sir... Greg Martin ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 16:37:58 -0400 From: Don Murphy Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at out007.verizon.net from [4.41.106.228] at Fri, 6 Aug 2004 15:38:00 -0500 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hearing the street price of 330.00 is OK. Maybe I'll get one. I was planning on three and putting the brass into semi-retirement. Adding a Soundtrax decoder to a $200.00 RedBall or a $250.00 PFM K4 is sounding really good right now. They don't have cast on details and I know I can fix them no matter what happens. I've been cruising Ebay this morning and the depressed price of brass looks so good to me as a buyer compared to the list price on the BLI K4. I won a Sakara(?) PFM B&O 0-4-0 for $80.00 the other day. A deal indeed. Old Varney 0-4-0's with Central Valley valve gear go at times for almost as much. Don Murphy The Docter of Steam Bill Daniels wrote: >Bob, List and all... > >I'm not going to defend BLI's pricing on these but I >would like to point out a couple of things... > >First of all, the street price is shaping up to be >$350.00 for these, only slightly less than $30.00 over >the T1's and J1's. > >Secondly, I seem to remember some people on this list >complaining about the level of cast-on detail on BLI's >previous offerings. Now BLI seems to be responding to >these complaints by offering a higher level of >detail...(and on the premier passenger locomotive of >the PRR to boot... wonder how much ruckus would have >been raised if BLI had offered this as a NYC J3 >instead?) > >Note to Bob Z...Where oh where are you buying Bowser >K4s's at 50 bucks? I remember paying that much for one >back in the late 60's. Today the delux kit (which is >the only one to get, since it has most of the proper >detail supplied) lists for $239.95...then you have to >buy a new motor (Helix Humper/Alco/Realistic >Lighting/whoever is selling these now), additional >details (to supplement what Bowser dosen't offer), DCC >controler/sound card, and THEN you either get to build >it or have to build it (depending on your >prespective), paint it and letter it, and deal with >the pie-tin sized rivet detail. > >Don't get me wrong...I like my Bowser kits. But I most >likely won't be getting another one (well...unless BLI >does a straight M1 or B6sb) It just ain't worth it. > >As for brass...just fuggetabout it. 30 to 40 year old >brass models (even the PFM models) are very obsolete >by todays standards. Many are in serious need of >through rebuilding. They remind me of my 72 >MGB...spend 3 or 4 grand on an complete engine build, >drive it for maybe 50k miles and do it all over >again...with NO air, power assisted steering >(somebody's getting spoiled), leaks like a sieve >(hell, the Brit's drive the things in the rain with >the top DOWN!) poor acceleration and handling. And the >faithful just go on and on about "charachter". But >they are "good enough" for many of us...(I don't drive >mine anymore...bought a used Miata last year and don't >regret it ONE BIT.) > >And I just got an update on a street price (literally >just came in as I was writing this) of $330.00...(the >RSD15's are also down as well). > >As for "limited run"...face it, that's a fact of life >in today's imported market. I don't like it anymore >than you do, but when you import "runs" (to use an old >brass importer term)(funny thing...nobody whined about >brass being limited run) that's the way it is. Nobody >in today's market can afford to sit on inventory for >any length of time. I remember when a local hobby shop >got a desirable model in we would all want it...and >when it sold (six months to a year later) whine that >"I wanted that"... looking back to those days I can >now understand why that shop (like so many these days) >is no longer with us. > >I'm looking forward to my K4s...I need power for my >pre-war Broadway. Who knows, maybe BLI will do the >streamlined versions. Looks to me that there is just >no pleasing some guys... > >Bill Daniels > > > > >__________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >Yahoo! Mail - 50x more storage than other providers! >http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail >----------------------------------------------------------------------- >For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 18:35:11 -0400 (GMT-04:00) From: ealauterbach@earthlink.net Subject: [PRR] BLI K7 Stock Car Pictures X-Mailer: Earthlink Zoo Mail 1.0 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com The Broadway Limited website now has pictures of the upcoming Pennsy based stock car on it. It looks pretty good from the pictures. Speaking of pictures, I wonder how long before pictures are up of the K4 that is coming out. Eric ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: Randy Williamson Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 22:25:16 -0500 Subject: [PRR-FAX] RSD-15s Assignments According to the January, 1958 Assignment sheets. 8611-8616 were assigned to the Philadelphia Region. January 1962 showed 8611 - New York Region, 8612 - Northern Region, 8613 - New York Region, 8614-8616 - Northern Region. By May, 1967, they had be renumbered in the 6811-6816 series and were assigned to Conway. Dayna & Randy Williamson http://prrfreight.trainstuffllc.com/ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PRR/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: PRR-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 22:25:16 -0500 From: Randy Williamson Subject: [PRR] RSD-15s Assignments From: RDG2124@aol.com Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 23:47:12 EDT Subject: [PRR] P70 Coach Wheel Diameter X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com What size wheels were used on these coaches? 36" Dia.? Thank you, Evan Leisey RCT&HS 346 PRRT&HS 7487 PRRT&HS (Phila.) 2036 CNJ 2003 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: RDG2124@aol.com Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 23:47:12 EDT Subject: [PRR] P70 Coach Wheel Diameter X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com What size wheels were used on these coaches? 36" Dia.? Thank you, Evan Leisey RCT&HS 346 PRRT&HS 7487 PRRT&HS (Phila.) 2036 CNJ 2003 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: John Frantz Subject: [PRR] B6 Roster Date: Sat, 07 Aug 2004 09:10:17 -0400 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new .250 at suscom.net Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Listers, Is there an engine roster availible where I can find out=20 which B6 class engines didn't have a slop-back tender in=20 its career? I ask beacuse i'm about to acquire one for a=20 very good price that is DCC equipped.=20 Best Regards, John Designer, Modeler, Consultant Mount Vernon Shops Baltimore, MD Specializing in HO & N scale for the Pennsy modeler. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Sat, 7 Aug 2004 14:06:11 -0700 (PDT) From: Doug Kisala Subject: [PRR] Bethlehem/Intermountain B60b in the flesh Date: Sat, 7 Aug 2004 22:28:33 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K7 Stock Car Pictures From: smithbf@vetmed.auburn.edu X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com > The Broadway Limited website now has pictures of the upcoming Pennsy based > stock car on it. It looks pretty good from the pictures. Speaking of > pictures, I wonder how long before pictures are up of the K4 that is > coming out. > Eric Interesting... I got all paranoid reading the latest RMC review of the N&W H-2A. RMC says that the difference between the Paragon cars (H-2A) and the Powerhouse cars (eg. the K7A) is that the Powerhouse are supposed to have less detail, like molded on grabs... Fortunately, it appears that the K7A has seperate grabs, even if they do look a bit odd on the pre-production model. Issues I do see: 1) Klunky hangers on the top of the door 2) Oversize top and bottom door track 3) Paint color!!!!! Looks way too brown in the photos (could be lighting) Regards Bruce Smith Auburn, AL ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: RDG2124@aol.com Date: Sat, 7 Aug 2004 23:30:08 EDT Subject: [PRR] Bethlehem/Intermountain B60b in the flesh X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com As I have converted the majority of my cars to the Kadee 58 coupler, the pad the coupler box is mounted to was milled down 0.030" to allow for the 58's. Evan Leisey RCT&HS 346 PRRT&HS 7487 PRRT&HS (Phila.) 2036 CNJ 2003 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "STEPHEN HOXIE" Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Date: Sat, 7 Aug 2004 23:31:22 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-ELNK-Trace: 65fbc22f705d6e9971639b933de7ae6f7e972de0d01da9405ef60c5887682e6584bbb4d587f9fea7350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 199.174.137.158 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hi Andy--You can put lead in the steam chest if you keep clearance for the "pistons" and attach it to the underside of the cab roof. Steve Hoxie Pensacola FL ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Miller" To: "'Bob Zoeller'" ; Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 12:10 PM Subject: RE: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement > Bob, > > Where did you put the weight on the M1? The only space I found (and filled > with Pb) was behind the motor. > > regards, > > Andy Miller > > -----Original Message----- > From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Bob Zoeller > Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 1:00 PM > To: PRR-talk@dsop.com > Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Andy Miller" It > > sure would be nice if BLI or an after market maker(Greenway?) Would > > offer drivers with traction tires for the older BLI locos. The only > > problem > which > > must be considered is whether the increase in tractive effort would > > raise the current draw of the motor above the limit of the QSI receiver. > > Want a totally unproven answer?:-) When I asked, BLI at least verbally > suggested the article on adding about 9 ounces or so of lead to the M1b to > me. I couldn't find a space for more than 4 ounces (which helps > considerably by the way) but I would assume if you can add 9 ounces of lead > and not fry the receiver, a traction tire shouldn't harm it either. Another > unproven assumption I would make (while I am winging it): maybe the > receiver in the T1 and M1b has same limits as J1. I'll ask the question on > the QSI list. > > Bob Zoeller > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Bob Zoeller" Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K7 Stock Car Pictures Date: Sun, 8 Aug 2004 00:37:05 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Well, it appears to have the general proportions of a K7A, BUT... I agree with you, Bruce. It looks like it will stand up to the hamhands at our club, like the old Athearns which looked just as clunky. Re the color, say it isn't so! Another Pennsy model in the wrong color. Also a 50 year throwback. However, in fairness it does look closer to the later, darker freight car color (as used by Bowser) than Tuscan which all those PRR models of 50 years ago had. Apologies in advance for being a henny penny---I hate that in others :-). Bob Zoeller ----- Original Message ----- From: Fortunately, it appears that the K7A > has seperate grabs, even if they do look a bit odd on the pre-production > model. > > Issues I do see: > 1) Klunky hangers on the top of the door > 2) Oversize top and bottom door track > 3) Paint color!!!!! Looks way too brown in the photos (could be lighting) ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: John Frantz Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K7 Stock Car Pictures Date: Sun, 08 Aug 2004 08:46:55 -0400 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new .250 at suscom.net Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Gents, We can only hope that since the stockcars have been=20 designed to have sound, THEN they came without sound. So,=20 the shell should be easy to remove from the chassis. If=20 that's the case, a repaint/decal is in order! The only=20 thing that would be a slight annoyance is cutting the=20 strips for dim data, and making it straight. -John "Bob Zoeller" wrote: Re the color, say it isn't so! Another Pennsy model in=20 the wrong color. Also a 50 year throwback. However, in fairness it does=20 look closer to the later, darker freight car color (as used by Bowser) than=20 Tuscan which all those PRR models of 50 years ago had. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: RDG2124@aol.com Date: Sun, 8 Aug 2004 21:05:08 EDT Subject: [PRR] PRR] BLI K7 Stock Car Pictures X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Color the wrong shade? Try an old trick. Use liquid masking to cover the majority of the lettering then over spray with a light coat of the correct color. I have mixed the paint, Floquil and Scalecoat, about 50/50 with thinner then fog the model with an air brush. If that doesn't suit your fancy then you can strip and repaint. Evan Leisey RCT&HS 346 PRRT&HS 7487 PRRT&HS (Phila.) 2036 CNJ 2003 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Brian J Carlson" Subject: [PRR] air brake instruction car 492443 Date: Sun, 8 Aug 2004 23:41:04 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version 0.71, clamav-milter version 0.71 X-Virus-Status: Clean Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On the back cover and Page 120 of the PRR Color Guide to freight and Passenger Equipment Vol. 3 is air brake instruction car 492443. I have a few questions. Is this car a class P70, if so which subclass? The windows in the vestibule and different vestibule doors are throwing me off. The roof looks different also, doesn't have transverse clestory's (I don't know the correct term) near the ends. The picture was taken in 1952, does anyone know how long this car was used as an instruction car? Would instruction be given only at main shops, Enola, Norry, Renovo etc, or did the car travel to outlying terminals also. I assume it was attached to an appropriate passenger train heading to its next destination, however, later on some branches didn't have passenger series, Elmira, Rochester (NY), line to Wilkes Barre. Were there special handling instructions for hauling this car in freight trains? Well, I suppose that's more than a few questions. Thanks for any information. Brian J Carlson P.E. Cheektowaga NY ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] BLI K7 Stock Car Pictures Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 11:33:53 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-reply-to: <000901c47d09$bd893500$6401a8c0@userrtilb5vp8t> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcR9CjVDJ5quRTrSQYy/otFFdi2veQBG12Qw Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hopefully BLI will correct the color before production. But if they don't it appears that rather than repaint, the easiest solution is to buy the GN cars, remove the "Great Northern" letterboards and decal the "PENNSYVANIA" and the keystone on. The filled slats for the keystone appear to cast into the body (much to the chagrin of non-PRR buyers no doubt). regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Bob Zoeller Sent: Sunday, August 08, 2004 1:37 AM To: PRR-talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K7 Stock Car Pictures Well, it appears to have the general proportions of a K7A, BUT... I agree with you, Bruce. It looks like it will stand up to the hamhands at our club, like the old Athearns which looked just as clunky. Re the color, say it isn't so! Another Pennsy model in the wrong color. Also a 50 year throwback. However, in fairness it does look closer to the later, darker freight car color (as used by Bowser) than Tuscan which all those PRR models of 50 years ago had. Apologies in advance for being a henny penny---I hate that in others :-). Bob Zoeller ----- Original Message ----- From: Fortunately, it appears that the K7A > has seperate grabs, even if they do look a bit odd on the > pre-production model. > > Issues I do see: > 1) Klunky hangers on the top of the door > 2) Oversize top and bottom door track > 3) Paint color!!!!! Looks way too brown in the photos (could be > lighting) ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Cc: From: Bruce Smith Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K7 Stock Car Pictures Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 11:11:09 -0500 To: "Andy Miller" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.618) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Aug 9, 2004, at 10:33 AM, Andy Miller wrote: > Hopefully BLI will correct the color before production. But if they > don't > it appears that rather than repaint, the easiest solution is to buy > the GN > cars, remove the "Great Northern" letterboards and decal the > "PENNSYVANIA" > and the keystone on. The filled slats for the keystone appear to cast > into > the body (much to the chagrin of non-PRR buyers no doubt). Another option is use an overspray. Looking at the Broadway web site pictures, I would use an overspray of Poly Scale (or Floquil) Zinc Chromate to get an oranger look on the PRR cars. This will also fade the lettering, giving a nice overall "faded" look to the car which is a good place to start weathering. Interestingly, a nice FCC on the RC X29, when weathered with some darker colors as oversprays (tarnished black, railroad tie brown, rail brown) actually looks pretty close to the Bowser "brown". Of course, the lettering etc is ALSO weathered and lends credibility to the color as a "shift" from the original color as opposed to the stock Bowser paint job, which looks wrong, because it is has fresh lettering on aged paint. An overspray of true FCC can salvage some Bowser paint jobs very nicely, but those that have the incorrect lettering just need to be stripped and repainted. It just would be nice to start with the right base color ... Regards Bruce Bruce F. Smith V.M.D., Ph.D. Scott-Ritchey Research Center 334-844-5587, 334-844-5850 (fax) http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/ "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin __ / \ __<+--+>________________\__/___ ________________________________ |- ______/ O O \_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ | | / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 \ | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__|| |/_____________________________\|_|________________________________| | O--O \0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: LeeRainey@aol.com Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 21:12:34 EDT Subject: [PRR] Historic EBT car returns to operation X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Historic Railroad Car Returns to Operation Friends of East Broad Top Complete Restoration Project The Friends of the East Broad Top, Inc. have completed the restoration of historic Caboose No. 28 of the East Broad Top Railroad & Coal Co. and the car will return to service on Saturday, August 14, 2004. Caboose No. 28 was built in 1920 for service on the East Broad Top Railroad, which operated a high-traffic, coal-hauling narrow-gauge main line from Mount Union to Woodvale in Huntingdon County, Pennsylvania. The car was originally assembled in the railroad's Rockhill Furnace shops. Eighty-four years later, the historic car was reconditioned in the same shops by volunteers from the Friends of the East Broad Top. The restoration, which involved almost 900 volunteer hours, began in December 2003 and included extensive metalwork and carpentry to prepare the car for regular operation while at the same time restoring it to its historic appearance. Before beginning the disassembly, the volunteers carefully documented the car with detailed measurements and hundreds of pictures, and then commissioned the creation of custom wood components matching the car's original specifications. "The East Broad Top is special both for its rich history and for the completeness and integrity of what survives to be seen today," said Dr. Lee Rainey, East Broad Top historian and leader of the volunteer caboose restoration project. "We are honored to have had the opportunity to work with the railroad and its owners, the Kovalchick family, to ensure that Caboose No. 28, an important part of Pennsylvania's industrial heritage, will be available for future generations to enjoy." Caboose No. 28 and other historic equipment dating to the 1880s can be viewed and ridden on the steam-powered, narrow-gauge tourist trains of the East Broad Top Railroad. The railroad operates on weekends from June through October. The car's return to service on August 14, 2004, coincides with the railroad's annual Community Appreciation Day. About the Organizations East Broad Top Railroad & Coal Co. Originally chartered in 1856, the East Broad Top began service as a three-foot-gauge common-carrier railroad in 1873. When it ended freight operations in1956, it was the last narrow-gauge railroad east of the Mississippi. Subsequently acquired by the Kovalchick Salvage Company of Indiana, PA, limited train operation resumed in 1960, and steam tourist service has continued in every year since that time. In addition to operating the oldest surviving piece of narrow-gauge trackage in the United States, the railroad's shop complex in Rockhill Furnace, PA, is widely recognized as one of the most significant historic industrial sites in North America. In 1964, the EBT became a U.S. National Historic Landmark. The railroad was named to Preservation Pennsylvania's "Pennsylvania at Risk" list in 1992 and the National Trust for Historic Preservation's list of most endangered historic sites in 1996. For additional information, visit www.ebtrr.com or contact: East Broad Top Railroad, P. O. Box 158, Rockhill Furnace PA 17249; (814) 447-3011 (telephone); (814) 447-3256 (fax). Friends of the East Broad Top, Inc. Friends of the East Broad Top was founded in 1983 to encourage historical research about and to support the preservation and restoration of the East Broad Top Railroad. Currently FEBT has approximately 900 members, who live throughout the US and in several foreign countries. FEBT operates a museum in Robertsdale, PA that has been open to the public since 1991. More information about the museum, FEBT's restoration program, membership, and events can be found at the organization's at www.febt.org. Friends of the East Broad Top, Inc. is not affiliated with the East Broad Top Railroad & Coal Co. For additional information, contact: Lee Rainey, (814) 235-8636. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Brian J Carlson" Subject: [PRR] B60b's and REA Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 21:51:26 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version 0.71, clamav-milter version 0.71 X-Virus-Status: Clean Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On 2-15-1954 the lettering "RAILWAY EXPRESS AGENCY" was crossed off and no longer applied R50b's. Did REA lettering come of B60b's at this same date? Brian J Carlson P.E. Cheektowaga NY ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Al Buchan" Subject: [PRR] For - Philadelphia Area Train Enthusiasts Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 08:52:50 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Thursday night Aug.19th, 2004 we are having Train Enthusiasts Night at The Morris Arboretum 6:00-8:00pm. This for all scales of trains. Do you think any of our members would like to display their models? We will provide tables, and if needed electric hook-up. For set-up you can arrive any time after 4:30 pm. Or if they just want to come and enjoy the evening with us that is just fine. Any question call Earl Snyder 215-848-1358. Train Enthusiasts Night at The Morris Arboretum Thursday, August 19, 2004 - 6:00-8:00pm. Come enjoy the 'G' scale trains with members of the Southeastern Pennsylvania Garden Railway Society and other train enthusiasts. We will also have Chelten Hills Model Railroad Club, Schuylkill Valley Model RR Club. We would like to make this a night when rail fans can learn about all facets of model railroading. A few of our artists friends will be present displaying their beautifully authentic railroad artwork. There will be various types of equipment demonstrations, including the installation of radio controls in the trains. The building of garden railways and ideas for creating their landscaping will also be available. This fun family event will be held rain or shine. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: ndbprr@att.net Subject: [PRR] BLI cars Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 21:45:00 +0000 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Don't know if this has beenn discussed earlier or not. From the Trains web page at Kalmbach: We just received word that Broadway Limited Imports will be producing HO scale models of General American 53'-6" wood express refrigerator cars with factory-installed grab irons and Kadee couplers in more than a dozen roadnames, and in multiple numbers. Look for complete details in tomorrow evening's News & Products update. Best wishes, Terry ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: ndbprr@att.net Subject: [PRR] BLI cars Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 21:45:00 +0000 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Don't know if this has beenn discussed earlier or not. From the Trains web page at Kalmbach: We just received word that Broadway Limited Imports will be producing HO scale models of General American 53'-6" wood express refrigerator cars with factory-installed grab irons and Kadee couplers in more than a dozen roadnames, and in multiple numbers. Look for complete details in tomorrow evening's News & Products update. Best wishes, Terry ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Subject: [PRR] HO and N B60b Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 18:07:34 -0400 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: PRR-Talk Digest - 08/10/04 Thread-Index: AcR+mJz9D+e4Lk45QgSUQ/CUQ++SawBVs0Ow From: "Drye, John" To: "PRR-Talk" Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com originally posted to PRR N Scale list: Had a chance to talk to Marty McGuirk of InterMountain at the N Scale = Convention in Chantilly this past weekend.=20 He had a sample of the HO B60b on display. Looked great.=20 I asked him if IM had considered doing it in N Scale. He said that they = hadn't planned on it, but had gotten so many questions at the show that = they were considering it. Marty asked if it was worth doing the correct = B60b truck N scale or should they do something "close enough" and = cheaper. I told him that Bowser seemed to do well with the correct PRR = trucks for both the H21s as well as the Cabin Cars. If you have an opinion, you can contact IM at: intermountain@intermountain-railway.com Not associated with IM in any way other than as a consumer (and B60b = customer) John Drye ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 20:03:07 -0400 From: Bert Decker Subject: [PRR] Circle Keystone Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com G'day all, Does anyone have a measured drawing of the circle keystone herald that was applied to PRR freight equipment that I could beg, borrow or (shudder) pay for? I want to make a full-size copy as wall decoration. TIA Bert ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: LeeRainey@aol.com Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 23:30:37 EDT Subject: [PRR] Caboose-a-thon 04 Thursday eve X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Thursday 9:56 pm: Just 36 hours to the scheduled debut of EBT Caboose No. 28. The 900-hour project that began back in December is rapidly coming to an end. A second coat of red glistens on the platforms, thanks to Frank and Dave. Henry is installing the last tacks on the new seamless roof while Frank works to mount the metal sheathing of the cupola. Lee has completed lettering the numbers and heralds. Bob has repainted the end ladders after Frank welded on the repair parts, and now is scrubbing 84 years of dirt out of the interior of the caboose. Tomorrow Bob will welcome an FEBT relief crew that will mount the last few hardware pieces and do a final touch-up on paint. The caboose will be ready on time! ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 21:48:07 -0400 From: TGREGMRTN@aol.com Subject: [PRR] Test Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Test ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: John Frantz Subject: [PRR] NEC Corridor Date: Sat, 14 Aug 2004 20:43:38 -0400 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new .250 at suscom.net Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Gents and All, I had to travel yesterday from Baltimore to Philadelphia=20 and i must say that it being the fist time i've riden this=20 stretch that I had a great time. Getting on at penn=20 Satation in baltimore i found a seat in the last car at=20 the seat closest to the rear of the train. As it so=20 happened the conductor was at this end punching tickets. I=20 politely asked if he would mind me standing at the rear=20 door to observe the passing ROW. He had no objections and=20 i rode most of the hour trip watching out the rear door.=20 Not quite the Observation lounge of the 120, but still an=20 experience.=20 I was suprised at the number of brick/wood construction=20 towers that are still standing. One thing that I was sad to see while riding SEPTA north=20 from 30th street was that the B60b and REA car that used=20 to sit at the rear of the power plant in penn Coach have=20 disappeared. Would anybody know what happened to them? A little kindness can still go a long way in cooperating=20 with AMTRAK employees. Regards, John ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: John Frantz Subject: [PRR] NEC Corridor Date: Sat, 14 Aug 2004 20:43:38 -0400 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new .250 at suscom.net Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Gents and All, I had to travel yesterday from Baltimore to Philadelphia=20 and i must say that it being the fist time i've riden this=20 stretch that I had a great time. Getting on at penn=20 Satation in baltimore i found a seat in the last car at=20 the seat closest to the rear of the train. As it so=20 happened the conductor was at this end punching tickets. I=20 politely asked if he would mind me standing at the rear=20 door to observe the passing ROW. He had no objections and=20 i rode most of the hour trip watching out the rear door.=20 Not quite the Observation lounge of the 120, but still an=20 experience.=20 I was suprised at the number of brick/wood construction=20 towers that are still standing. One thing that I was sad to see while riding SEPTA north=20 from 30th street was that the B60b and REA car that used=20 to sit at the rear of the power plant in penn Coach have=20 disappeared. Would anybody know what happened to them? A little kindness can still go a long way in cooperating=20 with AMTRAK employees. Regards, John ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Dominic Mazoch" Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 09:55:40 GMT Subject: [PRR] Scale Lionel "O" 3R GG-1 4876 From: Mvbb1000@aol.com Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 08:45:47 EDT Subject: [PRR] 1910 Accident in Indiana X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hello, I was wondering if someone could help me with the this> My wifes ggrandfather was killed by accident in a train accident in Indiana, between Dublin and Cambridge City. In an newspaper article that I have received from Indiana it states that he was asleep in the caboose when # 84 a Pennsylvania fast live stock freight train crashed into the caboose and sent it telescoping. In any event I was wondering if it would be possible to find a picture of this accident and or the train? Also if someone could look at this article (I can email it to you) and exp[lain this accident. The article talks about rear of second sections and others it sounds like there may be more then 1 engine involved. Thank you, Mike Maristch ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Bill Godby" Subject: [PRR] Steam engine bell markings Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 09:13:22 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hello everyone, A recent off list discussion has come up about the markings on steam = engine bells. I have in my possession a marked bell. (Non PRR) Did the = PRR and other lines mark their bells?? I thought I had heard at one time = that the PRR did mark some. I wouldn`t think that this would be to common of a practice to do.=20 Anyone have any ideas or know something about bell markings from the = different builders?? Lima, Alco, etc. etc..... We are looking for any kind of information at all. Thanks in advance, Bill Godby ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: mittner@webtv.net (Gary Mittner) Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 09:38:47 -0400 Subject: Re: [PRR] Steam engine bell markings MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Bill, The PRR marked their bells either J.N or A.M.S. or not at all. Many had the loco numbers stamped into them as well, many did not. I once seen a PRR Bell marked with 6 different loco numbers. The only other Bell I seen marked other than those with casting or loco numbers were the EMD diesel Bells which actually had EMD cast into them Those would be the 12" Bells. What size is yours? Photo?....Gary. Come visit my PRR Pages: Photos, Models, Historical Items and Art Work! PRR K4s Loco Pics: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/ PRR G5s, T1, J1 J1a, M1, M1a, N1s, etc. etc.: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/prr_loco_index.html and...... PRR Pics, P&LE Pics, PRR Memorabilia and Misc. Models: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/indexpics.html ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Ted Andrews" Subject: [PRR] SD-7 mystery photo Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 10:48:41 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com PRR Listers: In Pennsy Diesel Years, Vol. 3, on the bottom of page 119, there is a = rare photo of the roof of SD-7 8589. There are 2 items mounted on top of = the short roof. The one on the right is a vent for the water tank used = of the rail cleaning jets when the engine was working the steep Madison = Hill. The one on the left appears to be a radio antenna. I thought that = these engines were originally delivered with firecracker-type antennae = however this may not be true. The SD-7's were delivered in October 1953 = so I do not know if firecracker antennas existed then. The question is: = what is this item on the left-side of the roof? I looks like a = firecracker antenna but it has cord that is folded over and laying on = the roof. I am postulating the this may be a firecracker type antenna = but with an long receiver to compensate for the very hilly terrain = adjacent to Madison and the Ohio River Valley. There is along photo of this mystery antenna at the top of page 653 of = Pennsylvania Railroad Diesel Locomotive Pictorial, Vol. 8. TIA!! Ted Andrews Carmel, Indiana P.S.: What was the type of horn that was delivered to these units? Are = the horns provided in the P2K models accurate? Is there a HO scale horn = currently available that matches the PRR prototypes? ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: abendschein@comcast.net Subject: [PRR] Stockyards and Colored Lights Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 16:02:39 +0000 From: "William Bigler" Subject: Re: [PRR] Stockyards and Colored Lights Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 14:20:35 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I remember the Lancaster Stockyards from the Pennsy convention that was held there several years ago. It was near the hotel, and of course, the tracks. It was behind a very good steak house. Fortunately, the steakhouse was upwind while we enjoyed a very good dinner. One afternoon we went over to the stockyards to photograph the place. Being a weekend, it was pretty inactive. However, during the photo session, a tractor trailer pulled in with a load of calves who were having intestinal problems Whew! Even getting upwind didn't help! No idea how people could stand to work in those places. Interesting to find an active, alive, and well stockyard in daily operation here in the east. I guess I thought virtually all meat came from the Midwest, and was slaughtered and packed near where the cattle were raised. But coming to think about it, there are some farms that raise beef cattle in the east. All transportation seems to be by truck now, however. Bill Bigler - 4915 Big Flats NY Modeling PRR Renovo & Williamsport WWII > Just catching up on two threads from last month: > > Lancaster Stockyards: > At one time the PRR owned the stockyards at Lancaster. Reportedly they were the largest ones east of Chicago. They were quite extensive with quarantine pens on the south side of the PRR Main. A tunnel underneath the tracks allowed animals to reach the main part of the stockyards on the north side. Reportedly one reason why the stockyards were so important was that they opened earlier than Chicago and so could be a trend setter with respect to price. > > Home Signals - Colored Lights > To the best of my knowledge and experience "Cola" never had colored lights in its PRR home signals in PRR, Conrail, or NS periods. > > Fred > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 13:32:35 -0500 Subject: [PRR] PRR Talk St. Louis Prototype Modelers Meet X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 1-2 From: caples5@juno.com Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Anyone from this list going to this meet. I would like to meet other PRR fans at this show. See you there, John Caples ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 13:32:35 -0500 Subject: [PRR] PRR Talk St. Louis Prototype Modelers Meet X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 1-2 From: caples5@juno.com Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Anyone from this list going to this meet. I would like to meet other PRR fans at this show. See you there, John Caples ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Wayne S. Betty" Subject: RE: [PRR] Stockyards and Colored Lights Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 15:13:49 -0400 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 In-Reply-To: <000f01c482f4$ab870440$35d01842@stny.rr.com> Importance: Normal X-SLUIDL: 31948197-98E6484F-BC1CED1F-2B1EA514 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com If my memory remembers sort of closely - the last of the owners pulled out last year. The area is slowly being demolished. Some of the pens where found to have various deficiencies and what not. There have been several ideas put forth for filling the space - leading currently is another strip mall. Cos Wayne S. Betty Cos Communications, Inc. Small business IT services. Lancaster & Atlantic Rail Road NMRA, MER, Susquehanna Div, 11 NHRS, Lancaster & PRRT&HS #7061 http://www.wsbcos.com/trainsmenu.htm at the west end of the PRR electrified zone "If we can not have what we like, we must learn to like what we have!" John Paul Jones -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com]On Behalf Of William Bigler Sent: Sunday, August 15, 2004 2:21 PM To: PRR Talk Subject: Re: [PRR] Stockyards and Colored Lights I remember the Lancaster Stockyards from the Pennsy convention that was held there several years ago. It was near the hotel, and of course, the tracks. It was behind a very good steak house. Fortunately, the steakhouse was upwind while we enjoyed a very good dinner. One afternoon we went over to the stockyards to photograph the place. Being a weekend, it was pretty inactive. However, during the photo session, a tractor trailer pulled in with a load of calves who were having intestinal problems Whew! Even getting upwind didn't help! No idea how people could stand to work in those places. Interesting to find an active, alive, and well stockyard in daily operation here in the east. I guess I thought virtually all meat came from the Midwest, and was slaughtered and packed near where the cattle were raised. But coming to think about it, there are some farms that raise beef cattle in the east. All transportation seems to be by truck now, however. Bill Bigler - 4915 Big Flats NY Modeling PRR Renovo & Williamsport WWII > Just catching up on two threads from last month: > > Lancaster Stockyards: > At one time the PRR owned the stockyards at Lancaster. Reportedly they were the largest ones east of Chicago. They were quite extensive with quarantine pens on the south side of the PRR Main. A tunnel underneath the tracks allowed animals to reach the main part of the stockyards on the north side. Reportedly one reason why the stockyards were so important was that they opened earlier than Chicago and so could be a trend setter with respect to price. > > Home Signals - Colored Lights > To the best of my knowledge and experience "Cola" never had colored lights in its PRR home signals in PRR, Conrail, or NS periods. > > Fred > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Brian J Carlson" Subject: [PRR] FOR SALE HO Scale BLI H-2A hoppers Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 21:26:39 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version 0.71, clamav-milter version 0.71 X-Virus-Status: Clean Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I purchased a 6 pack of these hoppers however, statistically I really only need 3 of them. I am offering the 3 others for sale at $28/each which if multiplied by six is the price I paid. Priority mail shipping is include in the price. These are on a first come basis. Brian J Carlson P.E. Cheektowaga NY ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 09:54:02 -0400 Subject: [PRR] Ex-PRR CV Branch Lives! From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Okay, we know the ex-PRR Cumberland Valley Branch has been alive all these years because there are many industries on it between Lemoyne and Mechanicsburg... and the yard on the east side of Mechanicsburg sees quite a bit of activity. But I hadn't seen a train on the stretch east of that Mechanicsburg yard in at least 15 years, if not 20! Well this morning at 8:30 a.m., that streak was broken! Westbound heading past West Shore Shopping Center (Karn's). ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed To: PRR-Talk From: "Donald E. Harper, Jr." Subject: [PRR] train speeds Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 11:38:48 -0500 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Just back from visiting Long Island and the Pittsburgh area. Got photos of the Montauk and Riverhead stations. Got photos of the LIRR Museum's G5 at Riverhead (they just got a $800,000 grant to restore her). Took the LIRR from Sayville to Penn Station, then Amtrak from Penn Station to Philadelphia behind electric engines and Philly to Pittsburgh behind diesels. There was some sort of equipment problem at Penn Station so we were an hour late leaving. Somewhere between Penn Station and Philly I clocked 33 seconds between mileposts. If my calculations are correct that translates to 104 mph. Do they really travel that fast or is my time off? I was happy to see that PRR position signals are still in place at numerous locations along the route. They are still in place at Haysville and Glenshaw between Pittsburgh and Conway Yard. Don Harper Texas A&M Marine Lab 5007 Avenue U Galveston, TX 77551 409/740-4540 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Cc: PRR-Talk From: Bruce Smith Subject: Re: [PRR] train speeds Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 12:54:22 -0500 To: "Donald E. Harper, Jr." X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Aug 16, 2004, at 11:38 AM, Donald E. Harper, Jr. wrote: > Just back from visiting Long Island and the Pittsburgh area. Got > photos of the Montauk and Riverhead stations. Got photos of the LIRR > Museum's G5 at Riverhead (they just got a $800,000 grant to restore > her). Took the LIRR from Sayville to Penn Station, then Amtrak from > Penn Station to Philadelphia behind electric engines and Philly to > Pittsburgh behind diesels. There was some sort of equipment problem > at Penn Station so we were an hour late leaving. Somewhere between > Penn Station and Philly I clocked 33 seconds between mileposts. If my > calculations are correct that translates to 104 mph. Do they really > travel that fast or is my time off? Don, That's about right. The stretch though Princeton Junction is just about the fastest part of the railroad. Regards Bruce Bruce F. Smith Auburn, AL http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/ "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin __ / \ __<+--+>________________\__/___ ________________________________ |- ______/ O O \_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ | | / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 \ | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__|| |/_____________________________\|_|________________________________| | O--O \0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Rob Schoenberg" Subject: [PRR] Odd Switching tractor... Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 14:09:51 -0400 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-PMX-Version: 4.6.1.107272, Antispam-Core: 4.6.1.106808, Antispam-Data: 2004.8.16.110392 X-PerlMx-Spam: Gauge=IIIIIII, Probability=7%, Report='__TO_MALFORMED_2 0, __OIMO_MSGID 0, __HAS_MSGID 0, __SANE_MSGID 0, __MIME_VERSION 0, __EVITE_CTYPE 0, __CTYPE_CHARSET_QUOTED 0, __CT_TEXT_PLAIN 0, __CT 0, __CTE 0, __HAS_X_PRIORITY 0, __HAS_MSMAIL_PRI 0, __OIMO_MUA 0, __HAS_X_MAILER 0, __ANY_OUTLOOK_MUA 0, __PORN_PHRASE_15_0 0, __MIME_TEXT_ONLY 0' Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hi all, I picked up some negatives of an odd looking rubber tired switching tractor and am wondering if anyone on the list knows anything about it! Here's a link to a scan of the photo: http://prr.railfan.net/photos/OddTractor_JerseyCity_RS.jpg The only info I have is that it's in Jersey City circa 1948. It's shown coupled up to a "normal" PRR switching tractor which is just out of frame. It has NJ license plates and it's apparently built by Euclid (the radiator and wheel hubs are marked Euclid at least..) Does anyone have any info about this beast? Thanks! Rob ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 14:03:18 -0700 (PDT) From: Frank Smith Subject: [PRR] B1 electric switchers Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 14:03:18 -0700 (PDT) From: Frank Smith Subject: [PRR] B1 electric switchers Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2004 03:30:20 -0400 From: "Vagel C. Keller, Jr." Subject: [PRR] Re: Ex-PRR CV Branch Lives! Content-Disposition: inline Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com --On Tuesday, August 17, 2004 1:10 "Jerry Britton" wrote; > Okay, we know the ex-PRR Cumberland Valley Branch has been alive all > these years because there are many industries on it between Lemoyne and > Mechanicsburg... and the yard on the east side of Mechanicsburg sees > quite a bit of activity. > > But I hadn't seen a train on the stretch east of that Mechanicsburg > yard in at least 15 years, if not 20! > > Well this morning at 8:30 a.m., that streak was broken! Westbound > heading past West Shore Shopping Center (Karn's). HA-rummppphhh!!!! Just as it may shock the Philadelphia Chapter to learn that there was a PRR west of the Catenary at Enola, you might be interested to learn that the Cumberland Valley RAILROAD lives south of Mechanicsburg, Jerry! To wit, Hagerstown to Shippensburg, and "WhateveritscalledBetweenHager&Winchester,VA" to boot. I don't know what it's called between Shippensburg and Harrisburg, but neither, it seems, do the dilatantes Roberts and Messner, if their labeling of the Camelback bridge as the CVRR bridge is any indication. Last year I actually photographed a NSdap freight northbound on the original Franklin RR, south of the ex-WM Lurgan/ex-CSX crossing, entering the ex-CV highline at south end of Chambersburg. BTW, the NS rape of PRR/the Commaonwealth has entered a new stage ... scrapping of track above the hump at Hollidaysburg has begun. Thank you, Arlen. George Pickett would be proud. Vagel Keller ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2004 05:32:28 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [PRR] train speeds From: Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com >> Somewhere between Penn Station and Philly I clocked 33 seconds >> between mileposts. Some shopping can yield a 'tachymeter scaled' watch, which does the conversion automatically. 8)>> >> If my calculations are correct that translates to 104 mph. Do >> they really travel that fast or is my time off? In past years I've gotten 120 plus. > That's about right. The stretch though Princeton Junction is just > about the fastest part of the railroad. ...varying with equipment limits, etc.... I was in Amcoach.... best dwp ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2004 21:53:35 -0500 Subject: Re: [PRR] Odd Switching tractor... X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 5,7-34 From: jeffrey d thomas Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I do not have any info. about that specific tractor unit. however, it is a Euclid tractor that is the same as those used to pull bottom-dump trailers for construction work. I have an old Euclid reference book where I might be able to find some info. on this tractor. Do you happen to know about what year that photo was taken. It would help me narrow down my search in the serial number guide I have. On Mon, 16 Aug 2004 14:09:51 -0400 "Rob Schoenberg" writes: > Hi all, > > I picked up some negatives of an odd looking rubber tired switching > tractor > and am wondering if anyone on the list knows anything about it! > Here's a > link to a scan of the photo: > http://prr.railfan.net/photos/OddTractor_JerseyCity_RS.jpg > > The only info I have is that it's in Jersey City circa 1948. It's > shown > coupled up to a "normal" PRR switching tractor which is just out of > frame. > It has NJ license plates and it's apparently built by Euclid (the > radiator > and wheel hubs are marked Euclid at least..) > > Does anyone have any info about this beast? > > Thanks! > > Rob > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2004 07:56:20 -0400 Subject: [PRR] "Black Gold, Black Diamonds" From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: <9EBA6362-F10D-11D8-ACC3-000393835C88@pennsyrr.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Has anyone had any contact with Eric Hirsimaki, author of the "Black Gold, Black Diamonds" series on Pennsy dieselization? The publisher was Mileposts Publishing, who doesn't seem to have a web site. It was to be a five volume series, and it's been many, many years since volume two came out. Anyone know if the series is indeed continuing? ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2004 09:06:06 -0400 From: Stephen Bartlett Subject: Re: [PRR] train speeds X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at out001.verizon.net from [151.203.111.5] at Wed, 18 Aug 2004 08:05:24 -0500 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com One brand to look for is the Robic timer, an electronic stopwatch which can be programmed to calculate speed for any desired distance. It does multiple laps, so a button click at the mileposts gives the previous mule's speed while continuing to read the next mile. http://www.robictimers.com/ Steve Bartlett davep wrote: ... Some shopping can yield a 'tachymeter scaled' watch, which does the conversion automatically. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: RBurg74133@aol.com Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2004 11:35:10 EDT Subject: Re: [PRR] "Black Gold, Black Diamonds" X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Jerry, Eric Hirsimaki is apparently alive and well. He wrote an article on turbines in CLASSIC TRAINS (FALL). Lives in the Cleveland area. I am eagerly awaitig future volumes of his PRR books. Ray Burghart SPF ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2004 21:36:15 -0500 Subject: [PRR] Part of Marietta Branch in operation again X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0,8,13-14 From: jeffrey d thomas Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I just spent the weekend in Southeastern Ohio, and discovered that part of the Marietta branch has been repaired and is being operated by a tourist railroad. The Buckeye Central Railroad, apparently has moved it's operations from Buckeye Lake, to Byesville, Ohio. They, or some local government agency, repaired the flood damaged line from Byesville, south to Derwent, and operate trains on the weekends. The conductor told me they hope to operate clear out to Cumberland on the old B&O trackage that branches off the Marietta line at Derwent. The line from Byesville, all the way to the end of track south of Cumberland, is heavy, welded rail. This trackage would let them take riders out to "The Wilds", a huge nature preserve in the old mine reclamation areas near Cumberland. The railroad has a very nice website with some history of these rail lines. www.buckeyecentralrailroad.org Jeff thomas Denton, Tx. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2004 21:36:15 -0500 Subject: [PRR] Part of Marietta Branch in operation again X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0,8,13-14 From: jeffrey d thomas Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I just spent the weekend in Southeastern Ohio, and discovered that part of the Marietta branch has been repaired and is being operated by a tourist railroad. The Buckeye Central Railroad, apparently has moved it's operations from Buckeye Lake, to Byesville, Ohio. They, or some local government agency, repaired the flood damaged line from Byesville, south to Derwent, and operate trains on the weekends. The conductor told me they hope to operate clear out to Cumberland on the old B&O trackage that branches off the Marietta line at Derwent. The line from Byesville, all the way to the end of track south of Cumberland, is heavy, welded rail. This trackage would let them take riders out to "The Wilds", a huge nature preserve in the old mine reclamation areas near Cumberland. The railroad has a very nice website with some history of these rail lines. www.buckeyecentralrailroad.org Jeff thomas Denton, Tx. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: mittner@webtv.net (Gary Mittner) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 10:48:47 -0400 Subject: [PRR] Last Run Date MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com List, What was the date of that last steam operation on the PRR supposedly regarding an I1sa and hopper train in or around Cresson/Galitzin/Altoona area? Thanks, Gary Come visit my PRR Pages: Photos, Models, Historical Items and Art Work! PRR K4s Loco Pics: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/ PRR G5s, T1, J1 J1a, M1, M1a, N1s, etc. etc.: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/prr_loco_index.html and...... PRR Pics, P&LE Pics, PRR Memorabilia and Misc. Models: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/indexpics.html ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: mittner@webtv.net (Gary Mittner) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 10:48:47 -0400 Subject: [PRR] Last Run Date MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com List, What was the date of that last steam operation on the PRR supposedly regarding an I1sa and hopper train in or around Cresson/Galitzin/Altoona area? Thanks, Gary Come visit my PRR Pages: Photos, Models, Historical Items and Art Work! PRR K4s Loco Pics: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/ PRR G5s, T1, J1 J1a, M1, M1a, N1s, etc. etc.: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/prr_loco_index.html and...... PRR Pics, P&LE Pics, PRR Memorabilia and Misc. Models: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/indexpics.html ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: John Frantz Subject: [PRR] B6 or B8? Date: Fri, 20 Aug 2004 23:51:03 -0400 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new .250 at suscom.net Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Listers, I was overviewing some pictures and wanted to know what=20 the differences were between these two classes. I'm=20 guessing it would be mostly appliances because there is no=20 major overall appearance changes between classes. TIA -John ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2004 04:02:13 -0500 Subject: [PRR] PRR Talk- E-8 #5898 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 2,5-6 From: caples5@juno.com Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Yes this locomotive is a former PRR unit. Before being sold to ST. Louis , Iron Mountain and Southern. It ran on the Reading , Blue Mountain, And Northern in Reading PA. I last saw this locomotive about 5 years ago and the paint job/ body was looking rough at that time. I haven't seen it since so I can't comment on it's present condition. Later, John Caples ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Ted Andrews" Subject: [PRR] Looking for an SD-9 and an SD-35 Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2004 10:05:07 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hi everyone: I am looking for the following: P2K SD-9 in PRR (either road number) Atlas SD-35 in PRR (no number) If any of you have these engines and are thinking of selling, please = contact me off list.=20 Thanks! Ted Andrews Carmel, Indiana ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] B6 or B8? Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2004 09:02:17 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-reply-to: X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcSHMoc5gZFWq6wNRImx/KcEGd4pMAB3nlrA Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Since no one has responded (yet) I'll give it a shot off the top of my head. As I recall the two classes were not similar. The B8 had a distinctly smaller boiler than the B6. Of course the B6 was the dominant switcher on the PRR. The B8 must have been built for some designated special service. regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of John Frantz Sent: Friday, August 20, 2004 11:51 PM To: PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: [PRR] B6 or B8? Listers, I was overviewing some pictures and wanted to know what the differences were between these two classes. I'm guessing it would be mostly appliances because there is no major overall appearance changes between classes. TIA -John ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2004 10:20:26 -0400 Subject: [PRR] The Keystone Modeler & Periodical Index From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: <945B804A-F50F-11D8-A57C-000393835C88@pennsyrr.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com The PDF version of the August TKM was posted on the Society's web site over the weekend. Be reminded that a searchable index of TKM exists on the Keystone Crossings web site: http://kc.pennsyrr.com/forms/periodicals/ The index also contains entries for The Keystone, Pennsy Journal, The Pennsy (only a few issues), and Rails Northeast (PRR entries only). ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2004 14:27:13 -0700 (PDT) From: Doug Kisala Subject: [PRR] B6 and B8 differences From: "Wayne S. Betty" Subject: RE: [PRR] B6 or B8? Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2004 20:56:11 -0400 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-reply-to: <200408231300.i7ND0Ya03563@smtp-bedford-dr.mitre.org> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Importance: Normal X-SLUIDL: 6257E852-8AC94723-89FE76B7-08AEC338 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Howdy All: Direct from PPIII Juniata, BLW & Lima built 267 B8 (1903-1913), 20x24 cylinders, 56-inch drivers, 205psi, 143450 weight Juniata built 238 B6sb (1916-1926), 22x24 cylinders, 56-inch drivers, 205psi, 177350 weight Briefly checking the 1944 MP229 http://www.wsbcos.com/mp229/mp229.htm there was still a good number of these machines in service. Also checked my 1952 Classification and Description of Locomotives and Tenders - they are still listed there. Not bad for a non-superheated machine. Twenty-seven where converted to B8a saddle tank They would have looked very similar in there basic lines, the B8 used a 55s66a tender, while the B6sb used the 60s66a tender, both had Belpaire fire boxes, but the B8 used piston valve gear while the B6sb used Walsaherts valve gear. Cos Wayne S. Betty Cos Communications, Inc. Small business IT services. Lancaster & Atlantic Rail Road NMRA, MER, Susquehanna Div, 11 NHRS, Lancaster & PRRT&HS #7061 http://www.wsbcos.com/trainsmenu.htm at the west end of the PRR electrified zone "If we can not have what we like, we must learn to like what we have!" John Paul Jones -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com]On Behalf Of Andy Miller Sent: Monday, August 23, 2004 9:02 AM To: 'John Frantz'; PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: RE: [PRR] B6 or B8? Since no one has responded (yet) I'll give it a shot off the top of my head. As I recall the two classes were not similar. The B8 had a distinctly smaller boiler than the B6. Of course the B6 was the dominant switcher on the PRR. The B8 must have been built for some designated special service. regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of John Frantz Sent: Friday, August 20, 2004 11:51 PM To: PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: [PRR] B6 or B8? Listers, I was overviewing some pictures and wanted to know what the differences were between these two classes. I'm guessing it would be mostly appliances because there is no major overall appearance changes between classes. TIA -John ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Ted Andrews" Subject: [PRR] PRR in the Movies alert!! Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2004 22:57:48 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com PRR Listers: I was watching Turner Movie Classics this evening. They are showing the = following movie: The Major and the Minor, (1942), starring Ginger Rogers and Ray Milland. = The movie plot is a woman (Rogers) disguises herself as a little girl = and ends up in a military academy. The beginning of the movie takes place on the EB Broadway Limited and = has some great action shots of the Broadway heading out of Chicago and = going across the 4-tracked mainline in Pennsylvania pulled by K-4 3768 = (fully streamlined) Great action shots!!! Ted Andrews ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Ted Andrews" Subject: [PRR] PRR in the Movies alert!! Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2004 22:57:48 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com PRR Listers: I was watching Turner Movie Classics this evening. They are showing the = following movie: The Major and the Minor, (1942), starring Ginger Rogers and Ray Milland. = The movie plot is a woman (Rogers) disguises herself as a little girl = and ends up in a military academy. The beginning of the movie takes place on the EB Broadway Limited and = has some great action shots of the Broadway heading out of Chicago and = going across the 4-tracked mainline in Pennsylvania pulled by K-4 3768 = (fully streamlined) Great action shots!!! Ted Andrews ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2004 10:11:59 -0400 Subject: [PRR] N Scale Passenger Cars Coming From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: <904AE1F3-F5D7-11D8-B6A0-000393835C88@pennsyrr.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com As many know, the Centralia Car Shops / InterMountain partnership has already produced N scale PRR P85b coaches and 6-6-4's in other roads. The "N Horizons" column of "N Scale Railroading" magazine publicizes that 4-4-2's, 10-5's, 13 BR, and 18 RMT cars are all coming in ready-to-run and in PRR livery! All are pre-war cars. While some of these cars have been discussed verbally, on lists, and in private circles, I mention it here as it has now appeared "in print" in a national publication. And don't forget the previous note on PRR P70FBR's from Wheels Of Time! ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: Jerry @ Pennsy Subject: [PRR] Re: Branchline Passenger car survey sort of Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2004 21:44:20 -0400 To: PRR-talk X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I'm floating the following for a third party. Please share your=20 thoughts... > =A0 > 1)=A0 Would you be interested in the Branchline passenger cars in RTR? > =A0 > 2)=A0 Would you prefer these cars continue to be available only in = kits? > =A0 > 3) If you are interested what is a reasonable price for these cars in=20= > RTR? ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS jerry@pennsyrr.com Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Cich" Subject: RE: [PRR] Re: Branchline Passenger car survey sort of Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2004 21:23:38 -0500 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: <48E159FA-F638-11D8-B99E-000A95C04372@pennsyrr.com> Importance: Normal Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Appropriate question, since I am now taking a break from working on Centwood. Here are my answers: 1. No. 2. No. As long as I can get the kits I want, selling these cars also in RTR is a good idea. I'm all for more profits for Branchline so they can re-invest some of them for the tooling for the 7th, 8th, etc bodystyles. 3. N/A Andy Cich -----Original Message----- I'm floating the following for a third party. Please share your thoughts... >   > 1)  Would you be interested in the Branchline passenger cars in RTR? >   > 2)  Would you prefer these cars continue to be available only in kits? >   > 3) If you are interested what is a reasonable price for these cars in > RTR? ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 08:25:51 -0700 Subject: [PRR] Rail Road History From: Greg Ritacco Message-Id: <0C33FB6A-F6AB-11D8-A606-000A959FDA52@surewest.net> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) X-TST: smtp1 SNWK3 0.31-80 ip=216.93.193.171 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hi Group, With traffic a bit light these days, there is a question in the back of my mind I've been wondering about. When was the word pair Rail Road replaced with the single word Railroad? My informal look into the question shows the one word usage in play pretty much by 1892, and roughly about the same time tenders went from P. R. R. to PENNSYLVANIA. Does anyone know how that came about? Thanks, Greg Ritacco ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "STEPHEN HOXIE" Subject: Re: [PRR] Re: Branchline Passenger car survey sort of Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 11:22:20 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-ELNK-Trace: 65fbc22f705d6e9971639b933de7ae6f7e972de0d01da940e57354b2105df1bd730ed4fbce6c6f30350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 165.121.225.169 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I agree with Andy--very appropriatre question since I have finished my Centwood, except for diaphragms. Beautiful kit. My answers are also the same as Andy's-- 1. No. 2. No. But if RTR will help B/L do the kits I need, more power to them. Parlor cars, anyone? 3. N/A Steve Hoxie Pensacola FL ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Cich" To: "PRR-talk" Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 9:23 PM Subject: RE: [PRR] Re: Branchline Passenger car survey sort of > Appropriate question, since I am now taking a break from working on > Centwood. > > Here are my answers: > > 1. No. > > 2. No. As long as I can get the kits I want, selling these cars also in RTR > is a good idea. I'm all for more profits for Branchline so they can > re-invest some of them for the tooling for the 7th, 8th, etc bodystyles. > > 3. N/A > > > Andy Cich > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 12:27:41 -0400 Subject: [PRR] Branchline Question From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Yesterday I posted a question about Branchline passenger cars for a third party. I asked the list to "share comments". Unfortunately, I didn't note that some of the responses were private, to me. They were deleted. I am not tabulating responses. The person looking for the responses is lurking on the list. If you sent a response privately to me, please repost. Thanks. ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 12:27:41 -0400 Subject: [PRR] Branchline Question From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Yesterday I posted a question about Branchline passenger cars for a third party. I asked the list to "share comments". Unfortunately, I didn't note that some of the responses were private, to me. They were deleted. I am not tabulating responses. The person looking for the responses is lurking on the list. If you sent a response privately to me, please repost. Thanks. ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: Bruce Smith Subject: Re:::[PRR] Re: Branchline Passenger car survey sort of Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 11:48:50 -0500 To: "PRR-Talk TALK''" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Aug 24, 2004, at 8:44 PM, Jerry @ Pennsy wrote: > I'm floating the following for a third party. Please share your=20 > thoughts... >> =A0 >> 1)=A0 Would you be interested in the Branchline passenger cars in = RTR? No >> 2)=A0 Would you prefer these cars continue to be available only in = kits? If someone else wants RTR, it doesn't bother me. >> 3) If you are interested what is a reasonable price for these cars in=20= >> RTR? I would think $60-70 list would be competitive. Its an interesting=20 idea. However, the "3rd party" needs to consider that Walthers will=20 enter that market before they can with the same, or nearly the same=20 cars. Therefore, their market share will be restricted to those who=20 want the detail of the Branchline cars without having to build the=20 kits, and are willing to pay a premium. Obviously, this is a MUCH=20 smaller market than the RTR market. Regards Bruce Bruce F. Smith Auburn, AL http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/ "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin=20 Franklin __ / \ __<+--+>________________\__/___ ________________________________ |- ______/ O O \_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ | | / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 \ | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__|| |/_____________________________\|_|________________________________| | O--O \0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0= ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Dave Pfeiffer" Subject: [PRR] Re: Branchline Passenger car survey sort of Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 13:33:19 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at out012.verizon.net from [141.158.54.133] at Wed, 25 Aug 2004 12:31:28 -0500 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Jerry, I am not interested in RTR cars. I always prefer kits, so my answers are: 1. No. 2. Yes. (I don't care if they are available RTR ALSO, but I won't buy them.) 3. N/A. Dave Pfeiffer ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: Subject: [PRR] branchline survey Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 15:12:45 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com hello, all... i will continue to buy the heavyweight sleepers in kit config., = and if they appear in rtr. format, i'll most likely pick up some of = them as well. a fair price for the cars, all up and running would be $ 60- $ = 65....imho. now lets get them thinking about some new car types. = how about an 8 section club lounge car. can you say " lotos club " ????!! = jaygee ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: Subject: [PRR] branchline survey Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 15:12:45 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com hello, all... i will continue to buy the heavyweight sleepers in kit config., = and if they appear in rtr. format, i'll most likely pick up some of = them as well. a fair price for the cars, all up and running would be $ 60- $ = 65....imho. now lets get them thinking about some new car types. = how about an 8 section club lounge car. can you say " lotos club " ????!! = jaygee ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 15:37:16 -0400 From: "Dr. Edmond L. Freed" Subject: Re: [PRR] Re: Branchline Passenger car survey sort of Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com "Dr. Edmond L. Freed" wrote: > "Jerry @ Pennsy" wrote: > > > I'm floating the following for a third party. Please share your > > thoughts... > > > > 1)  Would you be interested in the Branchline passenger cars in RTR? > > Yes >   > > > 2)  Would you prefer these cars continue to be available only in kits? > > No. A partial disability makes it impossible for me to build kits such as these. Therefore, guys like me would not be able to share these great cars. Let's not be selfish. > > > > 3) If you are interested what is a reasonable price for these cars in > > > RTR? > > ??? A fair price would be nice. $60.00 or so. > Eddie ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: hanel29@att.net Subject: Re: [PRR] Re: Branchline Passenger car survey sort of Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 22:51:09 +0000 > From: "Andy Cich" > Subject: RE: [PRR] Re: Branchline Passenger car survey sort of From: "Gregg Mahlkov" Subject: Re: [PRR] Rail Road History Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 19:00:49 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Greg, There is NO date. There are still TWO "Rail Road" companies, the Long Island Rail Road and the Indiana Rail Road. About the only one no longer used is Rail Way, although Railway is almost as common as Railroad in the USA and in almost universal use in other English speaking countries. Gregg Mahlkov ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg Ritacco" To: Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2004 11:25 AM Subject: [PRR] Rail Road History > Hi Group, > With traffic a bit light these days, there is a question in the back of > my mind I've been wondering about. When was the word pair Rail Road > replaced with the single word Railroad? My informal look into the > question shows the one word usage in play pretty much by 1892, and > roughly about the same time tenders went from P. R. R. to PENNSYLVANIA. > Does anyone know how that came about? > Thanks, > Greg Ritacco > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 18:11:27 -0500 From: Morgan Bilbo Subject: Re: [PRR] Branchline Question X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Jerry Britton wrote: Yesterday I posted a question about Branchline passenger cars for a third party. I asked the list to "share comments". Unfortunately, I didn't note that some of the responses were private, to me. They were deleted. I am not tabulating responses. The person looking for the responses is lurking on the list. If you sent a response privately to me, please repost. Thanks. Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS I was one of those who sent it privately, so here tis my opinion/ Jerry Here's my thoughts. Not necessarily how many I would buy, etc. IF IF IF Branchline were to offer passenger cars in HO. They Must Be Specific Railroad Exact - the correct car ALL THE WAY!, I would like to suggest the many forms of P70's (& PB70's) for PRR. They could do the different roofs, ends, underbodies, etc. And - full interiors, diaphragms, etc. Make them so damn good they'd make all current cars on the market look like toys. That's what BLI did for engines. Raise the quality bar high.. Not being a non-PRR expert, I don't know how many other roads used P70's in their own version. An alternative for Branchline is to try to bring out as generic a Pullman as they can, with railroad specific detail as much as they can. The Loco mfgrs are doing that. And if BLI sells a $300 engine for a while, and now improves it in the K4 to the $450 range, I'm sure Branchline could do the same. They should offer the kits as well as RTR. As to price? That's something they have to use their marketing tools for. Walthers sells for what? $25 to $35. But IF the cars had interiors, and were especially nice, they could name their own price. And would Branchline offer trucks with them? I am a firm believer in that no one should offer couplers in their kits. Just use a universal pocket. Now for you, if they do these in HO, why not in N at the same time? Even O too. I wonder why the stuff they offer in HO is different than in N and vice versa. Mfgrs should try to hit more gauges. All IMHO. Morgan Bilbo, Ferroequinologist, Organic Gardener ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: abendschein@comcast.net Subject: Re: [PRR] Rail Road History Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 00:54:08 +0000 > From: "Greg Ritacco" > Subject: [PRR] Rail Road History From: "Greg Johnson" Subject: [PRR] Re: Branchline Passenger car survey Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 20:56:04 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com 1) Y 2) N 3) $50-$60 I love to build kits, but having a 600 sq. ft. railroad, as well as family, work and church obligations, means that some excellent R-T-R items find a home on my layout. I am sure there are plenty of other "railroad builders" as opposed to "railroad model builders" that would rather utilize their precious hobby time in other areas (ie... scenery, benchwork, weathering, structures), rather than passenger car construction. If I could just get rid of this silly obligation of having to go to work every day, I would have time to build everything! Regards, Greg Johnson "patiently awating the R-T-R Branchline cars" ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Aidrian Bridgeman-Sutton" Subject: FW: [PRR] Re: Branchline Passenger car survey sort of Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 19:27:08 -0700 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com ~> 1)=A0 Would you be interested in the Branchline passenger cars in = RTR? Coaches Probably not, since these are only accurate for NYC and possibly some associated companies. Any other road needs modifications that are easier to make if the car is still in pieces.=20 Pullmans Possibly, depending on price and paint schemes=20 ~> 2)=A0 Would you prefer these cars continue to be available only in kits? Not really as long as they are still available in kit form ~> 3) If you are interested what is a reasonable price for these cars in ~> RTR? Gut feeling says $60 or so. They will produce a premium model, provided the running issues are sorted out (truck and frame foul on straight track and the standard wheelsets are a bit dodgy) /abs=20 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.742 / Virus Database: 495 - Release Date: 8/19/2004 =20 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Wayne S. Betty" Subject: RE: [PRR] Rail Road History Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 23:09:48 -0400 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 In-Reply-To: <000c01c48af7$5ea36be0$0a699e0c@DDPXT351> Importance: Normal X-SLUIDL: 47CC2E6E-30A640CA-B50D3E19-0EBDF6BD Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Strasburg Rail Road too! Cos Wayne S. Betty Cos Communications, Inc. Small business IT services. Lancaster & Atlantic Rail Road NMRA, MER, Susquehanna Div, 11 NHRS, Lancaster & PRRT&HS #7061 http://www.wsbcos.com/trainsmenu.htm at the west end of the PRR electrified zone "If we can not have what we like, we must learn to like what we have!" John Paul Jones -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com]On Behalf Of Gregg Mahlkov Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2004 7:01 PM To: Greg Ritacco; PRr-talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] Rail Road History Greg, There is NO date. There are still TWO "Rail Road" companies, the Long Island Rail Road and the Indiana Rail Road. About the only one no longer used is Rail Way, although Railway is almost as common as Railroad in the USA and in almost universal use in other English speaking countries. Gregg Mahlkov ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg Ritacco" To: Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2004 11:25 AM Subject: [PRR] Rail Road History > Hi Group, > With traffic a bit light these days, there is a question in the back of > my mind I've been wondering about. When was the word pair Rail Road > replaced with the single word Railroad? My informal look into the > question shows the one word usage in play pretty much by 1892, and > roughly about the same time tenders went from P. R. R. to PENNSYLVANIA. > Does anyone know how that came about? > Thanks, > Greg Ritacco > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 23:50:55 -0400 From: RamblingReck Subject: Re: [PRR] Re: Branchline Passenger car survey sort of Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Yes, I would be interested in RTR. I would guess that a reasonable price would be something close to the Intermountain car. John Ryan Jerry @ Pennsy wrote: > I'm floating the following for a third party. Please share your > thoughts... > >> >> 1) Would you be interested in the Branchline passenger cars in RTR? >> >> 2) Would you prefer these cars continue to be available only in kits? >> >> 3) If you are interested what is a reasonable price for these cars in >> RTR? > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: OhThoseVoices@aol.com Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 05:33:44 EDT Subject: [PRR] branchline passeger car survey X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Would like to see rtr,and kits available 15/20.00 I feel that the scratchbuilding sector of our hobby is going away,but some of us still like the building of kits(not much room for a complete railroad),but also the rtrgroups will have a nice product available. Jeff Jacobs ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 20:38:23 +0900 From: "Jeremy & Soni Helms" Subject: [PRR] Broadway Limited X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hello all, I was wondering if anyone knew of someone who has attempted a Proto 87 = conversion on a BLI steam locomotive? I am looking to see if it is = possible since that seems to be how I am leaning for modeling these = days. I need to find out to see if this can be done since it will play = into what era I amy model. Thanks for any pointers. Jeremy Okinawa, Japan ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Cc: From: Bruce Smith Subject: Re: [PRR] Broadway Limited Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 07:56:04 -0500 To: "Jeremy & Soni Helms" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Aug 26, 2004, at 6:38 AM, Jeremy & Soni Helms wrote: > Hello all, > > I was wondering if anyone knew of someone who has attempted a Proto 87 > conversion on a BLI steam locomotive? I am looking to see if it is > possible since that seems to be how I am leaning for modeling these > days. I need to find out to see if this can be done since it will > play into what era I amy model. Thanks for any pointers. Jeremy, Intriguing idea. Which locomotive? I ask because to date BLI has only produced large mainline locomotives, and while yes, you might "convert" them to P87 standards, where the heck would you run them? Even the most rabid of P87 gurus admits that P87 is pretty much limited to small, switching style layouts. Or is the loco to be a "hanger queen"? Regards Bruce Bruce F. Smith Auburn, AL http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/ "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin __ / \ __<+--+>________________\__/___ ________________________________ |- ______/ O O \_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ | | / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 \ | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__|| |/_____________________________\|_|________________________________| | O--O \0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 22:43:22 +0900 From: "Jeremy & Soni Helms" Subject: Re: [PRR] Broadway Limited From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] Broadway Limited Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 10:10:46 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcSLc8qcK8MuVNjQSOS55HhR8h/r+AAApVPw In-reply-to: <001001c48b72$a87d40d0$c6c6e9d2@helms7sa7p6ida> Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com The USRA light 2-8-2 is not too improbable on a branchline RR. regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Jeremy & Soni Helms Sent: Thursday, August 26, 2004 9:43 AM To: Bruce Smith Cc: prr-talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] Broadway Limited Bruce and all, I thought the same thing but got to thinking what of a long straight diorama that the trains just ran through and had staging on either end of the diorama? I am not sure but I do know that I will be building freight car kits slowly but surely over the next 8 or more years as I await military retirement and start a new career after that. I enjoy highly detailed stuff so it would be to show off the models. Still just contemplating. I am also contemplating not going that far and only using the semi-scale wheelsets but using sargeant scale couplers. Just was curious on the topic. Jeremy > Jeremy, > > Intriguing idea. Which locomotive? I ask because to date BLI has > only produced large mainline locomotives, and while yes, you might "convert" > them to P87 standards, where the heck would you run them? Even the > most rabid of P87 gurus admits that P87 is pretty much limited to > small, switching style layouts. Or is the loco to be a "hanger queen"? > > > Regards > Bruce ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Cc: "'Jeremy & Soni Helms'" , From: Bruce Smith Subject: Re: [PRR] Broadway Limited Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 09:41:55 -0500 To: "Andy Miller" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Aug 26, 2004, at 9:10 AM, Andy Miller wrote: > The USRA light 2-8-2 is not too improbable on a branchline RR. Excellent point! Not wanting an L2s I had ignored it... but you could build a neat PRR granger scenario, with the L2S being the "road power" and a B6 or H10 as local switching power. N6B cabins, flat terrain and grain elevators would stamp an indellible "Lines West" impression in the mind of the viewer. Regards Bruce Bruce F. Smith Auburn, AL http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/ "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin __ / \ __<+--+>________________\__/___ ________________________________ |- ______/ O O \_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ | | / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 \ | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__|| |/_____________________________\|_|________________________________| | O--O \0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 14:40:39 -0400 Subject: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: <6D52E465-F78F-11D8-A424-000393835C88@pennsyrr.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Off-topic, but yet relevant, to 1950's modelers... Classic Metal Works has announced, for shipment in November, 1954 R-190 tractors and Fruehauf 32' Aerovan Trailers in both HO and N scales. Other than Undecorated and Chicago Express, they are also being offered in Mid-States and Cooper-Jarrett. What parts of the country did these latter two roam in... around Pennsylvania by chance? ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 14:40:39 -0400 Subject: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: <6D52E465-F78F-11D8-A424-000393835C88@pennsyrr.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Off-topic, but yet relevant, to 1950's modelers... Classic Metal Works has announced, for shipment in November, 1954 R-190 tractors and Fruehauf 32' Aerovan Trailers in both HO and N scales. Other than Undecorated and Chicago Express, they are also being offered in Mid-States and Cooper-Jarrett. What parts of the country did these latter two roam in... around Pennsylvania by chance? ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 15:04:51 -0400 From: Dan Cupper Subject: Re: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Greetings to Jerry and the list: All three -- along with Spector and Eastern -- are depicted aboard the PRR TrucTrain in the 1956 Grif Teller calendar titled Dynamic Progress. PRR provided original photos to Teller for his use in creating the painting -- those photos contain trailers bearing all of the above trucking firms' names. Dan Cupper Jerry Britton wrote: > Off-topic, but yet relevant, to 1950's modelers... > > Classic Metal Works has announced, for shipment in November, 1954 > R-190 tractors and Fruehauf 32' Aerovan Trailers in both HO and N scales. > > Other than Undecorated and Chicago Express, they are also being > offered in Mid-States and Cooper-Jarrett. What parts of the country > did these latter two roam in... around Pennsylvania by chance? > ----------------------------------------------------------- > Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS > Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. > "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! > http://kc.pennsyrr.com > "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... > http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 15:10:13 -0400 Subject: Re: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers From: Jerry Britton X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Thursday, August 26, 2004, at 03:04 PM, Dan Cupper wrote: > All three -- along with Spector and Eastern -- are depicted aboard the > PRR TrucTrain in the 1956 Grif Teller calendar titled Dynamic > Progress. PRR provided original photos to Teller for his use in > creating the painting -- those photos contain trailers bearing all of > the above trucking firms' names. Great info, Dan! Now, the following is not known to be 100% correct, but at least one source I have perused indicates that... * Initial TrucTrain service in 1954 was for PRR owned trailers only. Third party trailers were not accepted until March 1955. * Fruehauf 32' two axle trailers were not ordered by the PRR (themselves) until March 1955. Until then they used existing 24' and 26' trailers plus new 150 recently purchased 30' Fruehauf single axle trailers. Still, looking forward to these models. ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 15:16:29 -0400 Subject: Re: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers From: Jerry Britton X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Thursday, August 26, 2004, at 03:04 PM, Dan Cupper wrote: > All three -- along with Spector and Eastern -- are depicted aboard the > PRR TrucTrain in the 1956 Grif Teller calendar titled Dynamic > Progress. All, for reference... http://kc.pennsyrr.com/art/images/1956.jpeg Thanks, again, Dan, so easy to forget what is already on my web site! ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: RDG2124@aol.com Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 15:25:56 EDT Subject: [PRR] Pennsy P70 Coach in HO RTR X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Queried Walthers about the rumor of them producing this car. The response was that they are only CONSIDERING this. No information as to whether this would be an original version or a later modified version. Time for those of us interested in this car to let Walthers know that we are. As the only decent P70 coaches out there are either brass or the hard to find ALCO models, this car would be a strong seller. I inquired about it at the local hobby shop but the buyer that was handling the Walthers orders recently quit the shop. The new buyer is not aware of any proposed new products questionnaire sent from Walthers to their retailers that included the P70. Thank you, Evan Leisey RCT&HS 346 PRRT&HS 7487 PRRT&HS (Phila.) 2036 CNJ 2003 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Park Varieties" Subject: Re: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 15:37:33 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I believe I have a video entitled "Diesels Roar On The Pennsy" or something like that that shows several TTX trains going by. Cooper-Jarrett and Mid-States trailers were in several trains in quantity. Frank Brua ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jerry Britton" To: "PRR-Talk LIST" Sent: Thursday, August 26, 2004 2:40 PM Subject: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers > Off-topic, but yet relevant, to 1950's modelers... > > Classic Metal Works has announced, for shipment in November, 1954 R-190 > tractors and Fruehauf 32' Aerovan Trailers in both HO and N scales. > > Other than Undecorated and Chicago Express, they are also being offered > in Mid-States and Cooper-Jarrett. What parts of the country did these > latter two roam in... around Pennsylvania by chance? > ----------------------------------------------------------- > Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS > Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. > "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! > http://kc.pennsyrr.com > "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... > http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: KEMACPRR@aol.com Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 15:40:34 EDT Subject: Re: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Jerry and the list. I was fortunate enough about 20 years ago to pick up two flatcars and 7 trailers that were built for the PRR in 1954 to be used at trade shows to show customers what their new F-39 flats with trailers would look like. They are about 3/4'' scale and one came with a display section of track. I've heard that there were 6 flats made . I've seen them in the Pennsy magazine . The trailers I have were custom painted and lettered for then customers of the PRR. Interestingly most were only done on one side with the other done in a PRR truc train scheme. The ones I have are the following : Eastern Motor Express, Liberty Motor Freight Lines Inc. ,Chicago Express , Long Transportation , Kelleher , Mid States. Cooper Jarrett and TransAmerican were also early PRR Truc -Train customers. -----------Ken McCorry ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Park Varieties" Subject: [PRR] Power Chassis For P2K FA Units Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 15:47:51 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com What would be a good power chassis to use under a P2K HO FA diesel? I = spent a lot of time detailing the shells and am growing more upset each = day with the poor running qualities of the power chassis. I don't know if the truck spacing is correct but has anyone ever = considered or used the Walthers Trainline FA chassis? Thanks. Frank Brua ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Park Varieties" Subject: [PRR] Power Chassis For P2K FA Units Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 15:47:51 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com What would be a good power chassis to use under a P2K HO FA diesel? I = spent a lot of time detailing the shells and am growing more upset each = day with the poor running qualities of the power chassis. I don't know if the truck spacing is correct but has anyone ever = considered or used the Walthers Trainline FA chassis? Thanks. Frank Brua ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 15:54:36 -0400 From: TGREGMRTN@aol.com Subject: [PRR] Improving the Bowser H21...(from PRR Pro) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On the PRR Pro Group Dean Payne writes... "Wasn't there a note on this list about an upcoming article on improving Bowser's H21? Did I miss it or has it been delayed? Dean Payne" YIKES! I guess I can't keep anything a secrete... Yes, It is on the bench with a GLa... Cat's out of the bag now... Yes, part of our on going saga of "Making Bowser Better". Alas, it is just in the "cracked the box" mode as I am trying to finish a couple of display cars for th California State Railways Museum's Gift Shop... So it will get started in anohter week of so. Also, I am committed to doing some work with Ben Hom and my Brother on some Headend articles for a magazine (RMC). So please be apteint as I have a nearly full plate. Funny thing is that my good friend Mike Beradley memtions that the folks at Bowesr are producing the H21 without the reinforced top rib, but I recently ordered several with that specifically in the order and guess what...? you got it my undec's can with the rib... OH Well, Just more fodder for the article. Watch for it in TKM. "Making Bowser Better" is on going Byline and will include all the Bowser cars over time (some special bashes as well). It's a "baby steps" idea that helps you except the challenge to do just that... Greg Martin ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "PennsyRRfan" Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 20:37:39 GMT Subject: RE: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers From: Jerry Britton [mailto:jerry@pennsyrr.com] Subject: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers From: "STEPHEN HOXIE" Subject: Re: [PRR] Power Chassis For P2K FA Units Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 16:33:47 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-ELNK-Trace: 65fbc22f705d6e9971639b933de7ae6f7e972de0d01da9407d5f4f49130715f9b40a2b0ec8c3072c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 199.174.135.214 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hi Frank--Which FA, FA1 or FA2? Here is what I have done: FA1: From a Kato RS2 obtain the motor/flywheels and trucks. Strip the P2K chassis of everything. With your trusty Dremel cut away any metal that interferes with trucks. Runs like only a Kato can. FA2: From a Atls/Kato RS3 remove the hoods, cab and walkways. Drop the remaining chassis into the FA2 body. You will have to fashion a way to attach the body; I used four pieces of 1/4 x 1/4 styrene glued to the inside of the body at four locations then drilled thru the frame. Lots of room to add weight. Again, runs like only a Kato can. Steve Hoxie Pensacola FL ----- Original Message ----- From: "Park Varieties" To: "PRR-Talk" Sent: Thursday, August 26, 2004 2:47 PM Subject: [PRR] Power Chassis For P2K FA Units What would be a good power chassis to use under a P2K HO FA diesel? I spent a lot of time detailing the shells and am growing more upset each day with the poor running qualities of the power chassis. I don't know if the truck spacing is correct but has anyone ever considered or used the Walthers Trainline FA chassis? Thanks. Frank Brua ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Michael Hauk" Subject: [PRR] Northern Central roundhouse plans Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 17:59:11 -0400 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <27455.78091@dsop.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I'm looking for plans for wooden board-and-batten or brick roundhouse, circa late 19th / early 20th century. Did the Northern Central have standard design plans, and anyone have any idea if such might be available anywhere? Thanks, Mike Hauk ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: RDG2124@aol.com Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 20:01:29 EDT Subject: Re: [PRR] Power Chassis For P2K FA Units X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com The Atlas ALCO RS units will fit with little modification. Believe it was a fellow named Herzog, who had an article on his Leigh & New England layout, mentioned repowering the FA/FB units with the chassis and drive from the Atlas RS units. Something was also mention about the truck spacing being off by a foot or a half a foot. From the photos in the article, the repowered units look great. Evan Leisey RCT&HS 346 PRRT&HS 7487 PRRT&HS (Phila.) 2036 CNJ 2003 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Aidrian Bridgeman-Sutton" Subject: RE: [PRR] Broadway Limited Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 19:49:46 -0700 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 In-reply-to: <4A52884E-F75F-11D8-9378-000A958DAD46@vetmed.auburn.edu> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com And so while the great ones depart to their dinner, The secretary stays, growing thinner and thinner Racking his brain to record and report What he thinks that they think that they ought to have thought. ~-----Original Message----- <> Roundhouse queen perhaps? I had a quick squint at my USRA heavy mike and the only issue I can see would be finding suitable wheels and figuring out some form of compensating gear. If you have a lathe you might be able to turn the drivers to P87 profile, but there is a possible problem with this approach. Face off the back and you'll get have problems with the flange, face the front of the tyre and you might have a problem when it takes of the front of the spokes. The alternative might be to source a set of drivers from one of the specialist UK suppliers. These generally have plastic centres and are bored for 1/8" axles so you will need to finish turn to P87 profile - British P4 is slightly different - add counterweights from styrene sheet and figure out electrical pickup and axles. Look at www.sharmanwheels.com for 4mm wheels in P4 profile; their S182 which is a 4mm scale, 4' 7"diameter, 15spoke, wheel with 24inch crank throw and crank pin in line with the spoke might be as close as you can get for the USRA mikes. Other makers include Alan Gibson, Ultrascale and KM products. I have heard distant rumours that the Gibson tool room may be tuning up for some US prototype P87 drivers IMO, compensating gear will be needed for an 8 coupled engine even if it is sprung. That will be more of a challenge due to the construction of the frame, which doesn't leave much room for levers and axle boxes. I have a feeling you may be looking at some radical modifications here. What I would recommend is that you seek out some of the specialist UK magazines such as Model Railway Journal as well as some of the excellent books on the subject. P4 has been around for 35 years odd in one form or another and there's a lot of experience with finescale standards that you can tap into HTH Aidrian --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.744 / Virus Database: 496 - Release Date: 8/24/2004 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 08:07:07 -0400 From: "James L. McDaniel" Subject: Re: [PRR] Broadway Limited Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Bruce: make that an L1s with the same "a B6 or H10 as local switching power. N6B cabins, flat terrain and grain elevators" and it could also be Delmarva! All you need is more trees...lots more trees. The "grain rush" is starting here by the way with summer wheat and soon lots and lots of soybeans, many of which move by ex-PRR rail and car float to Tidewater. Jim McDaniel, Delmarva correspondent ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: Bruce Smith Subject: [PRR] Proto 87 drivers (was Broadway Limited) Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 07:42:53 -0500 To: "PRR-Talk TALK''" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Aug 26, 2004, at 9:49 PM, Aidrian Bridgeman-Sutton wrote: > Look at www.sharmanwheels.com for 4mm wheels in P4 profile; their S182 > which is a 4mm scale, 4' 7"diameter, 15spoke, wheel with 24inch crank > throw and crank pin in line with the spoke might be as close as you can > get for the USRA mikes. > > Other makers include Alan Gibson, Ultrascale and KM products. I have > heard distant rumours that the Gibson tool room may be tuning up for > some US prototype P87 drivers For drivers in the US, try Greenway Products (http://www.greenwayproducts.com/a_drivers.shtml) and NWSL. I'm not sure of the P87 status of the former, but IIRC the latter can be used to get new P87 tires. Regards Bruce Bruce F. Smith Auburn, AL http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/ "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin __ / \ __<+--+>________________\__/___ ________________________________ |- ______/ O O \_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ | | / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 \ | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__|| |/_____________________________\|_|________________________________| | O--O \0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Cc: "PRR-Talk TALK''" From: Bruce Smith Subject: [PRR] Setting the location (Delmarva) was Broadway Limited Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 07:48:03 -0500 To: jlmcdaniel@esva.net X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Aug 27, 2004, at 7:07 AM, James L. McDaniel wrote: > Bruce: make that an L1s with the same "a B6 or H10 as local > switching power. N6B cabins, flat terrain and grain elevators" and > it could also be Delmarva! All you need is more trees...lots more > trees. > > The "grain rush" is starting here by the way with summer wheat and > soon lots and lots of soybeans, many of which move by ex-PRR rail and > car float to Tidewater. Jim, et al, Maybe that H120s would work for you, but in my era (1944), the Delmarva Division had 34 2-8-0s consisting of 6 H6sb and 28 H9s. Nary an H10s in sight . Some additional cars would also set the "scene" as Delmarva, including reefers for the seafood (and fruit?) traffic, as well as the poultry industry. Regards Bruce Bruce F. Smith Auburn, AL http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/ "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin __ / \ __<+--+>________________\__/___ ________________________________ |- ______/ O O \_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ | | / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 \ | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__|| |/_____________________________\|_|________________________________| | O--O \0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "William Bigler" Subject: [PRR] Railfest '04 Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 11:42:13 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Anyone have any specifics about events planned for this year's Railfest in Altoona Oct. 2/3? The museum website just says more info coming late July. Can't find anymore on Google. Thanks! Bill Bigler - 4915 Big Flats NY Modeling PRR Renovo & Williamsport WWII ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 11:53:37 -0400 Subject: Re: [PRR] Railfest '04 From: Jerry Britton X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Friday, August 27, 2004, at 11:42 AM, William Bigler wrote: > Anyone have any specifics about events planned for this year's > Railfest in > Altoona Oct. 2/3? The museum website just says more info coming late > July. > Can't find anymore on Google. I received the mailing with the order form for tickets, including excursion tickets, several weeks ago. But as I do not plan to attend this year, I threw it out. Sorry. But the info was distributed, so it's out there somewhere! ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Chany, Christopher" Subject: [PRR] Walthers Passenger cars Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 12:44:35 -0400 From: "Kevin Lehman" Subject: Re: [PRR] Railfest '04 Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 12:53:43 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com The E-8`s will pull railfest excursions, including 3 times Saturday and = Sunday (10:20 am 12:30 pm 3:15 pm) round trips around Horseshoe curve = and thru Gallitzin tunnels. Rolling stock is back in resigned museum = yard. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 13:04:18 -0400 Subject: Re: [PRR] Railfest '04 From: Jerry Britton X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Friday, August 27, 2004, at 12:53 PM, Kevin Lehman wrote: > The E-8`s will pull railfest excursions, including 3 times Saturday > and Sunday (10:20 am 12:30 pm 3:15 pm) round trips around Horseshoe > curve and thru Gallitzin tunnels. Rolling stock is back in resigned > museum yard. Although I do not recall the particulars, they are also offering an excursion fare from Harrisburg to Altoona and back, and also an overnight trip to Pittsburgh. ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 13:10:39 -0400 Subject: Re: [PRR] Walthers Passenger cars From: Jerry Britton X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Friday, August 27, 2004, at 12:44 PM, Chany, Christopher wrote: > If anyone has gotten the new flyer from Walthers to order their new > catalog: > they will notice that the new heavy weights are on it. > > Do any of these look PRR? I've heard (not from Walthers) that Walthers will be doing * 12-1 (plan 3410-A) -- Yes for Pennsy * 8-1-2 (plan 3973) -- Pennsy had La Reine only; other 8-1-2's were plan 3979 * 14S (plan 3958) -- Yes, for Pennsy * 3-2-Obs -- ?? > > Also hiding behind the B&O cars is a PRR car attached to a R50. Is > that a > new car coming out or one of the old ones? Haven't seen the photo, can't comment. ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Bennett Levin" Subject: Re: [PRR] Railfest '04 Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 13:47:36 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com NOT TRUE..... See more recent information. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jerry Britton" To: "Kevin Lehman" Cc: "PRR-talk" ; "William Bigler" Sent: Friday, August 27, 2004 1:04 PM Subject: Re: [PRR] Railfest '04 > On Friday, August 27, 2004, at 12:53 PM, Kevin Lehman wrote: > > > The E-8`s will pull railfest excursions, including 3 times Saturday > > and Sunday (10:20 am 12:30 pm 3:15 pm) round trips around Horseshoe > > curve and thru Gallitzin tunnels. Rolling stock is back in resigned > > museum yard. > > Although I do not recall the particulars, they are also offering an > excursion fare from Harrisburg to Altoona and back, and also an > overnight trip to Pittsburgh. > ----------------------------------------------------------- > Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS > Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. > "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! > http://kc.pennsyrr.com > "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... > http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: PKMac101@aol.com Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 13:53:12 EDT Subject: [PRR-FAX] Minature 12 volt light bulb HELP List, I am in need of two minature 12 volt light bulbs with a bayonet style base. This is the same size as a flashlight bulb. The number is GE 257. It is a flasher bulb. I did find a place that can order them but I must order a min of 12 plus shp from Cal.,Don't need 12. If you have two spares or know where I can get two please email me off line please with price and or info. Thank you in advance. Pat McKinney Altoona,Pa. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PRR/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: PRR-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: PKMac101@aol.com Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 13:53:12 EDT Subject: [PRR] Minature 12 volt light bulb HELP X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com List, I am in need of two minature 12 volt light bulbs with a bayonet style base. This is the same size as a flashlight bulb. The number is GE 257. It is a flasher bulb. I did find a place that can order them but I must order a min of 12 plus shp from Cal.,Don't need 12. If you have two spares or know where I can get two please email me off line please with price and or info. Thank you in advance. Pat McKinney Altoona,Pa. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 13:57:05 -0400 Subject: Re: [PRR] Railfest '04 From: Jerry Britton X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Friday, August 27, 2004, at 01:47 PM, Bennett Levin wrote: > NOT TRUE..... > > See more recent information. Where? Bennett... when did this change? I got the mailer about a month ago, I think. I don't know why they don't have the mailer online. You'd "think" they'd want to make it easy for prospective attendees! > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jerry Britton" > To: "Kevin Lehman" > Cc: "PRR-talk" ; "William Bigler" > > Sent: Friday, August 27, 2004 1:04 PM > Subject: Re: [PRR] Railfest '04 > > >> On Friday, August 27, 2004, at 12:53 PM, Kevin Lehman wrote: >> >>> The E-8`s will pull railfest excursions, including 3 times Saturday >>> and Sunday (10:20 am 12:30 pm 3:15 pm) round trips around Horseshoe >>> curve and thru Gallitzin tunnels. Rolling stock is back in resigned >>> museum yard. >> >> Although I do not recall the particulars, they are also offering an >> excursion fare from Harrisburg to Altoona and back, and also an >> overnight trip to Pittsburgh. >> ----------------------------------------------------------- >> Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS >> Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. >> "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! >> http://kc.pennsyrr.com >> "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... >> http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> - >> For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. >> >> > > > ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: PKMac101@aol.com Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 14:15:31 EDT Subject: Re: [PRR] Railfest '04 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com List, I am told that there are no excursions around the Horseshoe Curve this year. There are to be trips on the Nitnany Bald Eagle from Tyrone to Port Matilda on Sat & Sun. 4 trips on Sat & 3 trips on Sun. OTHER DETAILS I DO NOT HAVE. Pat McKinney ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Cc: "PRR-Talk TALK''" From: Bruce Smith Subject: Re: [PRR] Walthers Passenger cars Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 13:50:10 -0500 To: Jerry Britton X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Aug 27, 2004, at 12:10 PM, Jerry Britton wrote: > On Friday, August 27, 2004, at 12:44 PM, Chany, Christopher wrote: > >> If anyone has gotten the new flyer from Walthers to order their new >> catalog: >> they will notice that the new heavy weights are on it. >> >> Do any of these look PRR? > > I've heard (not from Walthers) that Walthers will be doing > > * 12-1 (plan 3410-A) -- Yes for Pennsy Duplicates the Branchline model. > * 8-1-2 (plan 3973) -- Pennsy had La Reine only; other 8-1-2's were > plan 3979 A different source has this model as plan 3979A, duplicating Branchline. > * 14S (plan 3958) -- Yes, for Pennsy I can only find one PRR car with this plan, Samuel Morse (13 of plan 3959A) > * 3-2-Obs -- ?? Supposedly plan 3959D, however I find not plan 3959D cars in Tom Madden's database. The PRR did have one 3959J, Joel Chandler Harris and several 3959 cars were painted PRR red in the 1930s and those, and a number of others were sold to the PRR in 1942 for conversion to "workers" coaches. Hmm, I wonder how close the plans are ... The 36 seat diner is a NYC prototype (plan 7020-A) and the paired window coach is a B&O prototype (plan 2882-B) Regards Bruce Bruce F. Smith Auburn, AL http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/ "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin __ / \ __<+--+>________________\__/___ ________________________________ |- ______/ O O \_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ | | / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 \ | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__|| |/_____________________________\|_|________________________________| | O--O \0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 15:02:25 -0400 Subject: Re: [PRR] Railfest '04 From: Jerry Britton In-Reply-To: <104.4f372741.2e60dd49@aol.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Just received confirmation that excursions WERE planned for RailFest but those plans changed. No comment from source on reason(s) for change. Might I suggest that we avoid the subject of excursions so it doesn't get ugly, but discussion of other aspects of RailFest is welcome. Thank you. ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Kevin Lehman" Subject: Re: [PRR] Railfest '04 Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 14:51:10 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I got info from " The Standard ", Railroaders Memorial Museum flyers, = which I got last week. If it isn't true, I am sorry. What is pulling = excursions? ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Bennett Levin" Subject: Re: [PRR] Railfest '04 Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 15:16:33 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com It is my understanding that the E units are going to the museum for static display and will be open for inspection. The details are still being worked on. Bennett ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jerry Britton" To: "PRR-Talk LIST" Sent: Friday, August 27, 2004 3:02 PM Subject: Re: [PRR] Railfest '04 > Just received confirmation that excursions WERE planned for RailFest > but those plans changed. No comment from source on reason(s) for change. > > Might I suggest that we avoid the subject of excursions so it doesn't > get ugly, but discussion of other aspects of RailFest is welcome. Thank > you. > ----------------------------------------------------------- > Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS > Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. > "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! > http://kc.pennsyrr.com > "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... > http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Subject: [PRR] TrucTrain Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 15:32:46 -0400 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: PRR-Talk Digest - 08/27/04 Thread-Index: AcSL9GmkW269VrN5TLGqw1ksGJMQYQAd9BTA From: "Drye, John" To: "PRR-Talk" Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Dan Cupper writes: All three -- along with Spector and Eastern -- are depicted aboard the=20 PRR TrucTrain in the 1956 Grif Teller calendar titled Dynamic Progress.=20 PRR provided original photos to Teller for his use in creating the=20 painting -- those photos contain trailers bearing all of the above=20 trucking firms' names. ------------------------- Anyone else wonder whether this is more than a coincidence? Interesting = that artwork nearly 50 years old can still influence production = decisions today. Now, if we could only get an appropriate flat car in N = scale! John Drye ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Subject: [PRR] TrucTrain Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 15:32:46 -0400 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: PRR-Talk Digest - 08/27/04 Thread-Index: AcSL9GmkW269VrN5TLGqw1ksGJMQYQAd9BTA From: "Drye, John" To: "PRR-Talk" Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Dan Cupper writes: All three -- along with Spector and Eastern -- are depicted aboard the=20 PRR TrucTrain in the 1956 Grif Teller calendar titled Dynamic Progress.=20 PRR provided original photos to Teller for his use in creating the=20 painting -- those photos contain trailers bearing all of the above=20 trucking firms' names. ------------------------- Anyone else wonder whether this is more than a coincidence? Interesting = that artwork nearly 50 years old can still influence production = decisions today. Now, if we could only get an appropriate flat car in N = scale! John Drye ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Ted Andrews" Subject: RE: [PRR] TrucTrain Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 19:59:34 +0000 From: "Bob Zoeller" Subject: Re: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 16:43:14 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Jerry, where did you see that announcement or did you get a flyer? It is not on their website that I can find. Will the trailers be available separately or do you have to buy with tractors? Any part numbers or was this just a press release? Bob Zoeller ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jerry Britton" > Off-topic, but yet relevant, to 1950's modelers... > > Classic Metal Works has announced, for shipment in November, 1954 R-190 > tractors and Fruehauf 32' Aerovan Trailers in both HO and N scales. > > Other than Undecorated and Chicago Express, they are also being offered > in Mid-States and Cooper-Jarrett. What parts of the country did these > latter two roam in... around Pennsylvania by chance? ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2004 00:43:15 -0500 Subject: [PRR] PRR streamlined diners From: Frederick Ripley Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2004 00:43:15 -0500 Subject: [PRR] PRR streamlined diners From: Frederick Ripley Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2004 07:58:15 -0400 From: "James L. McDaniel" Subject: [PRR] Re: Setting the location (Delmarva) was Broadway Limited Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Oops, should have been H9s as pointed out by Bruce. It's the thought that counts....and the mass poultry industry came later to Delmarva. Perdue and Holly Farms (Tyson) came along in the early 70's well after the era of the real Delmarva Division. Reefers were everywhere both for local products -- mostly vegetables like taters (sweet) and arsh (white) taters as well as beans, greens, cabbage, on and on. There was less fruit, mostly strawberries and some peaches. I understand there were also lots of through reefers from the south to Philly & NY that came by car float, which traffic was one of the original reasons AJ Cassatt built the NYP&N. I have read somewhere that in the 1920s, Northampton and Accomack Counties (Virginia) were the two most productive farm counties (in dollars) in the US. Jim MCDaniel, easily corrected in Delmarva ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2004 10:20:56 -0700 (PDT) From: Geoffrey Van Dooren Subject: [PRR] Minimum radius for Walthers cars From: "Douglas Nelson" Subject: RE: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2004 10:50:57 -0700 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 In-Reply-To: X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Importance: Normal Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Any photos available? Doug Nelson -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Jerry @ Pennsy Sent: Friday, August 27, 2004 4:57 PM To: Bob Zoeller Cc: PRR-talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers On Aug 27, 2004, at 5:43 PM, Bob Zoeller wrote: > Jerry, where did you see that announcement or did you get a flyer? It > is > not on their website that I can find. > > Will the trailers be available separately or do you have to buy with=20 > tractors? > > Any part numbers or was this just a press release? Okay, guys, walking the fine line here... I got the info from one of my=20 distributors. Was trying to present in a non-dealer manner. Please keep=20 that in mind. Here are the part numbers and SUGGESTED RETAIL PRICES.=20 The N scale listings follow the HO listings. =A0 1954 R-190 TRACTOR W/ 32' FRUEHAUF AEROVAN TRAILER DUE 11/04 = 31101=A0=A0=A0 HENNIS=A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 $15.00 31102=A0=A0=A0 = ROADWAY=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 $15.00 31103=A0=A0=A0 P-I-E=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 $15.00 =A0 32' FRUEHAUF AEROVAN TRAILER 2 PACK DUE 11/04 31104=A0=A0=A0 CHICAGO EXPRESS=A0=A0=A0 $15.00 31105=A0=A0=A0 MID-STATES=A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 = =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 $15.00 31106=A0=A0=A0 COOPER-JARRETT=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 $15.00 31107=A0=A0=A0 UNDECORATED=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 =A0$15.00 =A0 1954 R-190 TRACTOR TRUCK DUE 11/04 31108=A0=A0=A0 CHICAGO EXPRESS=A0=A0=A0 $10.00 31109=A0=A0=A0 = MID-STATES=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0$10.00= 31110=A0=A0=A0 COOPER-JARRETT=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 $10.00 =A0 1954 INTERNATIONAL R-190 SEMI-TRACTOR TRUCK DUE 11/04 31111=A0=A0=A0 RED=A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 $10.00 31112=A0=A0=A0 GREEN=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0$10.00 31113=A0=A0=A0 WHITE=A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 $10.00 =A0 1954 INTERNATIONAL R-190 UNDEC. DELIVERY VANS DUE 11/04 30178=A0=A0=A0 RED CAB/WHITE = VAN=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0$10.00 30179=A0=A0=A0 DK GREEN CAB/SILVER VAN=A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0$10.00=A0 30180=A0=A0=A0 YELLOW CAB/SILVER = VAN=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0$10.00 =A0 N 1954 R-190 TRACTOR W/ 32' FRUEHAUF AEROVAN TRAILER DUE 11/04 = 51101=A0=A0=A0 HENNIS=A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 $16.00 51102=A0=A0=A0 = ROADWAY=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 $16.00 51103=A0=A0=A0 P-I-E=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 $16.00 =A0 N 32' FRUEHAUF AEROVAN TRAILER 2 PACK DUE 11/04 51104=A0=A0=A0=A0CHICAGO EXPRESS=A0=A0=A0 $16.00 51105=A0=A0=A0 MID-STATES=A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 = =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 $16.00 51106=A0=A0=A0 COOPER-JARRETT=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 $16.00 51107=A0=A0=A0 UNDECORATED=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 =A0$16.00 =A0 N 1954 R-190 TRACTOR TRUCK DUE 11/04 51108=A0=A0=A0 CHICAGO EXPRESS=A0=A0=A0 $11.00 51109=A0=A0=A0 = MID-STATES=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0$11.00= 51110=A0=A0=A0 COOPER-JARRETT=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 $11.00 =A0 N 1954 INTERNATIONAL R-190 SEMI-TRACTOR TRUCK DUE 11/04 51111=A0=A0=A0 RED=A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 $11.00 51112=A0=A0=A0 GREEN=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0$11.00 51113=A0=A0=A0 WHITE=A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 $11.00 =A0 N 1954 INTERNATIONAL R-190 UNDEC. DELIVERY VANS DUE 11/04 50178=A0=A0=A0 RED CAB/WHITE = VAN=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0$11.00 50179=A0=A0=A0 DK GREEN CAB/SILVER VAN=A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0$11.00=A0 50180=A0=A0=A0 YELLOW CAB/SILVER = VAN=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0$11.00 ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS jerry@pennsyrr.com Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone = Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: SUVCWORR@aol.com Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2004 15:18:20 EDT Subject: Re: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Jerry, Did you contact say if these were all diecast or diecast underframe and plastic bodies? Rich Orr In a message dated 8/28/2004 1:56:11 PM Eastern Daylight Time, dougnelson@mindspring.com writes: Okay, guys, walking the fine line here... I got the info from one of my distributors. Was trying to present in a non-dealer manner. Please keep that in mind. Here are the part numbers and SUGGESTED RETAIL PRICES. The N scale listings follow the HO listings. 1954 R-190 TRACTOR W/ 32' FRUEHAUF AEROVAN TRAILER DUE 11/04 31101 HENNIS $15.00 31102 ROADWAY $15.00 31103 P-I-E $15.00 32' FRUEHAUF AEROVAN TRAILER 2 PACK DUE 11/04 31104 CHICAGO EXPRESS $15.00 31105 MID-STATES $15.00 31106 COOPER-JARRETT $15.00 31107 UNDECORATED $15.00 1954 R-190 TRACTOR TRUCK DUE 11/04 31108 CHICAGO EXPRESS $10.00 31109 MID-STATES $10.00 31110 COOPER-JARRETT $10.00 1954 INTERNATIONAL R-190 SEMI-TRACTOR TRUCK DUE 11/04 31111 RED $10.00 31112 GREEN $10.00 31113 WHITE $10.00 1954 INTERNATIONAL R-190 UNDEC. DELIVERY VANS DUE 11/04 30178 RED CAB/WHITE VAN $10.00 30179 DK GREEN CAB/SILVER VAN $10.00 30180 YELLOW CAB/SILVER VAN $10.00 N 1954 R-190 TRACTOR W/ 32' FRUEHAUF AEROVAN TRAILER DUE 11/04 51101 HENNIS $16.00 51102 ROADWAY $16.00 51103 P-I-E $16.00 N 32' FRUEHAUF AEROVAN TRAILER 2 PACK DUE 11/04 51104 CHICAGO EXPRESS $16.00 51105 MID-STATES $16.00 51106 COOPER-JARRETT $16.00 51107 UNDECORATED $16.00 N 1954 R-190 TRACTOR TRUCK DUE 11/04 51108 CHICAGO EXPRESS $11.00 51109 MID-STATES $11.00 51110 COOPER-JARRETT $11.00 N 1954 INTERNATIONAL R-190 SEMI-TRACTOR TRUCK DUE 11/04 51111 RED $11.00 51112 GREEN $11.00 51113 WHITE $11.00 N 1954 INTERNATIONAL R-190 UNDEC. DELIVERY VANS DUE 11/04 50178 RED CAB/WHITE VAN $11.00 50179 DK GREEN CAB/SILVER VAN $11.00 50180 YELLOW CAB/SILVER VAN $11.00 ----------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: RickTipton@aol.com Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2004 15:42:56 EDT Subject: [PRR] Re: PRR-Talk Digest - 08/27/04 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com In a message dated 8/27/04 1:12:24 AM Eastern Daylight Time, PRR-Talk@dsop.com writes: > Subject: Re: [PRR] Broadway Limited > From: "Bruce Smith" > Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 09:41:55 -0500 > > On Aug 26, 2004, at 9:10 AM, Andy Miller wrote: > > >The USRA light 2-8-2 is not too improbable on a branchline RR. > > Excellent point! Not wanting an L2s I had ignored it... but you could > build a neat PRR granger scenario, with the L2S being the "road power" > and a B6 or H10 as local switching power. N6B cabins, flat terrain and > grain elevators would stamp an indellible "Lines West" impression in > the mind of the viewer. > > Regards > Bruce Tasty -- Eaton Ohio comes immediately to mind because of its passenger and freight stations -- there are several nice small towns to model on the Richmond Branch or Fort Wayne Branch, the prototype stomping grounds for the five L2s out of Pendleton/Undercliff in Cincinnati. Rick Tipton - Louisville KY Building a new Panhandle Route in HO (Pennsylvania RR Buckeye Div. 1966-1968) And Remembering PRR Lines West ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2004 13:22:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Doug Kisala Subject: Re: [PRR] Re: Branchline Passenger car survey sort of Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2004 15:53:04 -0500 Subject: [PRR] Re: TrucTrain From: John Sheets From: "Jerry Breon" Subject: [PRR] HO S2 Turbine Date: Sun, 29 Aug 2004 08:24:16 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Not sure how long it has been up, but I just noticed that Challenger = Imports has now posted pilot model photos of their upcoming S2 at: http://www.challengerimports.com/ Jerry Breon Birdsboro, PA ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Jerry Breon" Subject: [PRR] HO S2 Turbine Date: Sun, 29 Aug 2004 08:24:16 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Not sure how long it has been up, but I just noticed that Challenger = Imports has now posted pilot model photos of their upcoming S2 at: http://www.challengerimports.com/ Jerry Breon Birdsboro, PA ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Sun, 29 Aug 2004 12:25:21 -0400 (GMT-04:00) From: ealauterbach@earthlink.net Subject: [PRR] Walthers Heavyweights X-Mailer: Earthlink Zoo Mail 1.0 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I saw the ad in the latest MR and they look really nice. Which of these did Pennsy have? Also, any word yet on the B60b that Walthers is coming out with? Thanks, Eric ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Sun, 29 Aug 2004 13:31:24 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Re: [PRR] HO S2 Turbine From: smithbf@vetmed.auburn.edu X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com > Not sure how long it has been up, but I just noticed that Challenger > Imports has now posted pilot model photos of their upcoming S2 at: > http://www.challengerimports.com/ > Jerry Breon > Birdsboro, PA And the note at the bottom of the page that "Pennsylvania Railroad Classes H8, H9, and H10 2-8-0's" will be forthcoming as well. Regards Bruce Bruce Smith Auburn, AL ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Douglas Nelson" Subject: RE: [PRR] Walthers Heavyweights Date: Sun, 29 Aug 2004 14:28:40 -0700 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <13802196.1093796722443.JavaMail.root@huey.psp.pas.earthlink.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Three of the Walthers heavyweight Pullmans (12-1 Plan 3410-A, 8-1-2 Plan 3979-A, and the 14 section Plan 3958) were assigned to the PRR and = operated by Pullman (when built to ca. 1948). These three cars were also bought = by the PRR ca. 1948 after the Pullman breakup. The 3-2-observation Plan = 3959-D apparently was not assigned to the PRR when built. PRR did purchase a single 3-2-obs ca. 1948. These models look excellent and these cars could be found mixed in with lightweight cars on most trains through the 1950s. Doug Nelson -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of ealauterbach@earthlink.net Sent: Sunday, August 29, 2004 9:25 AM To: prr-talk@dsop.com Subject: [PRR] Walthers Heavyweights I saw the ad in the latest MR and they look really nice. Which of these = did Pennsy have? Also, any word yet on the B60b that Walthers is coming out with? Thanks, Eric ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Subject: RE: [PRR] PRR streamlined diners Date: Sun, 29 Aug 2004 17:06:59 -0500 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [PRR] PRR streamlined diners Thread-Index: AcSNaqaEpiJHO8NmQ6et4y1PJbOsugAqWOhA From: "Cadwell, Marvin L" To: "Christopher Baker" , "Frederick Ripley" , X-OriginalArrivalTime: 29 Aug 2004 22:06:59.0898 (UTC) FILETIME=[81A809A0:01C48E14] Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Budd built, fluted diner,class D82bR, #4504, painted in FOM colors and displayed at the 1939 World's Fair is shown on P 59 of Blardone and Tilp's "Pennsylvania Railroad - Passenger Car Painting and Lettering", Published by the PRRT&HS. -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com]On Behalf Of Christopher Baker Sent: Saturday, August 28, 2004 8:48 PM To: Frederick Ripley; PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: RE: [PRR] PRR streamlined diners The Pennsy did own some prewar Budd-built diners that were painted in the FOM scheme. Later, these cars received the postwar all-Tuscan scheme but eventually the paint was stripped and the cars operated in natural stainless (albeit some with black-painted roofs). While technically not part of the East-West fleet of trains, the South Wind is one noteworthy example where a Budd-built, fluted diner was painted. I've seen pictures of others in various PRR books, but I'm not within easy reach of my resources at the moment to give more details. Chris Baker PRRT&HS #1918 -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com]On Behalf Of Frederick Ripley Sent: Saturday, August 28, 2004 12:43 AM To: PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: [PRR] PRR streamlined diners Hello all, Did the PRR own any single-unit diners that were streamlined, fluted, and painted tuscan red (in east-west service)? Thanks, Fred ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: Bruce Smith Subject: Re: [PRR] Walthers Heavyweights Date: Mon, 30 Aug 2004 08:15:24 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Aug 29, 2004, at 4:28 PM, Douglas Nelson wrote: > The 3-2-observation Plan 3959-D > apparently was not assigned to the PRR when built. PRR did purchase a > single 3-2-obs ca. 1948. Not exactly . According to Chuck Blardone in his article on wartime coach conversions (The Keystone, Summer 2001, vol 34, no 2), the PRR purchased 21 3-2-lounge-obs cars for conversion to PUW134. I found the following plan 3959 cars listed in Tom Madden's database as purchased by PRR in 1942. I realize that these cars were gutted and rebuilt to coaches upon purchase, but I believe that the window arrangement was unchanged - although I'll have to check my Keystone. I'm anxious to see how feasible the conversion is from the Walthers car. Central Falls Central Ferry Central Grove Central Mills Central Mine Central Route Central Provinces Central Mountains Ponce De Leon John Kinzie Leif Ericson Mark Beaubien Baffin Bay The car noted by Doug above was Joel Chandler Harris, which started as 3959, was converted to 3959C (10/8/29) then 3959G (6/2/37) and finally 3959J (5/17/40). Interesting, this car wore Southern two tone green (10/8/29), was repainted Pull. Std. (6/6/31), repainted to Southern Two-tone green (11/27/33), then to Pull. Std. (7/30/34) and finally PRR Red MDD4973, probably in 1948 at purchase. As I noted previously, in fact there are NO plan 3959D in Tom Madden's database at all, leading me to wonder what car Walthers is modeling (note that the database is not complete). Regards Bruce Bruce F. Smith Auburn, AL http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/ "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin __ / \ __<+--+>________________\__/___ ________________________________ |- ______/ O O \_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ | | / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 \ | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__|| |/_____________________________\|_|________________________________| | O--O \0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Douglas Nelson" Subject: RE: [PRR] Walthers Heavyweights Date: Mon, 30 Aug 2004 10:58:37 -0700 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hi Bruce and list: =20 The Pullman Passenger Car Catalog shows 29 3-2-obs Plan 3959-D built in = 1925 for service on B&O (4), NYC (20), and Southern (5). More minutia to = file in the back of our brains. The other 3-2-obs purchased by PRR apparently = were never listed amount PRR-owned sleeping cars due to their conversions to coaches. =20 Doug Nelson -----Original Message----- From: Bruce Smith [mailto:smithbf@vetmed.auburn.edu]=20 Sent: Monday, August 30, 2004 6:15 AM To: Douglas Nelson Cc: prr-talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] Walthers Heavyweights On Aug 29, 2004, at 4:28 PM, Douglas Nelson wrote: The 3-2-observation Plan 3959-D apparently was not assigned to the PRR when built. PRR did purchase a single 3-2-obs ca. 1948. Not exactly . According to Chuck Blardone in his article on wartime = coach conversions (The Keystone, Summer 2001, vol 34, no 2), the PRR purchased = 21 3-2-lounge-obs cars for conversion to PUW134. I found the following plan 3959 cars listed in Tom Madden's database as purchased by PRR in 1942. I realize that these cars were gutted and rebuilt to coaches upon = purchase, but I believe that the window arrangement was unchanged - although I'll = have to check my Keystone. I'm anxious to see how feasible the conversion is = from the Walthers car. Central Falls Central Ferry Central Grove Central Mills Central Mine Central Route Central Provinces Central Mountains Ponce De Leon John Kinzie Leif Ericson Mark Beaubien Baffin Bay The car noted by Doug above was Joel Chandler Harris, which started as = 3959, was converted to 3959C (10/8/29) then 3959G (6/2/37) and finally 3959J (5/17/40). Interesting, this car wore Southern two tone green (10/8/29), = was repainted Pull. Std. (6/6/31), repainted to Southern Two-tone green (11/27/33), then to Pull. Std. (7/30/34) and finally PRR Red MDD4973, probably in 1948 at purchase. As I noted previously, in fact there are NO plan 3959D in Tom Madden's database at all, leading me to wonder what car Walthers is modeling = (note that the database is not complete). Regards Bruce Bruce F. Smith=20 Auburn, AL http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/ "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin __ / \ __<+--+>________________\__/___ ________________________________ |- ______/ O O \_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ | | / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 \ | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__|| |/_____________________________\|_|________________________________| | O--O \0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Tom Mahon" Subject: [PRR] Photo Contest Criteria Date: Mon, 30 Aug 2004 20:57:21 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Good Evening, Had a great time last Saturday with the NE Chapter of the PRRT&H at the Berkshire Scenic Railway in Lenox, MA. Ted Garner and Jack Trowill set up a nice day. Thanks, guys. I recently resigned from two committees in my community and then volunteered to try to run a Railroad Photo and Graphic Arts Contest at our (Bedford (NH) Boomers) train show in November. Would appreciate it if anyone with experience in this type of activity would contact me off list and offer their words of wisdom and kind support. I need the real basics: size of submissions, categories (at this point merely looking at Open and under 14 or 15), who or if anyone is usually responsible for mounting or framing, identifying entries so that they can be returned, etc. Waivers, disclaimers and other possible legal stuff. As you can see, basic, basic, basic. Oh, it's also OK to question my sanity. Thanks. Tom Mahon Merrimack, NH ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2004 07:39:40 -0400 Subject: [PRR] TANGENT - Maintenance This Evening From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: <722F9AFE-FB42-11D8-8E12-000393835C88@pennsyrr.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com The servers at Desktop Solutions (DSOP.COM), which includes the PENNSYRR.COM domain, will be under maintenance this evening, in the window between 8 and 11 p.m., ET. Following a flood last month, the servers were moved to an alternate location. Now that the office has been refurbed, it is time to move them back. Downtime will actually be less than 45 minutes, but it is hard to predict ahead of time exactly when the move will take place. Thank you for your patience during this downtime. ---------------------------------------- Listmaster Desktop Solutions of Pennsylvania, Inc. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2004 08:15:24 -0400 Subject: [PRR] N Scale PRR P85b Coaches From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: <6FA1F828-FB47-11D8-8E12-000393835C88@pennsyrr.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Public Service Announcement... InterMountain (Centralia Car Shops) has shipped the N scale PRR P85b coaches in the KEYSTONE scheme. Reservations were very low on this version, but they still ran it. They opted to not even list it in their monthly releases! In fact, they only ran enough to cover dealer reservations. As a result, InterMountain is sold out. Dealers who had "spares" on order may have them in stock. If you are interested, you'd better snatch them up quick! Though InterMountain is sold out, some of the second run P85b's in PENNSYLVANIA letterboard scheme remain in the dealer channel. InterMountain and CCS will consider a third run based on additional reservations. ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Walter Prusick" Subject: [PRR] "fishbelly" hoppers Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2004 18:25:28 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Guys, Did any of the railroads which interchanged with the Pennsy in the Western PA area have a fishbelly hopper (ala Stewart Hobbies) on/in their roster? If so which one/s and whom should I contact to get some information? I intended to do a couple of GLca, until I got around to Mr. Teichmoeller's book. Close (maybe) but no cigar. Thanks in advance, Walt Prusick ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] "fishbelly" hoppers Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2004 18:33:08 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 In-reply-to: <000a01c48fa9$6ccf81c0$03669b04@stargate.net> Thread-index: AcSPqaL9B0Q+aLI2Qb+aGBWrY0eyDAAAKfZA Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com N&W. Class H1, I believe. I have several Stewarts which I run in a N&W cut with ECW H2a's. regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Walter Prusick Sent: Tuesday, August 31, 2004 6:25 PM To: PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: [PRR] "fishbelly" hoppers Guys, Did any of the railroads which interchanged with the Pennsy in the Western PA area have a fishbelly hopper (ala Stewart Hobbies) on/in their roster? If so which one/s and whom should I contact to get some information? I intended to do a couple of GLca, until I got around to Mr. Teichmoeller's book. Close (maybe) but no cigar. Thanks in advance, Walt Prusick ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Cc: "PRR-TALK" , From: Bruce Smith Subject: Re: [PRR] PRR (S2) Tarnish Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 07:57:23 -0500 To: "Sam Vastano" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.618) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Aug 2, 2004, at 6:38 AM, Sam Vastano wrote: > Group, > > I am in the midst of working on a Brass S2 and the engine is very > tarnished... I am talking Black in some areas... I was looking for > ideas to remove the tarnish and not the details.... > > Any ideas out there? Sam, By the far the easiest (best?) way I know is to grit-blast it. If you then want to paint it, you are all set as the brass now has "tooth" to hold the paint, and if you want to leave it unpainted, you can polish it with beads in the grit blaster and clear coat it. I have used Tarn-X, but if there is a clear coat, you will need to strip it first, and you can get somewhat uneven tarnish removal. Regards Bruce Bruce F. Smith V.M.D., Ph.D. Scott-Ritchey Research Center 334-844-5587, 334-844-5850 (fax) http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/ "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin __ / \ __<+--+>________________\__/___ ________________________________ |- ______/ O O \_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ | | / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 \ | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__|| |/_____________________________\|_|________________________________| | O--O \0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] Re: Fwd: FW: NEW PRODUCTS: ALCO RSD15 & PRR K4s Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 09:57:07 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-reply-to: <20040805134222.66991.qmail@web52603.mail.yahoo.com> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcR68uSm7jt2M8P/TZicoHMTxYiBOgAAJ1Wg Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com How did BLI figure out that since my wife bought a new bicycle she "owes me one" ;-) I guess they just figured there must still be more cash they can suck out of me. Well, I'll just have to put off the mortgage for another month. I hope this engine will follow their recent practice and include an optional traction tire. At last, a detailed K4 that pulls! My J1 with traction tire has hauled 50 cars up the long curving 2% grade at the North Shore Club! Something to supplement my Bowser K4's. regards, Andy Miller The MITRE Corp -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Bill Daniels Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 9:42 AM To: PRR-Talk Subject: [PRR] Re: Fwd: FW: NEW PRODUCTS: ALCO RSD15 & PRR K4s OOps...forgot about the list not accepting mime... Anyways, there was a SECOND announcement from BLI which in the rush of excitement for the RDS15 is the K4s (hmmm...does anybody on this list care? ;-) in THREE versions...classic (pre-1938), and modernized (beauty treatment) with and without drop coupler. It is the first of a new series called Platinum Paragon. Priced at $450.00, delivery expected in October. ===== Bill Daniels Las Vegas, NV __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - Send 10MB messages! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Ken Hough " Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 14:50:37 -0500 Subject: Re: [PRR] PRR Steam loco headlights Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 16:34:04 -0400 From: Don Murphy Subject: Re: [PRR] Re: BLI K-4s Annoucement X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at out006.verizon.net from [4.41.106.228] at Fri, 6 Aug 2004 15:34:06 -0500 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I paid $200.00 for the Red Ball a year ago at a train show.I couldn't get my wallet out fast enough! $160 for a PFM K4 about 10 years ago at a show. Two years ago I bought a mint PFM L1 for $300.00at another show. I consider these all to be good deals. I grew up looking at the PFM ads on the back cover of model rairoad mags. The $49.00 and $59.00 prices were out of reach of this 12 year old then but the prices I pay for the same models today are bargains compared to new Railworks or Key models. Its nice to be able to fix them with solder instead of plastic glue. Easier to strip the paint off too. But there is a thrill to removing a T1 from the box, placing it on the track and having it run and make realistic noise right from the box! Don Murphy John Sheets wrote: >Don > > >>I own several BLI engines and think they're great but the $450.00 price >>tag on the K4 makes me think of what a great deal my PFM and Red Ball >>K4s are! >> >> > >Funny, I thought the same thing, except can you imagine what they would cost >today? Think I paid $79 or $99 > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] P70 Coach Wheel Diameter Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 11:48:51 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-reply-to: <36.5ef405e0.2e45aac0@aol.com> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcR8MhQPqg7wTGVQT7uuaZYpyUJmGQB9kQjg Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Yes regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of RDG2124@aol.com Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 11:47 PM To: PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: [PRR] P70 Coach Wheel Diameter What size wheels were used on these coaches? 36" Dia.? Thank you, Evan Leisey RCT&HS 346 PRRT&HS 7487 PRRT&HS (Phila.) 2036 CNJ 2003 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Bob Zoeller" Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI cars Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 20:50:54 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I mentioned this on the Passenger Car List, with the question whether this was the same prototype Walthers announced a car for at the Train show for fall delivery. Bob Zoeller ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "PRR-Talk" Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2004 4:45 PM Subject: [PRR] BLI cars > Don't know if this has beenn discussed earlier or not. From the Trains web page at Kalmbach: > > We just received word that Broadway Limited Imports will be producing HO scale models of General American 53'-6" wood express refrigerator cars with factory-installed grab irons and Kadee couplers in more than a dozen roadnames, and in multiple numbers. Look for complete details in tomorrow evening's News & Products update. > Best wishes, > Terry > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Bennett Levin" Subject: Re: [PRR] NEC Corridor Date: Sat, 14 Aug 2004 21:04:33 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Razor Blades! Bennett ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Frantz" To: Sent: Saturday, August 14, 2004 8:43 PM Subject: [PRR] NEC Corridor Gents and All, I had to travel yesterday from Baltimore to Philadelphia and i must say that it being the fist time i've riden this stretch that I had a great time. Getting on at penn Satation in baltimore i found a seat in the last car at the seat closest to the rear of the train. As it so happened the conductor was at this end punching tickets. I politely asked if he would mind me standing at the rear door to observe the passing ROW. He had no objections and i rode most of the hour trip watching out the rear door. Not quite the Observation lounge of the 120, but still an experience. I was suprised at the number of brick/wood construction towers that are still standing. One thing that I was sad to see while riding SEPTA north from 30th street was that the B60b and REA car that used to sit at the rear of the power plant in penn Coach have disappeared. Would anybody know what happened to them? A little kindness can still go a long way in cooperating with AMTRAK employees. Regards, John ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Benjamin Hom" Subject: Re: [PRR] PRR Talk St. Louis Prototype Modelers Meet Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 17:32:17 -0700 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com John Caples asked: "Anyone from this list going to this meet? I would like to meet other PRR fans at this show." I'll be there. See you on Saturday! Ben Hom ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Wayne S. Betty" Subject: RE: [PRR] B1 electric switchers Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 17:35:30 -0400 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <20040816210318.36260.qmail@web41904.mail.yahoo.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Importance: Normal X-SLUIDL: D1482D17-5EB04163-9EE07E4E-8B7D67EA Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I'll have to look it up- but off the top of my head (it's a bit mushy lately) the B1s ran with a full switch crew. Crew reduction didn't happen until the advent of the 45 ton limit. Engines below 45 tons gross could be operated with just an engineer and no fireman was needed. I think this was negotiated about 1946 (Rule book guys - jump in here) - the result was the GS4. The B1, weighing in at 78 tons was weigh (a poor pun) over the limit. Hopefully someone else can confirm the full crew too. Cos Wayne S. Betty Cos Communications, Inc. Small business IT services. Lancaster & Atlantic Rail Road NMRA, MER, Susquehanna Div, 11 NHRS, Lancaster & PRRT&HS #7061 http://www.wsbcos.com/trainsmenu.htm at the west end of the PRR electrified zone "If we can not have what we like, we must learn to like what we have!" John Paul Jones Subject: [PRR] B1 electric switchers Hi, Does anyone know how many crewman operated a B1 electric in a yard? Was it just an engineer or was there a fireman as well? And was this different from when the units were coupled together in the 1920s? Thanks for any info. Frank Smith ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Subject: RE: [PRR] Part of Marietta Branch in operation again Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 08:36:34 -0500 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [PRR] Part of Marietta Branch in operation again Thread-Index: AcSFmXD1+GDggDd1RsibEDLoiRfPLAAVxmjg From: "Cadwell, Marvin L" To: "jeffrey d thomas" , Cc: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Aug 2004 13:36:35.0503 (UTC) FILETIME=[8BF6B3F0:01C485F1] Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com If one opens up the Buckeye Central Website and clicks on "Other RRs & = Railroad Items of Interest, one can open up the following web-site: =20 http://www.rosecity.net/trains/station.html The St. Louis & Iron Mountain Railway claims that its (restored) E8 = locomotive is ex PRR #5989. Anybody have any further information on this? -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com]On Behalf Of jeffrey d thomas Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2004 9:36 PM To: PRR-Talk@dsop.com Cc: PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: [PRR] Part of Marietta Branch in operation again I just spent the weekend in=20 Southeastern Ohio, and discovered that part of the Marietta branch has been repaired and is being operated by a tourist railroad. The Buckeye Central Railroad, apparently has moved it's operations from Buckeye = Lake, to Byesville, Ohio. They, or some local government agency, repaired the flood damaged line from Byesville, south to Derwent, and operate trains on the weekends. The conductor told me they hope to operate clear out to Cumberland on the old B&O trackage that branches off the Marietta line = at Derwent.=20 The line from Byesville, all the way to the end of track south of Cumberland, is heavy, welded rail. This trackage would let them take riders out to "The Wilds", a huge nature preserve in the old mine reclamation areas near Cumberland. The railroad has a very nice website with some history of these rail lines. www.buckeyecentralrailroad.org Jeff thomas Denton, Tx. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "STEPHEN HOXIE" Subject: Re: [PRR] Last Run Date Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 11:30:55 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-ELNK-Trace: 65fbc22f705d6e9971639b933de7ae6f7e972de0d01da94092e5a81dac8b67c23ffd3bb6e10c0d37350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 199.174.139.210 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hi Gary--From the Keystone, March 1977, p. 11, "On Monday November 25, 1957, engineman W. E. Densol of the Pittsburgh Division pulled out of Cresson eastbound past MO tower with fifty hopper cars of coal and an I1sa locomotive. He rounded the Horseshoe Curve at 9:20 am and dropped his train at Juniata Scales. When the engine was put in the roundhouse at East Altoona, the last revenue steam run on the PRR was finished. It is fitting that the last steam operation had an I1sa, coal, and the Horseshoe Curve together for one last time." Steve Hoxie Pensacola FL ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Mittner" To: Sent: Thursday, August 19, 2004 9:48 AM Subject: [PRR] Last Run Date > List, > > What was the date of that last steam operation on the PRR > supposedly regarding an I1sa and hopper train in or around > Cresson/Galitzin/Altoona area? Thanks, Gary > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Sam Vastano" Subject: Re: [PRR] PRR in the Movies alert!! Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2004 10:37:56 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 24 Aug 2004 14:36:12.0849 (UTC) FILETIME=[B44B2210:01C489E7] Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Group, Just for the heck of it I wanted to see what that movie sells for so I looked it up on e-bay.... Pretty pricy for such an old movie. VHS was 68.00 and someone was selling the 16MM version for over 100.00 Sam V ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ted Andrews" To: "PRR Talk" Sent: Monday, August 23, 2004 11:57 PM Subject: [PRR] PRR in the Movies alert!! PRR Listers: I was watching Turner Movie Classics this evening. They are showing the following movie: The Major and the Minor, (1942), starring Ginger Rogers and Ray Milland. The movie plot is a woman (Rogers) disguises herself as a little girl and ends up in a military academy. The beginning of the movie takes place on the EB Broadway Limited and has some great action shots of the Broadway heading out of Chicago and going across the 4-tracked mainline in Pennsylvania pulled by K-4 3768 (fully streamlined) Great action shots!!! Ted Andrews ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] branchline survey Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 15:41:51 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcSK1wIJSgrrW5AqRRqk51Z+Wm9SOgAAGNBQ In-reply-to: <001001c48ad7$81f782e0$0401a8c0@johng> Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I (again) want to nominate some of the more common single vestibule cars; a 6-6 POPLAR car, and/or an 8-5 CLOVER car. Last time I did this a long discussion ensued as to which of several variations should be done. "Frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn!" Anything would be better than nothing. Nothing is what we have now. I would be far happier with a 4084B standing in for a 4084A than with the Bachmann thing. regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of trainmonster@stargate.net Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2004 3:13 PM To: PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: [PRR] branchline survey hello, all... i will continue to buy the heavyweight sleepers in kit config., and if they appear in rtr. format, i'll most likely pick up some of them as well. a fair price for the cars, all up and running would be $ 60- $ 65....imho. now lets get them thinking about some new car types. how about an 8 section club lounge car. can you say " lotos club " ????!! jaygee ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: SUVCWORR@aol.com Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 16:54:50 EDT Subject: Re: [PRR] Branchline Question X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com ALL: The responses can be sent directly to me. I only sent the original message to Jerry because I wasn't sure it fit within the guidelines of the group. That being said, I am not an agent for Branchline. I am a dealer and as such was asked my opinion regarding RTR passenger cars and how my customers felt about RTR passenger cars. To get a better idea of what people thought (the bigger the pool, the more accurate the response), I wanted to present the question to the list. So please don't flood Jerry's mailbox. I am keeping tab and will report the results. Thanks. Rich Orr ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Chany, Christopher" Subject: RE: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 14:51:33 -0400 From: Jerry Britton [mailto:jerry@pennsyrr.com] Subject: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 15:58:43 -0400 From: Jeff Warner Subject: Re: [PRR] Power Chassis For P2K FA Units Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Frank: I am running a set of Reading FA-1's over the Walthers Trainline chassis. They fit fine with only minor modifications needed. I can't comment on the prototypically correctness of the Walthers trucks. I could send a .JPG of my units if you'd like to see them. There were 2 runs of P2K FA's. The newer one is much better than the older one (older had the moving fans, newer did not). What problem are you having with them? Jeff Warner > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 15:43:39 -0400 Subject: Re: [PRR] TrucTrain From: Jerry Britton X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Friday, August 27, 2004, at 03:32 PM, Drye, John wrote: > Anyone else wonder whether this is more than a coincidence? > Interesting that artwork nearly 50 years old can still influence > production decisions today. Now, if we could only get an appropriate > flat car in N scale! As for the original F30d's... Patience!!! ;-) We also need correct PRR trailers. I prefer the earlier 24-26' versions. Again, patience!!! ;-) ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Christopher Baker" Subject: RE: [PRR] PRR streamlined diners Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2004 21:47:33 -0400 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Importance: Normal Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com The Pennsy did own some prewar Budd-built diners that were painted in the FOM scheme. Later, these cars received the postwar all-Tuscan scheme but eventually the paint was stripped and the cars operated in natural stainless (albeit some with black-painted roofs). While technically not part of the East-West fleet of trains, the South Wind is one noteworthy example where a Budd-built, fluted diner was painted. I've seen pictures of others in various PRR books, but I'm not within easy reach of my resources at the moment to give more details. Chris Baker PRRT&HS #1918 -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com]On Behalf Of Frederick Ripley Sent: Saturday, August 28, 2004 12:43 AM To: PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: [PRR] PRR streamlined diners Hello all, Did the PRR own any single-unit diners that were streamlined, fluted, and painted tuscan red (in east-west service)? Thanks, Fred ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Al Buchan" Subject: RE: [PRR] HO S2 Turbine Date: Sun, 29 Aug 2004 11:48:48 -0400 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2742.200 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Jerry, et al.: Re: I just noticed that Challenger Imports has now posted pilot model photos of their upcoming S2 PRRT&HS modeling committee member Joe Acri has been working with Challenger imports on this model. Al ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Sam Vastano" Subject: [PRR] PRR (S2) Tarnish Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 07:38:31 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Group, I am in the midst of working on a Brass S2 and the engine is very = tarnished... I am talking Black in some areas... I was looking for ideas = to remove the tarnish and not the details.... Any ideas out there? Thanks SamV ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Sam Vastano" Subject: [PRR] PRR (S2) Tarnish Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 07:38:31 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Group, I am in the midst of working on a Brass S2 and the engine is very = tarnished... I am talking Black in some areas... I was looking for ideas = to remove the tarnish and not the details.... Any ideas out there? Thanks SamV ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Dennis" Subject: Re: [PRR] PRR (S2) Tarnish Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2004 07:49:21 -0700 From: "Sam Vastano" Subject: Re: [PRR] PRR (S2) Tarnish Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 11:02:36 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Aug 2004 15:01:06.0194 (UTC) FILETIME=[894EFF20:01C478A1] Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Bruce, Dennis, Group, I don't have access to a blaster so I will try the Ajax Cleanser. The model doesn't have clear on is so that might work. thanks SamV ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dennis" To: "Sam Vastano" ; "PRR-TALK" Sent: Monday, August 02, 2004 10:49 AM Subject: Re: [PRR] PRR (S2) Tarnish > I have had good luck using Ajax Cleanser and a toothbrush under warm > water. > > Good Luck > > Dennis Terebecki > > > > Group, > > > > I am in the midst of working on a Brass S2 and the engine is very > tarnished... I am talking Black in some areas... I was looking for > ideas to remove the tarnish and not the details.... > > > > Any ideas out there? > > > > Thanks > > > > SamV > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > - > > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > > > > > > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: LAMAassoc@aol.com Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 11:24:17 EDT Subject: Re: [PRR] PRR (S2) Tarnish X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Mac sub 46 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com In a message dated 8/2/04 8:41:52 AM, svastano@hotmail.com writes: << I am in the midst of working on a Brass S2 and the engine is very tarnished... I am talking Black in some areas... I was looking for ideas to remove the tarnish and not the details.... >> Sam - I've never tried it on brass, but when I clean metal, I use the "polishing compound" that is next to the car polish in the auto-motive supply shop. I don't think it is as abrasive as Ajax and shouldn't scratch. The polishing compound has grit in it but it does not seem to scratch. If there is also a splotchy coating, laquer, for example, I'll mix in a splash of mineral spirits. I, too, like to use old toothbrushes and collect them as the family runs through them. But, I use enough of them that I'll stop in a dollar store and, once in a while, pick up inexpensive new brushes for immediate use in the garage. Regards, Marty ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: zootowerprr@webtv.net Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 20:21:49 -0400 Subject: [PRR] PRR-Erie RR crossing at Kouts Ind. MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Greetings, Can anyone tell me if there was an Erie RR tower operator working in KOUTS tower along side of the PRR operators or did the PRR control the Erie-PRR mainline crossings alone? I also noticed (from a movie of the PRR-Erie RR crossing) that there are Erie semaphores signals protecting their main crossing. Are those semaphores control from KOUTS Tower? I have a PRR Chicago Division,Western Region interlocking book from the 1960s and it does say the KOUTS Tower is operated PRR 50% and Erie RR 50%, so maybe there was a Erie RR employee working the tower, but I'm not sure. Any info is appreciated,thanks in advance. Dave Hopson ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: PKMac101@aol.com Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 20:31:40 EDT Subject: [PRR-FAX] PRR E8s on the move east.Left Altoona @ 7:14pm List, 5711 & 5809 are moving east at a rapid pace. They left Altoona at 7:14 pm. Not much daylight left to watch. Pat McKinney [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Yahoo! Domains - Claim yours for only $14.70 http://us.click.yahoo.com/Z1wmxD/DREIAA/yQLSAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PRR/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: PRR-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: PKMac101@aol.com Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 20:31:40 EDT Subject: [PRR] PRR E8s on the move east.Left Altoona @ 7:14pm X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com List, 5711 & 5809 are moving east at a rapid pace. They left Altoona at 7:14 pm. Not much daylight left to watch. Pat McKinney ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Gregg Mahlkov" Subject: Re: [PRR] PRR-Erie RR crossing at Kouts Ind. Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 20:55:27 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Dave, I can shed a little light on this as I was the VP-Traffic of the last railroad to operate the old Erie line, The Chicago & Indiana Railroad. The tower operator was a Conrail (by that time) employee and we had to notify CR 8 hours in advance of making a move so that they would be sure to have an employee on duty. I strongly suspect that the PRR always furnished the tower operator, but billed the Erie for half his wages, plus half to the cost of the electricity, light bulbs, pencils, paper, and yes, even toilet paper! We'd tell them we were coming, arrive, flash the headlight, and sound the horn for at least 10 minutes before they'd clear the interlocking, so yes, the tower definitely controlled the Erie signals. Gregg Mahlkov ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Monday, August 02, 2004 8:21 PM Subject: [PRR] PRR-Erie RR crossing at Kouts Ind. > Greetings, > > Can anyone tell me if there was an Erie RR tower operator > working in KOUTS tower along side of the PRR operators or did the PRR > control the Erie-PRR mainline crossings alone? I also noticed (from a > movie of the PRR-Erie RR crossing) that there are Erie semaphores > signals protecting their main crossing. Are those semaphores control > from KOUTS Tower? > I have a PRR Chicago Division,Western Region interlocking book > from the 1960s and it does say the KOUTS Tower is operated PRR 50% and > Erie RR 50%, so maybe there was a Erie RR employee working the tower, > but I'm not sure. > Any info is appreciated,thanks in advance. > > Dave Hopson > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: DWSNRHS@aol.com Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 22:53:48 EDT Subject: Re: [PRR] PRR E8s on the move east.Left Altoona @ 7:14pm X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com In a message dated 08/02/2004 8:39:24 PM Eastern Daylight Time, PKMac101@aol.com writes: List, 5711 & 5809 are moving east at a rapid pace. They left Altoona at 7:14 pm. Not much daylight left to watch. Pat McKinney HI PAT I CAUGHT THE TRAIN AT 24TH ST AND 8TH ST JUNIATA BETWEEN 7 PM AND 7:14. . QUITE A SHOW. DOES ANYONE HAVE A LIST OF THE PRIVATE VARNISH IN THE CONSIST? dave seidel ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Tue, 3 Aug 2004 15:11:13 -0400 Subject: [PRR] "Susquehanna Limited" Excursion Slated From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com The Harrisburg Chapter of the National Railway Historical Society has announced the "Susquehanna Limited" fall foliage excursion for Saturday, October 30th. Bennett's restored PRR E8's will lead an Amtrak fall foliage excursion out of Harrisburg east on the Amtrak main line to Philadelphia, south on the Northeast Corridor to Perryville, north up the "Port Road" through Columbia and across Shocks Mill Bridge, west through Enola, and returning to Harrisburg via the Rockville Bridge. This route was taken a few years ago but was plagued by fog. Here's another chance! Details are on the chapter's web site at http://nrhs-hbg.pennsyrr.com/Events/ ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: Prr1187@aol.com Date: Tue, 3 Aug 2004 22:47:44 EDT Subject: Re: [PRR] PRR E8s on the move east.Left Altoona @ 7:14pm X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Here was the consist in order headed westbound upon arrival at Dennison, Ohio: Engine 5711A Engine 5809A Pointe St. Charles Puget Sound Domed car Sierra Hotel Domed car Caritas Cimarron River Mount Vernon Dover Harbor Warrior Ridge PRR 120 It is my understanding that Pointe St. Charles went from Chicago to Pittsburgh to join the Buckeye Limited at Pittsburgh and was to separate at Pittsburgh on the return and join the Capital Limited back to Chicago. Regards, Dennis Sautters Canton, OH ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 09:18:33 -0400 Subject: [PRR] "Trackside on the PRR in Central Pennsylvania" From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Morning Sun's new book -- "Trackside on the PRR in Central Pennsylvania" -- has shipped. I received mine last evening. I only had time to give it a quick "go through", but I'll toss out these comments: * The MSB ad, despite the title, led you to believe it was more around Horseshoe Curve. Not so. A few pages east of Harrisburg, quite a few of Harrisburg, many up the Buffalo main line, and a lesser quantity out the main line. * Though some photos are out of focus, they are appreciated due to the new/unique content. Many show the structural content of the railroad, rather than just the loco at the head of a train. * Bonus for me... many photos of Harrisburg that I hadn't seen before, including some from October 1954, just one month off from my modeling date! ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Bill Volkmer" Subject: RE: [PRR] "Trackside on the PRR in Central Pennsylvania" Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 10:04:18 -0400 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <3501579F8815D511AEC6009027CCB5D35E3EE5@HERZOGMGMT> Return-Path: bvolkmer@herzogcompanies.com X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Aug 2004 13:51:02.0519 (UTC) FILETIME=[148C9870:01C47A2A] Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com This is a personal note to Dan Cupper because his a.o.l e-mails from me always "bounce". Dan was requesting information (from me) as to what year the Enola Roundhouse was torn down. My message to Dan is that the photo on page 23 of the subject book shows that by 1968 when the photo was taken, the structure had been razed. Hope this helps. Bill Volkmer -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Jerry Britton Sent: Wednesday, August 04, 2004 9:19 AM To: PRR-Talk LIST Subject: [PRR] "Trackside on the PRR in Central Pennsylvania" Morning Sun's new book -- "Trackside on the PRR in Central Pennsylvania" -- has shipped. I received mine last evening. I only had time to give it a quick "go through", but I'll toss out these comments: * The MSB ad, despite the title, led you to believe it was more around Horseshoe Curve. Not so. A few pages east of Harrisburg, quite a few of Harrisburg, many up the Buffalo main line, and a lesser quantity out the main line. * Though some photos are out of focus, they are appreciated due to the new/unique content. Many show the structural content of the railroad, rather than just the loco at the head of a train. * Bonus for me... many photos of Harrisburg that I hadn't seen before, including some from October 1954, just one month off from my modeling date! ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 10:02:28 -0400 Subject: Re: [PRR] "Trackside on the PRR in Central Pennsylvania" From: Jerry Britton X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Wednesday, August 4, 2004, at 10:04 AM, Bill Volkmer wrote: > Dan was requesting information (from me) as to what year the Enola > Roundhouse was torn down. > > My message to Dan is that the photo on page 23 of the subject book > shows > that by 1968 when the photo was taken, the structure had been razed. > Hope this helps. The turntable is still there, and I've seen it in operation, turning diesels! Is it the original bridge, or was it modernized at some point? ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 13:59:15 -0400 Subject: [PRR] TANGENT - John Armstrong Memorial Service From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com If anyone is interested... John Armstrong's Memorial service will be at 3PM on Sunday, August 15th, at Northwood Presbyterian Church in Silver Spring MD. (1200 University Blvd West, at the intersection of University and Arcola.) -- From the LDSIG list. I have seen many PRR layouts based on his plans. ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Ted Andrews" Subject: RE: [PRR] TANGENT - John Armstrong Memorial Service Date: Wed, 04 Aug 2004 18:28:19 +0000 Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2004 16:50:45 -0400 (Eastern Standard Time) From: "sjlash" Subject: [PRR] John Armstrong X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hi Guys, I probably missed some "posts" on my end after yesterday aftern= oon's weather. Would you be kind enough to furnish the details again abou= t John Armstrong. = Thanks Jim ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Bob Zoeller" Subject: [PRR] RSD15 (AS24m) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 07:44:35 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I note Broadway Limited has announced these. What are the major = spotting differences (besides, I surmise, a steam generator) between = these and the RSD7 (APS24ms)? Bob Zoeller ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Bill Volkmer" Subject: RE: [PRR] RSD15 (AS24m) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 09:20:16 -0400 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <3501579F8815D511AEC6009027CCB5D35E40C0@HERZOGMGMT> Return-Path: bvolkmer@herzogcompanies.com X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Aug 2004 13:06:57.0302 (UTC) FILETIME=[164A4360:01C47AED] Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Externally the RSD-15 did not have the water tank ahead of the fuel tank. Bubt the big difference was INTERNAL. The RSD-7 (APS-24ms) had an (old style) Alco 244-H engine which was a 16 cylinder version of the RS3 or, if you will, a modernized PA-2 engine. The RSD-15 had an Alco 16 cylinder 251 model, which was a stretched RS-11 12-cylinder model. As far as I know, only the C&O and Santa Fe had the 244 models other than the Pennsy. Bill Volkmerm -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Bob Zoeller Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 8:45 AM To: PRR-talk@dsop.com Subject: [PRR] RSD15 (AS24m) I note Broadway Limited has announced these. What are the major spotting differences (besides, I surmise, a steam generator) between these and the RSD7 (APS24ms)? Bob Zoeller ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 06:42:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Bill Daniels Subject: [PRR] Re: Fwd: FW: NEW PRODUCTS: ALCO RSD15 & PRR K4s Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 06:42:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Bill Daniels Subject: [PRR] Re: Fwd: FW: NEW PRODUCTS: ALCO RSD15 & PRR K4s From: "Gatwood, Elden -- Tt, Inc." Subject: RE: [PRR] RSD15 (AS24m) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 07:40:10 -0700 From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Bill Volkmer Subject: RE: [PRR] RSD15 (AS24m) From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Bob Subject: [PRR] RSD15 (AS24m) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 10:35:30 -0400 Subject: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Since complete details were not posted, here is a PSA... Broadway Limited Imports, LLC is proud to announce its newest series of=20= products, "Paragon Series Platinum". PSP products are constructed out=20 of diecast metal for greater weight & heft and are detailed even more=20 immaculately than the original Paragon Series=99 products. All products=20= bearing the PSP seal are designed and built with one concept in=20 mind=97"To be, without question, the highest quality model railroading=20= product money can buy." Broadway Limited Imports is confident that the=20= PSP line of products will define the top-tier of model railroading. The first release in the Paragon Series Platinum line is the much=20 requested PRR K4s. The K-4s=92 were the most outstandingly successful = and=20 recognized class of locomotives on the Pennsylvania Railroad. 425 units=20= were built from 1914 to 1928 and were numbered in random order (a=20 Pennsy practice) from #8 to #8378. Serving through both World Wars and beyond, even the modern Duplexes=20 did not replace them as the mainline steam passenger engines. Our K-4s models are being made of die-cast construction with many, many=20= added-on details to rival in appearance models costing 3 times the=20 price. We also supply a spare driver pair with traction tires for those=20= who operate their trains on steep grades. We are expecting a very limited quantity of our HO PRR K-4s models by=20 October of 2004, and of course, they will be fully decorated and=20 feature our Quantum=99 sound and control system! stk# Item Description 321 PRR K-4s #646 w/slatted pilot, headlight on smokebox front, short=20 lettering, HO 322 PRR K-4s #1453 w/slatted pilot, headlight on smokebox front, short=20= lettering, HO 323 PRR K-4s w/slatted pilot, headlight on smokebox front, unlettered,=20= HO 324 PRR K-4s #5451 w/slatted pilot, generator on smokebox front, HO 325 PRR K-4s #7279 w/slatted pilot, generator on smokebox front, HO 326 PRR K-4s w/slatted pilot, generator on smokebox front, unlettered,=20= HO 327 PRR K-4s #5418 w/cast pilot, generator on smokebox front, HO 328 PRR K-4s #1361 w/cast pilot, generator on smokebox front, HO 329 PRR K-4s w/cast pilot, generator on smokebox front, unlettered, HO MSRP - $450 Expected: October 2004. Preordering=A0is highly recommended as quantities will be very limited. ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com= ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 11:03:02 -0400 Subject: [PRR] Bennett's E8's on Trains Site! From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: <8C3225AC-E6F0-11D8-A168-000393835C88@pennsyrr.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com The "Photo of the Day" on the Trains web site features the excursion train led by Bennett's E8's returning from Dennison, Ohio, on August 2nd... http://www.trains.com/photogallery/ gallery_large.asp?idObjectLibraryGUID=%7BDB3B8E93-BA09-4148-8231- 520FAD411FC1%7D ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: ndbprr@att.net Subject: [PRR] O Winston Link Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2004 15:51:57 +0000 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Nice article on the back page of The Wall Street Journal today regarding the opening of the O. Winston Link museum in Roanoke. Article includes the drive in movie shot with the Y passing in the background. Whoever reviewed his work is admitidly not a railfan but he gushes pretty good about the photography. PRR connection - the railroad station which houses the museum was designed by Raymond Loewy in the forties according to the article and one of my favorite pictures Link shot is of the four side by side GG1 noses from a low angle in Pennsy Power. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 13:17:10 -0400 Subject: [PRR] BLI K4s Road Numbers and 1954 Assignments From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: <491838A4-E703-11D8-A168-000393835C88@pennsyrr.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I checked the road numbers BLI has selected for their K4s offerings and looked them up in the MP229 from March of 1954. They were assigned as follows: #646 Middle Division #1361 New York Division (later moved to Horseshoe Curve; now being restored) #1453 New York Division #5418 Pittsburgh Division #5451 Eastern Division #7279 Atlantic Division Of course, the 1954 assignments have no bearing on the era that BLI is presenting the road number as. Four of the six road numbers will have the slatted pilots and two the cast pilots. ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: Subject: [PRR] RSD_15 alco Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 17:28:36 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com the big alco RSD-15 looks like it will finally be built. YAY !! the = question now is how will they handle the fuel/ water tank arrangement = under the frame. the p.r.r. version had only one ( fuel ) tank under the frame, if i = remember correctly. my guess is that b.l.i. will want to make the = two tank version so that there will be room for the speaker.......then again maybe a smaller = unit could be shoehorned into the single tank. any thoughts on this = ??? ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 07:52:08 -0400 From: Don Murphy Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at out001.verizon.net from [4.41.106.228] at Fri, 6 Aug 2004 06:52:10 -0500 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I own several BLI engines and think they're great but the $450.00 price tag on the K4 makes me think of what a great deal my PFM and Red Ball K4s are! Don Murphy Jerry Britton wrote: > Since complete details were not posted, here is a PSA... > > Broadway Limited Imports, LLC is proud to announce its newest series > of products, "Paragon Series Platinum". PSP products are constructed > out of diecast metal for greater weight & heft and are detailed even > more immaculately than the original Paragon Series™ products. All > products bearing the PSP seal are designed and built with one concept > in mind—"To be, without question, the highest quality model > railroading product money can buy." Broadway Limited Imports is > confident that the PSP line of products will define the top-tier of > model railroading. > > The first release in the Paragon Series Platinum line is the much > requested PRR K4s. The K-4s’ were the most outstandingly successful > and recognized class of locomotives on the Pennsylvania Railroad. 425 > units were built from 1914 to 1928 and were numbered in random order > (a Pennsy practice) from #8 to #8378. > > Serving through both World Wars and beyond, even the modern Duplexes > did not replace them as the mainline steam passenger engines. > > Our K-4s models are being made of die-cast construction with many, > many added-on details to rival in appearance models costing 3 times > the price. We also supply a spare driver pair with traction tires for > those who operate their trains on steep grades. > > We are expecting a very limited quantity of our HO PRR K-4s models by > October of 2004, and of course, they will be fully decorated and > feature our Quantum™ sound and control system! > > stk# Item Description > > 321 PRR K-4s #646 w/slatted pilot, headlight on smokebox front, short > lettering, HO > > 322 PRR K-4s #1453 w/slatted pilot, headlight on smokebox front, short > lettering, HO > > 323 PRR K-4s w/slatted pilot, headlight on smokebox front, unlettered, HO > > 324 PRR K-4s #5451 w/slatted pilot, generator on smokebox front, HO > > 325 PRR K-4s #7279 w/slatted pilot, generator on smokebox front, HO > > 326 PRR K-4s w/slatted pilot, generator on smokebox front, unlettered, HO > > 327 PRR K-4s #5418 w/cast pilot, generator on smokebox front, HO > > 328 PRR K-4s #1361 w/cast pilot, generator on smokebox front, HO > > 329 PRR K-4s w/cast pilot, generator on smokebox front, unlettered, HO > > MSRP - $450 > > Expected: October 2004. > > Preordering is highly recommended as quantities will be very limited. > ----------------------------------------------------------- > Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS > Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. > "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! > http://kc.pennsyrr.com > "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... > http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Bob Zoeller" Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 07:52:56 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Don Murphy" > I own several BLI engines and think they're great but the $450.00 price > tag on the K4 makes me think of what a great deal my PFM and Red Ball > K4s are! The decision to make these "platinum" models at a price 58% higher than the M1b has put me off as well, to the extent I have ordered one instead of the two I had orignally considered. To have to jump $400 (list) over my Bowser or Bachmann to update 50 year old tooling or get a more appropriate tender or pulling power in one loco seems a bit much. This marketing move (further upscale) by BLI has helped me make another decision, though. I had been trying to decide what loco to move my Soundtraxx decoder to from my Bowser M1, now that I have the BLI version. Originally I had hesitated moving it to my I1 as BLI is coming out with one. Since the PFM United I1 runs so flawlessly, now I know. I can only shudder to think what a "platinum" I1 will cost. To those who say the BLI loco is a value, I don't disagree. However, I wonder how closely the two markets, the super-detailed brass collector and the operators, will come together to meet BLI's expectations. I have already cut my purchase in half, being an operator. As previously stated, I don't need superdetail which will get knocked off in operation; I just want an in-scale loco with "satisfactory" detail, appropriate tender, correct driver diameter, and the power to pull more than its own tender. Actually, I originally wanted two of them :-). And by the way, the emphasis on the "limited run" aspect of this offering makes this smell like the collector brass market all over again. Bob Zoeller ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 09:10:14 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-reply-to: <002301c47bb4$4c2f1420$6401a8c0@userrtilb5vp8t> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcR7tGHlwZhlq3D3QjysxC150MxCtwAAcSpA Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Perhaps BLI would consider a marketing experiment. Release two version of the I1, one a Paragon Platinum, and one a lesser detailed Powerhouse series. They could see which version produces the most total profit for BLI. regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Bob Zoeller Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 8:53 AM To: PRR-talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement ----- Original Message ----- From: "Don Murphy" > I own several BLI engines and think they're great but the $450.00 price > tag on the K4 makes me think of what a great deal my PFM and Red Ball > K4s are! The decision to make these "platinum" models at a price 58% higher than the M1b has put me off as well, to the extent I have ordered one instead of the two I had orignally considered. To have to jump $400 (list) over my Bowser or Bachmann to update 50 year old tooling or get a more appropriate tender or pulling power in one loco seems a bit much. This marketing move (further upscale) by BLI has helped me make another decision, though. I had been trying to decide what loco to move my Soundtraxx decoder to from my Bowser M1, now that I have the BLI version. Originally I had hesitated moving it to my I1 as BLI is coming out with one. Since the PFM United I1 runs so flawlessly, now I know. I can only shudder to think what a "platinum" I1 will cost. To those who say the BLI loco is a value, I don't disagree. However, I wonder how closely the two markets, the super-detailed brass collector and the operators, will come together to meet BLI's expectations. I have already cut my purchase in half, being an operator. As previously stated, I don't need superdetail which will get knocked off in operation; I just want an in-scale loco with "satisfactory" detail, appropriate tender, correct driver diameter, and the power to pull more than its own tender. Actually, I originally wanted two of them :-). And by the way, the emphasis on the "limited run" aspect of this offering makes this smell like the collector brass market all over again. Bob Zoeller ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Sam Vastano" Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 09:40:48 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Aug 2004 13:39:15.0949 (UTC) FILETIME=[C43A11D0:01C47BBA] Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Maybe this is the marketing experiment? To see how deep people's pockets are? I can't wait for someone else to come out with a decoder/sound that could be retrofitted to brass etc. that will work DCC or DC and see how far BLI's price will drop! Just my 2 cents SamV ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Miller" To: "'Bob Zoeller'" ; Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 9:10 AM Subject: RE: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement > Perhaps BLI would consider a marketing experiment. Release two version of > the I1, one a Paragon Platinum, and one a lesser detailed Powerhouse series. > They could see which version produces the most total profit for BLI. > > regards, > > Andy Miller > -----Original Message----- > From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Bob Zoeller > Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 8:53 AM > To: PRR-talk@dsop.com > Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Don Murphy" > > > > I own several BLI engines and think they're great but the $450.00 price > > tag on the K4 makes me think of what a great deal my PFM and Red Ball > > K4s are! > > The decision to make these "platinum" models at a price 58% higher than the > M1b has put me off as well, to the extent I have ordered one instead of the > two I had orignally considered. To have to jump $400 (list) over my Bowser > or Bachmann to update 50 year old tooling or get a more appropriate tender > or pulling power in one loco seems a bit much. > > This marketing move (further upscale) by BLI has helped me make another > decision, though. I had been trying to decide what loco to move my > Soundtraxx decoder to from my Bowser M1, now that I have the BLI version. > Originally I had hesitated moving it to my I1 as BLI is coming out with one. > Since the PFM United I1 runs so flawlessly, now I know. I can only shudder > to think what a "platinum" I1 will cost. > > To those who say the BLI loco is a value, I don't disagree. However, I > wonder how closely the two markets, the super-detailed brass collector and > the operators, will come together to meet BLI's expectations. I have > already cut my purchase in half, being an operator. As previously stated, I > don't need superdetail which will get knocked off in operation; I just want > an in-scale loco with "satisfactory" detail, appropriate tender, correct > driver diameter, and the power to pull more than its own tender. Actually, I > originally wanted two of them :-). > > And by the way, the emphasis on the "limited run" aspect of this offering > makes this smell like the collector brass market all over again. > > Bob Zoeller > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Ted Andrews" Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 13:44:31 +0000 From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 10:11:35 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-reply-to: X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcR7vDgwvNvr2+A1TmSHXLkFDeZaCAAApJFg Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Sound and DCC decoders mean nothing to collectors. Many of them never open the box. Certainly they NEVER do anything as foolish putting couplers on their engines! So BLI must still see the model RRers as their primary market. How they imagine that model Rrers will flock to $500 locos is beyond me. They good news is that perhaps the traction tired optional driver will be available separately and that with some work it can be fitted to Bachman K4s to help them pull. regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Ted Andrews Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 9:45 AM To: bobspf@wi.rr.com; PRR-talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Bob Zoeller wrote: "I have already cut my purchase in half, being an operator. As previously stated, I don't need superdetail which will get knocked off in operation; I just want an in-scale loco with "satisfactory" detail, appropriate tender, correct driver diameter, and the power to pull more than its own tender. Actually, I originally wanted two of them :-)." "And by the way, the emphasis on the "limited run" aspect of this offering makes this smell like the collector brass market all over again." I quite agree. The price is making me reconsider my purchases as well. I was thinking of two and may go down to one as well. The retail price is $450 but the price that you will see it for sale will be in the high $300's....still a salty price. I think that BLI must remember that their market is for modelers who, for the most part, want to run the engines on layouts and are interested in performance. Pricey, highly detailed, limited edition engines are more geared towards collectors who rarely run their engines. Ted Andrews ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 08:03:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Bill Daniels Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 11:20:28 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-reply-to: <20040806150322.96671.qmail@web52605.mail.yahoo.com> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcR7x1UeirBP/O0GSRC9n/cV6ngUzQAAM8ZA Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I bought my PFM K4 for list price $49.95 ! I have bought used Bowser K4s for $25, and rebuilt them. Any of these locos can handle a 17 car train over the long 2% grades at my club. With the traction tire, I am sure the BLI K4 will do as well. But neither the T1 or the M1 can match that. It sure would be nice if BLI or an after market maker(Greenway?) Would offer drivers with traction tires for the older BLI locos. The only problem which must be considered is whether the increase in tractive effort would raise the current draw of the motor above the limit of the QSI receiver. regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Bill Daniels Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 11:03 AM To: PRR-talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Bob, List and all... I'm not going to defend BLI's pricing on these but I would like to point out a couple of things... First of all, the street price is shaping up to be $350.00 for these, only slightly less than $30.00 over the T1's and J1's. Secondly, I seem to remember some people on this list complaining about the level of cast-on detail on BLI's previous offerings. Now BLI seems to be responding to these complaints by offering a higher level of detail...(and on the premier passenger locomotive of the PRR to boot... wonder how much ruckus would have been raised if BLI had offered this as a NYC J3 instead?) Note to Bob Z...Where oh where are you buying Bowser K4s's at 50 bucks? I remember paying that much for one back in the late 60's. Today the delux kit (which is the only one to get, since it has most of the proper detail supplied) lists for $239.95...then you have to buy a new motor (Helix Humper/Alco/Realistic Lighting/whoever is selling these now), additional details (to supplement what Bowser dosen't offer), DCC controler/sound card, and THEN you either get to build it or have to build it (depending on your prespective), paint it and letter it, and deal with the pie-tin sized rivet detail. Don't get me wrong...I like my Bowser kits. But I most likely won't be getting another one (well...unless BLI does a straight M1 or B6sb) It just ain't worth it. As for brass...just fuggetabout it. 30 to 40 year old brass models (even the PFM models) are very obsolete by todays standards. Many are in serious need of through rebuilding. They remind me of my 72 MGB...spend 3 or 4 grand on an complete engine build, drive it for maybe 50k miles and do it all over again...with NO air, power assisted steering (somebody's getting spoiled), leaks like a sieve (hell, the Brit's drive the things in the rain with the top DOWN!) poor acceleration and handling. And the faithful just go on and on about "charachter". But they are "good enough" for many of us...(I don't drive mine anymore...bought a used Miata last year and don't regret it ONE BIT.) And I just got an update on a street price (literally just came in as I was writing this) of $330.00...(the RSD15's are also down as well). As for "limited run"...face it, that's a fact of life in today's imported market. I don't like it anymore than you do, but when you import "runs" (to use an old brass importer term)(funny thing...nobody whined about brass being limited run) that's the way it is. Nobody in today's market can afford to sit on inventory for any length of time. I remember when a local hobby shop got a desirable model in we would all want it...and when it sold (six months to a year later) whine that "I wanted that"... looking back to those days I can now understand why that shop (like so many these days) is no longer with us. I'm looking forward to my K4s...I need power for my pre-war Broadway. Who knows, maybe BLI will do the streamlined versions. Looks to me that there is just no pleasing some guys... Bill Daniels __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 50x more storage than other providers! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 08:33:48 -0700 (PDT) From: Bill Daniels Subject: RE: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement > From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] > Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement From: "Bob Zoeller" Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 11:27:32 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Miller" > > They good news is that perhaps the traction tired optional driver will be > available separately and that with some work it can be fitted to Bachman K4s > to help them pull. Unfortunately, the Bachmann K4s driver is undersized, which is what makes it look odd. I hope that a $300 plus loco will have the correct diameter drivers :-). Bob Zoeller ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Bob Zoeller" Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 11:50:38 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Daniels" > Secondly, I seem to remember some people on this list > complaining about the level of cast-on detail on BLI's > previous offerings. Not I > > Note to Bob Z...Where oh where are you buying Bowser > K4s's at 50 bucks? Of course you are right, Bill. They are no bargain today. I am talking about reviving the one in my storage locker :-). > As for brass...just fuggetabout it. 30 to 40 year old > brass models (even the PFM models) are very obsolete > by todays standards. Many are in serious need of > through rebuilding. If you have any PFM United K4s pre beauty treatment around, let me know. I am assuming they on a par with the I1. A simple remotoring for DCC and you are set. My I1 easily runs on a par with the best Atlas and Stewart diesels. I don't have any recent Key steamers around (and neither do my fellow club members ) to compare it to :-). I agree, though, that old brass is hit or miss. I had excellent luck on Gem J1 (which I am now selling) , G5, and H10, even a Red Ball B6s, but my Gem E6s had a lot of brittle solder joints . Still, nice loco with a little bit of resoldering. On the list to remotor for DCC. Bob Zoeller ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Bob Zoeller" Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 11:59:41 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Miller" It > sure would be nice if BLI or an after market maker(Greenway?) Would offer > drivers with traction tires for the older BLI locos. The only problem which > must be considered is whether the increase in tractive effort would raise > the current draw of the motor above the limit of the QSI receiver. Want a totally unproven answer?:-) When I asked, BLI at least verbally suggested the article on adding about 9 ounces or so of lead to the M1b to me. I couldn't find a space for more than 4 ounces (which helps considerably by the way) but I would assume if you can add 9 ounces of lead and not fry the receiver, a traction tire shouldn't harm it either. Another unproven assumption I would make (while I am winging it): maybe the receiver in the T1 and M1b has same limits as J1. I'll ask the question on the QSI list. Bob Zoeller ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: [PRR] Motor insulation for DCC (was:BLI K4s Announcement) Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 13:08:54 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-reply-to: <002b01c47bd5$80cf8270$6401a8c0@userrtilb5vp8t> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcR71pI+9GS/ef5jSKeu+T4qOtr+TgAAN0fA Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com The only motor requirement for DCC is that both brushes be insulated from the frame. On most older locos, one brush was grounded to the motor chassis. Its usually easy to correct that. Sometimes it means nothing more than slipping a piece of tubing over the brush spring. There may be other reasons to change to a can motor, like better tractive force, lower current draw, or smoother operation. But I wouldn't spend $30 -40 just to insulate a brush. regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Bob Zoeller Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 12:51 PM To: PRR-talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Daniels" > Secondly, I seem to remember some people on this list complaining > about the level of cast-on detail on BLI's previous offerings. Not I > > Note to Bob Z...Where oh where are you buying Bowser K4s's at 50 > bucks? Of course you are right, Bill. They are no bargain today. I am talking about reviving the one in my storage locker :-). > As for brass...just fuggetabout it. 30 to 40 year old brass models > (even the PFM models) are very obsolete by todays standards. Many are > in serious need of through rebuilding. If you have any PFM United K4s pre beauty treatment around, let me know. I am assuming they on a par with the I1. A simple remotoring for DCC and you are set. My I1 easily runs on a par with the best Atlas and Stewart diesels. I don't have any recent Key steamers around (and neither do my fellow club members ) to compare it to :-). I agree, though, that old brass is hit or miss. I had excellent luck on Gem J1 (which I am now selling) , G5, and H10, even a Red Ball B6s, but my Gem E6s had a lot of brittle solder joints . Still, nice loco with a little bit of resoldering. On the list to remotor for DCC. Bob Zoeller ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 13:10:54 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-reply-to: <003601c47bd6$c4448860$6401a8c0@userrtilb5vp8t> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcR718jIq2EyTphXQIGHrJSiFXbuIQAAHAFg Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Bob, Where did you put the weight on the M1? The only space I found (and filled with Pb) was behind the motor. regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Bob Zoeller Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 1:00 PM To: PRR-talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Miller" It > sure would be nice if BLI or an after market maker(Greenway?) Would > offer drivers with traction tires for the older BLI locos. The only > problem which > must be considered is whether the increase in tractive effort would > raise the current draw of the motor above the limit of the QSI receiver. Want a totally unproven answer?:-) When I asked, BLI at least verbally suggested the article on adding about 9 ounces or so of lead to the M1b to me. I couldn't find a space for more than 4 ounces (which helps considerably by the way) but I would assume if you can add 9 ounces of lead and not fry the receiver, a traction tire shouldn't harm it either. Another unproven assumption I would make (while I am winging it): maybe the receiver in the T1 and M1b has same limits as J1. I'll ask the question on the QSI list. Bob Zoeller ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: [PRR] PRR Steam loco headlights Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 13:50:48 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com As I work to convert my many locos to DCC I have at least one problem I have not yet resolved. All of my steam engines have been equipped with diode drop constant voltage headlights. These won't work on both DC and DCC. One of the few solutions which will work is to replace them with white LEDS. But putting LEDs in the PRR modern headlights seems almost impossible. How does one fit the square backs of the LEDs with exposed rigid leads into the headlight casting and keep everything insulted from the body? Has anyone succeeded in this? Modelers of other roads don't have this problem for two reasons: first most headlight housings are drum shaped with a flat back, as were the older PR headlights; and second most RRs mounted their headlights on the center of the smokebox, so the lead can just come straight back into the boiler with minimum exposure. regards, Andy Miller ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: [PRR] PRR Steam loco headlights Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 13:50:48 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com As I work to convert my many locos to DCC I have at least one problem I have not yet resolved. All of my steam engines have been equipped with diode drop constant voltage headlights. These won't work on both DC and DCC. One of the few solutions which will work is to replace them with white LEDS. But putting LEDs in the PRR modern headlights seems almost impossible. How does one fit the square backs of the LEDs with exposed rigid leads into the headlight casting and keep everything insulted from the body? Has anyone succeeded in this? Modelers of other roads don't have this problem for two reasons: first most headlight housings are drum shaped with a flat back, as were the older PR headlights; and second most RRs mounted their headlights on the center of the smokebox, so the lead can just come straight back into the boiler with minimum exposure. regards, Andy Miller ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Bob Zoeller" Subject: Re: [PRR] Motor insulation for DCC (was:BLI K4s Announcement) Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 13:01:14 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com My J weighs 3 pounds and when it stalled the first time, it had a smoke unit where the decoder was. I replaced that open frame motor with a low-speed high-torque NWSL for nearly $30. Top speed about 65mph. Ditto for my I1. My E6 and a couple others in line will get a $4 can motor. Seems to have good performance on the bench (I got 10 for $40 including shipping), but I'll see how it holds up in use. At $4 my investment risk is low :-). ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Miller" To: "'Bob Zoeller'" ; ; Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 12:08 PM Subject: [PRR] Motor insulation for DCC (was:BLI K4s Announcement) > There may be other reasons to change to a can motor, like better tractive > force, lower current draw, or smoother operation. But I wouldn't spend $30 > -40 just to insulate a brush. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Dominic Mazoch" Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 18:58:45 GMT Subject: [PRR] Models Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 14:55:05 -0500 Subject: [PRR] Re: BLI K-4s Annoucement From: John Sheets Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 14:55:05 -0500 Subject: [PRR] Re: BLI K-4s Annoucement From: John Sheets Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 16:11:52 -0400 From: TGREGMRTN@aol.com Subject: RE: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Andy writes... ==============================================================Sound and DCC decoders mean nothing to collectors. Many of them never open the box. Certainly they NEVER do anything as foolish putting couplers on their engines! So BLI must still see the model RRers as their primary market. How they imagine that model Rrers will flock to $500 locos is beyond me. The good news is that perhaps the traction tired optional driver will be available separately and that with some work it can be fitted to Bachman K4s to help them pull. regards, Andy Miller ============================================================== Gize, I am cross posting this to PRR-Modeling as well as these folks need to be informred as well. I sent the announcement to AL so he could do the honors of posting the announcement and it will be in TKM as well. I have know for several days now that the DL600b's and the K4's were coming. The folks I buy my BLI from have announced the K4's at $330.00 and the DL600b's at $197.50 (PRR). Tis makes them a lot more affordable and attractive. You might see them a bit lower we shall see. BLI has obviously taken the market by surprise with the announcement and there are those that will banter the products, I call them non-believers. BLI can caputure much more of the market if their prototype research is enhanced and theuir attenton to detail is more closely monitored than with in the past. I think all you need do is look at what Life Like did with the RS-11 in the Proto 1000 series hitting new heights with the extreme attention to detail. We will pay for detail like door latches, see through steps, cut levers and all that we have come to expect first from the brass importers and then from the plastic manufacturers. WE deserve it! The attention to detail justifies the price, and we can only hope they are watchng as we vote with our dollars in this hobby. Andy you are correct sir... Greg Martin ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 16:37:58 -0400 From: Don Murphy Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at out007.verizon.net from [4.41.106.228] at Fri, 6 Aug 2004 15:38:00 -0500 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hearing the street price of 330.00 is OK. Maybe I'll get one. I was planning on three and putting the brass into semi-retirement. Adding a Soundtrax decoder to a $200.00 RedBall or a $250.00 PFM K4 is sounding really good right now. They don't have cast on details and I know I can fix them no matter what happens. I've been cruising Ebay this morning and the depressed price of brass looks so good to me as a buyer compared to the list price on the BLI K4. I won a Sakara(?) PFM B&O 0-4-0 for $80.00 the other day. A deal indeed. Old Varney 0-4-0's with Central Valley valve gear go at times for almost as much. Don Murphy The Docter of Steam Bill Daniels wrote: >Bob, List and all... > >I'm not going to defend BLI's pricing on these but I >would like to point out a couple of things... > >First of all, the street price is shaping up to be >$350.00 for these, only slightly less than $30.00 over >the T1's and J1's. > >Secondly, I seem to remember some people on this list >complaining about the level of cast-on detail on BLI's >previous offerings. Now BLI seems to be responding to >these complaints by offering a higher level of >detail...(and on the premier passenger locomotive of >the PRR to boot... wonder how much ruckus would have >been raised if BLI had offered this as a NYC J3 >instead?) > >Note to Bob Z...Where oh where are you buying Bowser >K4s's at 50 bucks? I remember paying that much for one >back in the late 60's. Today the delux kit (which is >the only one to get, since it has most of the proper >detail supplied) lists for $239.95...then you have to >buy a new motor (Helix Humper/Alco/Realistic >Lighting/whoever is selling these now), additional >details (to supplement what Bowser dosen't offer), DCC >controler/sound card, and THEN you either get to build >it or have to build it (depending on your >prespective), paint it and letter it, and deal with >the pie-tin sized rivet detail. > >Don't get me wrong...I like my Bowser kits. But I most >likely won't be getting another one (well...unless BLI >does a straight M1 or B6sb) It just ain't worth it. > >As for brass...just fuggetabout it. 30 to 40 year old >brass models (even the PFM models) are very obsolete >by todays standards. Many are in serious need of >through rebuilding. They remind me of my 72 >MGB...spend 3 or 4 grand on an complete engine build, >drive it for maybe 50k miles and do it all over >again...with NO air, power assisted steering >(somebody's getting spoiled), leaks like a sieve >(hell, the Brit's drive the things in the rain with >the top DOWN!) poor acceleration and handling. And the >faithful just go on and on about "charachter". But >they are "good enough" for many of us...(I don't drive >mine anymore...bought a used Miata last year and don't >regret it ONE BIT.) > >And I just got an update on a street price (literally >just came in as I was writing this) of $330.00...(the >RSD15's are also down as well). > >As for "limited run"...face it, that's a fact of life >in today's imported market. I don't like it anymore >than you do, but when you import "runs" (to use an old >brass importer term)(funny thing...nobody whined about >brass being limited run) that's the way it is. Nobody >in today's market can afford to sit on inventory for >any length of time. I remember when a local hobby shop >got a desirable model in we would all want it...and >when it sold (six months to a year later) whine that >"I wanted that"... looking back to those days I can >now understand why that shop (like so many these days) >is no longer with us. > >I'm looking forward to my K4s...I need power for my >pre-war Broadway. Who knows, maybe BLI will do the >streamlined versions. Looks to me that there is just >no pleasing some guys... > >Bill Daniels > > > > >__________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >Yahoo! Mail - 50x more storage than other providers! >http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail >----------------------------------------------------------------------- >For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 18:35:11 -0400 (GMT-04:00) From: ealauterbach@earthlink.net Subject: [PRR] BLI K7 Stock Car Pictures X-Mailer: Earthlink Zoo Mail 1.0 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com The Broadway Limited website now has pictures of the upcoming Pennsy based stock car on it. It looks pretty good from the pictures. Speaking of pictures, I wonder how long before pictures are up of the K4 that is coming out. Eric ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: Randy Williamson Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 22:25:16 -0500 Subject: [PRR-FAX] RSD-15s Assignments According to the January, 1958 Assignment sheets. 8611-8616 were assigned to the Philadelphia Region. January 1962 showed 8611 - New York Region, 8612 - Northern Region, 8613 - New York Region, 8614-8616 - Northern Region. By May, 1967, they had be renumbered in the 6811-6816 series and were assigned to Conway. Dayna & Randy Williamson http://prrfreight.trainstuffllc.com/ [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Make a clean sweep of pop-up ads. Yahoo! Companion Toolbar. Now with Pop-Up Blocker. Get it for free! http://us.click.yahoo.com/L5YrjA/eSIIAA/yQLSAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PRR/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: PRR-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 22:25:16 -0500 From: Randy Williamson Subject: [PRR] RSD-15s Assignments From: RDG2124@aol.com Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 23:47:12 EDT Subject: [PRR] P70 Coach Wheel Diameter X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com What size wheels were used on these coaches? 36" Dia.? Thank you, Evan Leisey RCT&HS 346 PRRT&HS 7487 PRRT&HS (Phila.) 2036 CNJ 2003 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: RDG2124@aol.com Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 23:47:12 EDT Subject: [PRR] P70 Coach Wheel Diameter X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com What size wheels were used on these coaches? 36" Dia.? Thank you, Evan Leisey RCT&HS 346 PRRT&HS 7487 PRRT&HS (Phila.) 2036 CNJ 2003 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: John Frantz Subject: [PRR] B6 Roster Date: Sat, 07 Aug 2004 09:10:17 -0400 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new .250 at suscom.net Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Listers, Is there an engine roster availible where I can find out=20 which B6 class engines didn't have a slop-back tender in=20 its career? I ask beacuse i'm about to acquire one for a=20 very good price that is DCC equipped.=20 Best Regards, John Designer, Modeler, Consultant Mount Vernon Shops Baltimore, MD Specializing in HO & N scale for the Pennsy modeler. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Sat, 7 Aug 2004 14:06:11 -0700 (PDT) From: Doug Kisala Subject: [PRR] Bethlehem/Intermountain B60b in the flesh Date: Sat, 7 Aug 2004 22:28:33 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K7 Stock Car Pictures From: smithbf@vetmed.auburn.edu X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com > The Broadway Limited website now has pictures of the upcoming Pennsy based > stock car on it. It looks pretty good from the pictures. Speaking of > pictures, I wonder how long before pictures are up of the K4 that is > coming out. > Eric Interesting... I got all paranoid reading the latest RMC review of the N&W H-2A. RMC says that the difference between the Paragon cars (H-2A) and the Powerhouse cars (eg. the K7A) is that the Powerhouse are supposed to have less detail, like molded on grabs... Fortunately, it appears that the K7A has seperate grabs, even if they do look a bit odd on the pre-production model. Issues I do see: 1) Klunky hangers on the top of the door 2) Oversize top and bottom door track 3) Paint color!!!!! Looks way too brown in the photos (could be lighting) Regards Bruce Smith Auburn, AL ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: RDG2124@aol.com Date: Sat, 7 Aug 2004 23:30:08 EDT Subject: [PRR] Bethlehem/Intermountain B60b in the flesh X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com As I have converted the majority of my cars to the Kadee 58 coupler, the pad the coupler box is mounted to was milled down 0.030" to allow for the 58's. Evan Leisey RCT&HS 346 PRRT&HS 7487 PRRT&HS (Phila.) 2036 CNJ 2003 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "STEPHEN HOXIE" Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement Date: Sat, 7 Aug 2004 23:31:22 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-ELNK-Trace: 65fbc22f705d6e9971639b933de7ae6f7e972de0d01da9405ef60c5887682e6584bbb4d587f9fea7350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 199.174.137.158 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hi Andy--You can put lead in the steam chest if you keep clearance for the "pistons" and attach it to the underside of the cab roof. Steve Hoxie Pensacola FL ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Miller" To: "'Bob Zoeller'" ; Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 12:10 PM Subject: RE: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement > Bob, > > Where did you put the weight on the M1? The only space I found (and filled > with Pb) was behind the motor. > > regards, > > Andy Miller > > -----Original Message----- > From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Bob Zoeller > Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 1:00 PM > To: PRR-talk@dsop.com > Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K4s Announcement > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Andy Miller" It > > sure would be nice if BLI or an after market maker(Greenway?) Would > > offer drivers with traction tires for the older BLI locos. The only > > problem > which > > must be considered is whether the increase in tractive effort would > > raise the current draw of the motor above the limit of the QSI receiver. > > Want a totally unproven answer?:-) When I asked, BLI at least verbally > suggested the article on adding about 9 ounces or so of lead to the M1b to > me. I couldn't find a space for more than 4 ounces (which helps > considerably by the way) but I would assume if you can add 9 ounces of lead > and not fry the receiver, a traction tire shouldn't harm it either. Another > unproven assumption I would make (while I am winging it): maybe the > receiver in the T1 and M1b has same limits as J1. I'll ask the question on > the QSI list. > > Bob Zoeller > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Bob Zoeller" Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K7 Stock Car Pictures Date: Sun, 8 Aug 2004 00:37:05 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Well, it appears to have the general proportions of a K7A, BUT... I agree with you, Bruce. It looks like it will stand up to the hamhands at our club, like the old Athearns which looked just as clunky. Re the color, say it isn't so! Another Pennsy model in the wrong color. Also a 50 year throwback. However, in fairness it does look closer to the later, darker freight car color (as used by Bowser) than Tuscan which all those PRR models of 50 years ago had. Apologies in advance for being a henny penny---I hate that in others :-). Bob Zoeller ----- Original Message ----- From: Fortunately, it appears that the K7A > has seperate grabs, even if they do look a bit odd on the pre-production > model. > > Issues I do see: > 1) Klunky hangers on the top of the door > 2) Oversize top and bottom door track > 3) Paint color!!!!! Looks way too brown in the photos (could be lighting) ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: John Frantz Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K7 Stock Car Pictures Date: Sun, 08 Aug 2004 08:46:55 -0400 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new .250 at suscom.net Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Gents, We can only hope that since the stockcars have been=20 designed to have sound, THEN they came without sound. So,=20 the shell should be easy to remove from the chassis. If=20 that's the case, a repaint/decal is in order! The only=20 thing that would be a slight annoyance is cutting the=20 strips for dim data, and making it straight. -John "Bob Zoeller" wrote: Re the color, say it isn't so! Another Pennsy model in=20 the wrong color. Also a 50 year throwback. However, in fairness it does=20 look closer to the later, darker freight car color (as used by Bowser) than=20 Tuscan which all those PRR models of 50 years ago had. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: RDG2124@aol.com Date: Sun, 8 Aug 2004 21:05:08 EDT Subject: [PRR] PRR] BLI K7 Stock Car Pictures X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Color the wrong shade? Try an old trick. Use liquid masking to cover the majority of the lettering then over spray with a light coat of the correct color. I have mixed the paint, Floquil and Scalecoat, about 50/50 with thinner then fog the model with an air brush. If that doesn't suit your fancy then you can strip and repaint. Evan Leisey RCT&HS 346 PRRT&HS 7487 PRRT&HS (Phila.) 2036 CNJ 2003 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Brian J Carlson" Subject: [PRR] air brake instruction car 492443 Date: Sun, 8 Aug 2004 23:41:04 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version 0.71, clamav-milter version 0.71 X-Virus-Status: Clean Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On the back cover and Page 120 of the PRR Color Guide to freight and Passenger Equipment Vol. 3 is air brake instruction car 492443. I have a few questions. Is this car a class P70, if so which subclass? The windows in the vestibule and different vestibule doors are throwing me off. The roof looks different also, doesn't have transverse clestory's (I don't know the correct term) near the ends. The picture was taken in 1952, does anyone know how long this car was used as an instruction car? Would instruction be given only at main shops, Enola, Norry, Renovo etc, or did the car travel to outlying terminals also. I assume it was attached to an appropriate passenger train heading to its next destination, however, later on some branches didn't have passenger series, Elmira, Rochester (NY), line to Wilkes Barre. Were there special handling instructions for hauling this car in freight trains? Well, I suppose that's more than a few questions. Thanks for any information. Brian J Carlson P.E. Cheektowaga NY ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] BLI K7 Stock Car Pictures Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 11:33:53 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-reply-to: <000901c47d09$bd893500$6401a8c0@userrtilb5vp8t> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcR9CjVDJ5quRTrSQYy/otFFdi2veQBG12Qw Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hopefully BLI will correct the color before production. But if they don't it appears that rather than repaint, the easiest solution is to buy the GN cars, remove the "Great Northern" letterboards and decal the "PENNSYVANIA" and the keystone on. The filled slats for the keystone appear to cast into the body (much to the chagrin of non-PRR buyers no doubt). regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Bob Zoeller Sent: Sunday, August 08, 2004 1:37 AM To: PRR-talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K7 Stock Car Pictures Well, it appears to have the general proportions of a K7A, BUT... I agree with you, Bruce. It looks like it will stand up to the hamhands at our club, like the old Athearns which looked just as clunky. Re the color, say it isn't so! Another Pennsy model in the wrong color. Also a 50 year throwback. However, in fairness it does look closer to the later, darker freight car color (as used by Bowser) than Tuscan which all those PRR models of 50 years ago had. Apologies in advance for being a henny penny---I hate that in others :-). Bob Zoeller ----- Original Message ----- From: Fortunately, it appears that the K7A > has seperate grabs, even if they do look a bit odd on the > pre-production model. > > Issues I do see: > 1) Klunky hangers on the top of the door > 2) Oversize top and bottom door track > 3) Paint color!!!!! Looks way too brown in the photos (could be > lighting) ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Cc: From: Bruce Smith Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI K7 Stock Car Pictures Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 11:11:09 -0500 To: "Andy Miller" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.618) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Aug 9, 2004, at 10:33 AM, Andy Miller wrote: > Hopefully BLI will correct the color before production. But if they > don't > it appears that rather than repaint, the easiest solution is to buy > the GN > cars, remove the "Great Northern" letterboards and decal the > "PENNSYVANIA" > and the keystone on. The filled slats for the keystone appear to cast > into > the body (much to the chagrin of non-PRR buyers no doubt). Another option is use an overspray. Looking at the Broadway web site pictures, I would use an overspray of Poly Scale (or Floquil) Zinc Chromate to get an oranger look on the PRR cars. This will also fade the lettering, giving a nice overall "faded" look to the car which is a good place to start weathering. Interestingly, a nice FCC on the RC X29, when weathered with some darker colors as oversprays (tarnished black, railroad tie brown, rail brown) actually looks pretty close to the Bowser "brown". Of course, the lettering etc is ALSO weathered and lends credibility to the color as a "shift" from the original color as opposed to the stock Bowser paint job, which looks wrong, because it is has fresh lettering on aged paint. An overspray of true FCC can salvage some Bowser paint jobs very nicely, but those that have the incorrect lettering just need to be stripped and repainted. It just would be nice to start with the right base color ... Regards Bruce Bruce F. Smith V.M.D., Ph.D. Scott-Ritchey Research Center 334-844-5587, 334-844-5850 (fax) http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/ "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin __ / \ __<+--+>________________\__/___ ________________________________ |- ______/ O O \_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ | | / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 \ | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__|| |/_____________________________\|_|________________________________| | O--O \0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: LeeRainey@aol.com Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 21:12:34 EDT Subject: [PRR] Historic EBT car returns to operation X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Historic Railroad Car Returns to Operation Friends of East Broad Top Complete Restoration Project The Friends of the East Broad Top, Inc. have completed the restoration of historic Caboose No. 28 of the East Broad Top Railroad & Coal Co. and the car will return to service on Saturday, August 14, 2004. Caboose No. 28 was built in 1920 for service on the East Broad Top Railroad, which operated a high-traffic, coal-hauling narrow-gauge main line from Mount Union to Woodvale in Huntingdon County, Pennsylvania. The car was originally assembled in the railroad's Rockhill Furnace shops. Eighty-four years later, the historic car was reconditioned in the same shops by volunteers from the Friends of the East Broad Top. The restoration, which involved almost 900 volunteer hours, began in December 2003 and included extensive metalwork and carpentry to prepare the car for regular operation while at the same time restoring it to its historic appearance. Before beginning the disassembly, the volunteers carefully documented the car with detailed measurements and hundreds of pictures, and then commissioned the creation of custom wood components matching the car's original specifications. "The East Broad Top is special both for its rich history and for the completeness and integrity of what survives to be seen today," said Dr. Lee Rainey, East Broad Top historian and leader of the volunteer caboose restoration project. "We are honored to have had the opportunity to work with the railroad and its owners, the Kovalchick family, to ensure that Caboose No. 28, an important part of Pennsylvania's industrial heritage, will be available for future generations to enjoy." Caboose No. 28 and other historic equipment dating to the 1880s can be viewed and ridden on the steam-powered, narrow-gauge tourist trains of the East Broad Top Railroad. The railroad operates on weekends from June through October. The car's return to service on August 14, 2004, coincides with the railroad's annual Community Appreciation Day. About the Organizations East Broad Top Railroad & Coal Co. Originally chartered in 1856, the East Broad Top began service as a three-foot-gauge common-carrier railroad in 1873. When it ended freight operations in1956, it was the last narrow-gauge railroad east of the Mississippi. Subsequently acquired by the Kovalchick Salvage Company of Indiana, PA, limited train operation resumed in 1960, and steam tourist service has continued in every year since that time. In addition to operating the oldest surviving piece of narrow-gauge trackage in the United States, the railroad's shop complex in Rockhill Furnace, PA, is widely recognized as one of the most significant historic industrial sites in North America. In 1964, the EBT became a U.S. National Historic Landmark. The railroad was named to Preservation Pennsylvania's "Pennsylvania at Risk" list in 1992 and the National Trust for Historic Preservation's list of most endangered historic sites in 1996. For additional information, visit www.ebtrr.com or contact: East Broad Top Railroad, P. O. Box 158, Rockhill Furnace PA 17249; (814) 447-3011 (telephone); (814) 447-3256 (fax). Friends of the East Broad Top, Inc. Friends of the East Broad Top was founded in 1983 to encourage historical research about and to support the preservation and restoration of the East Broad Top Railroad. Currently FEBT has approximately 900 members, who live throughout the US and in several foreign countries. FEBT operates a museum in Robertsdale, PA that has been open to the public since 1991. More information about the museum, FEBT's restoration program, membership, and events can be found at the organization's at www.febt.org. Friends of the East Broad Top, Inc. is not affiliated with the East Broad Top Railroad & Coal Co. For additional information, contact: Lee Rainey, (814) 235-8636. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Brian J Carlson" Subject: [PRR] B60b's and REA Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 21:51:26 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version 0.71, clamav-milter version 0.71 X-Virus-Status: Clean Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On 2-15-1954 the lettering "RAILWAY EXPRESS AGENCY" was crossed off and no longer applied R50b's. Did REA lettering come of B60b's at this same date? Brian J Carlson P.E. Cheektowaga NY ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Al Buchan" Subject: [PRR] For - Philadelphia Area Train Enthusiasts Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 08:52:50 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Thursday night Aug.19th, 2004 we are having Train Enthusiasts Night at The Morris Arboretum 6:00-8:00pm. This for all scales of trains. Do you think any of our members would like to display their models? We will provide tables, and if needed electric hook-up. For set-up you can arrive any time after 4:30 pm. Or if they just want to come and enjoy the evening with us that is just fine. Any question call Earl Snyder 215-848-1358. Train Enthusiasts Night at The Morris Arboretum Thursday, August 19, 2004 - 6:00-8:00pm. Come enjoy the 'G' scale trains with members of the Southeastern Pennsylvania Garden Railway Society and other train enthusiasts. We will also have Chelten Hills Model Railroad Club, Schuylkill Valley Model RR Club. We would like to make this a night when rail fans can learn about all facets of model railroading. A few of our artists friends will be present displaying their beautifully authentic railroad artwork. There will be various types of equipment demonstrations, including the installation of radio controls in the trains. The building of garden railways and ideas for creating their landscaping will also be available. This fun family event will be held rain or shine. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: ndbprr@att.net Subject: [PRR] BLI cars Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 21:45:00 +0000 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Don't know if this has beenn discussed earlier or not. From the Trains web page at Kalmbach: We just received word that Broadway Limited Imports will be producing HO scale models of General American 53'-6" wood express refrigerator cars with factory-installed grab irons and Kadee couplers in more than a dozen roadnames, and in multiple numbers. Look for complete details in tomorrow evening's News & Products update. Best wishes, Terry ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: ndbprr@att.net Subject: [PRR] BLI cars Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 21:45:00 +0000 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Don't know if this has beenn discussed earlier or not. From the Trains web page at Kalmbach: We just received word that Broadway Limited Imports will be producing HO scale models of General American 53'-6" wood express refrigerator cars with factory-installed grab irons and Kadee couplers in more than a dozen roadnames, and in multiple numbers. Look for complete details in tomorrow evening's News & Products update. Best wishes, Terry ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Subject: [PRR] HO and N B60b Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 18:07:34 -0400 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: PRR-Talk Digest - 08/10/04 Thread-Index: AcR+mJz9D+e4Lk45QgSUQ/CUQ++SawBVs0Ow From: "Drye, John" To: "PRR-Talk" Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com originally posted to PRR N Scale list: Had a chance to talk to Marty McGuirk of InterMountain at the N Scale = Convention in Chantilly this past weekend.=20 He had a sample of the HO B60b on display. Looked great.=20 I asked him if IM had considered doing it in N Scale. He said that they = hadn't planned on it, but had gotten so many questions at the show that = they were considering it. Marty asked if it was worth doing the correct = B60b truck N scale or should they do something "close enough" and = cheaper. I told him that Bowser seemed to do well with the correct PRR = trucks for both the H21s as well as the Cabin Cars. If you have an opinion, you can contact IM at: intermountain@intermountain-railway.com Not associated with IM in any way other than as a consumer (and B60b = customer) John Drye ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 20:03:07 -0400 From: Bert Decker Subject: [PRR] Circle Keystone Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com G'day all, Does anyone have a measured drawing of the circle keystone herald that was applied to PRR freight equipment that I could beg, borrow or (shudder) pay for? I want to make a full-size copy as wall decoration. TIA Bert ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: LeeRainey@aol.com Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 23:30:37 EDT Subject: [PRR] Caboose-a-thon 04 Thursday eve X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Thursday 9:56 pm: Just 36 hours to the scheduled debut of EBT Caboose No. 28. The 900-hour project that began back in December is rapidly coming to an end. A second coat of red glistens on the platforms, thanks to Frank and Dave. Henry is installing the last tacks on the new seamless roof while Frank works to mount the metal sheathing of the cupola. Lee has completed lettering the numbers and heralds. Bob has repainted the end ladders after Frank welded on the repair parts, and now is scrubbing 84 years of dirt out of the interior of the caboose. Tomorrow Bob will welcome an FEBT relief crew that will mount the last few hardware pieces and do a final touch-up on paint. The caboose will be ready on time! ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 21:48:07 -0400 From: TGREGMRTN@aol.com Subject: [PRR] Test Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Test ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: John Frantz Subject: [PRR] NEC Corridor Date: Sat, 14 Aug 2004 20:43:38 -0400 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new .250 at suscom.net Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Gents and All, I had to travel yesterday from Baltimore to Philadelphia=20 and i must say that it being the fist time i've riden this=20 stretch that I had a great time. Getting on at penn=20 Satation in baltimore i found a seat in the last car at=20 the seat closest to the rear of the train. As it so=20 happened the conductor was at this end punching tickets. I=20 politely asked if he would mind me standing at the rear=20 door to observe the passing ROW. He had no objections and=20 i rode most of the hour trip watching out the rear door.=20 Not quite the Observation lounge of the 120, but still an=20 experience.=20 I was suprised at the number of brick/wood construction=20 towers that are still standing. One thing that I was sad to see while riding SEPTA north=20 from 30th street was that the B60b and REA car that used=20 to sit at the rear of the power plant in penn Coach have=20 disappeared. Would anybody know what happened to them? A little kindness can still go a long way in cooperating=20 with AMTRAK employees. Regards, John ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: John Frantz Subject: [PRR] NEC Corridor Date: Sat, 14 Aug 2004 20:43:38 -0400 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new .250 at suscom.net Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Gents and All, I had to travel yesterday from Baltimore to Philadelphia=20 and i must say that it being the fist time i've riden this=20 stretch that I had a great time. Getting on at penn=20 Satation in baltimore i found a seat in the last car at=20 the seat closest to the rear of the train. As it so=20 happened the conductor was at this end punching tickets. I=20 politely asked if he would mind me standing at the rear=20 door to observe the passing ROW. He had no objections and=20 i rode most of the hour trip watching out the rear door.=20 Not quite the Observation lounge of the 120, but still an=20 experience.=20 I was suprised at the number of brick/wood construction=20 towers that are still standing. One thing that I was sad to see while riding SEPTA north=20 from 30th street was that the B60b and REA car that used=20 to sit at the rear of the power plant in penn Coach have=20 disappeared. Would anybody know what happened to them? A little kindness can still go a long way in cooperating=20 with AMTRAK employees. Regards, John ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Dominic Mazoch" Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 09:55:40 GMT Subject: [PRR] Scale Lionel "O" 3R GG-1 4876 From: Mvbb1000@aol.com Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 08:45:47 EDT Subject: [PRR] 1910 Accident in Indiana X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hello, I was wondering if someone could help me with the this> My wifes ggrandfather was killed by accident in a train accident in Indiana, between Dublin and Cambridge City. In an newspaper article that I have received from Indiana it states that he was asleep in the caboose when # 84 a Pennsylvania fast live stock freight train crashed into the caboose and sent it telescoping. In any event I was wondering if it would be possible to find a picture of this accident and or the train? Also if someone could look at this article (I can email it to you) and exp[lain this accident. The article talks about rear of second sections and others it sounds like there may be more then 1 engine involved. Thank you, Mike Maristch ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Bill Godby" Subject: [PRR] Steam engine bell markings Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 09:13:22 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hello everyone, A recent off list discussion has come up about the markings on steam = engine bells. I have in my possession a marked bell. (Non PRR) Did the = PRR and other lines mark their bells?? I thought I had heard at one time = that the PRR did mark some. I wouldn`t think that this would be to common of a practice to do.=20 Anyone have any ideas or know something about bell markings from the = different builders?? Lima, Alco, etc. etc..... We are looking for any kind of information at all. Thanks in advance, Bill Godby ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: mittner@webtv.net (Gary Mittner) Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 09:38:47 -0400 Subject: Re: [PRR] Steam engine bell markings MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Bill, The PRR marked their bells either J.N or A.M.S. or not at all. Many had the loco numbers stamped into them as well, many did not. I once seen a PRR Bell marked with 6 different loco numbers. The only other Bell I seen marked other than those with casting or loco numbers were the EMD diesel Bells which actually had EMD cast into them Those would be the 12" Bells. What size is yours? Photo?....Gary. Come visit my PRR Pages: Photos, Models, Historical Items and Art Work! PRR K4s Loco Pics: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/ PRR G5s, T1, J1 J1a, M1, M1a, N1s, etc. etc.: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/prr_loco_index.html and...... PRR Pics, P&LE Pics, PRR Memorabilia and Misc. Models: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/indexpics.html ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Ted Andrews" Subject: [PRR] SD-7 mystery photo Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 10:48:41 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com PRR Listers: In Pennsy Diesel Years, Vol. 3, on the bottom of page 119, there is a = rare photo of the roof of SD-7 8589. There are 2 items mounted on top of = the short roof. The one on the right is a vent for the water tank used = of the rail cleaning jets when the engine was working the steep Madison = Hill. The one on the left appears to be a radio antenna. I thought that = these engines were originally delivered with firecracker-type antennae = however this may not be true. The SD-7's were delivered in October 1953 = so I do not know if firecracker antennas existed then. The question is: = what is this item on the left-side of the roof? I looks like a = firecracker antenna but it has cord that is folded over and laying on = the roof. I am postulating the this may be a firecracker type antenna = but with an long receiver to compensate for the very hilly terrain = adjacent to Madison and the Ohio River Valley. There is along photo of this mystery antenna at the top of page 653 of = Pennsylvania Railroad Diesel Locomotive Pictorial, Vol. 8. TIA!! Ted Andrews Carmel, Indiana P.S.: What was the type of horn that was delivered to these units? Are = the horns provided in the P2K models accurate? Is there a HO scale horn = currently available that matches the PRR prototypes? ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: abendschein@comcast.net Subject: [PRR] Stockyards and Colored Lights Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 16:02:39 +0000 From: "William Bigler" Subject: Re: [PRR] Stockyards and Colored Lights Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 14:20:35 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I remember the Lancaster Stockyards from the Pennsy convention that was held there several years ago. It was near the hotel, and of course, the tracks. It was behind a very good steak house. Fortunately, the steakhouse was upwind while we enjoyed a very good dinner. One afternoon we went over to the stockyards to photograph the place. Being a weekend, it was pretty inactive. However, during the photo session, a tractor trailer pulled in with a load of calves who were having intestinal problems Whew! Even getting upwind didn't help! No idea how people could stand to work in those places. Interesting to find an active, alive, and well stockyard in daily operation here in the east. I guess I thought virtually all meat came from the Midwest, and was slaughtered and packed near where the cattle were raised. But coming to think about it, there are some farms that raise beef cattle in the east. All transportation seems to be by truck now, however. Bill Bigler - 4915 Big Flats NY Modeling PRR Renovo & Williamsport WWII > Just catching up on two threads from last month: > > Lancaster Stockyards: > At one time the PRR owned the stockyards at Lancaster. Reportedly they were the largest ones east of Chicago. They were quite extensive with quarantine pens on the south side of the PRR Main. A tunnel underneath the tracks allowed animals to reach the main part of the stockyards on the north side. Reportedly one reason why the stockyards were so important was that they opened earlier than Chicago and so could be a trend setter with respect to price. > > Home Signals - Colored Lights > To the best of my knowledge and experience "Cola" never had colored lights in its PRR home signals in PRR, Conrail, or NS periods. > > Fred > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 13:32:35 -0500 Subject: [PRR] PRR Talk St. Louis Prototype Modelers Meet X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 1-2 From: caples5@juno.com Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Anyone from this list going to this meet. I would like to meet other PRR fans at this show. See you there, John Caples ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 13:32:35 -0500 Subject: [PRR] PRR Talk St. Louis Prototype Modelers Meet X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 1-2 From: caples5@juno.com Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Anyone from this list going to this meet. I would like to meet other PRR fans at this show. See you there, John Caples ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Wayne S. Betty" Subject: RE: [PRR] Stockyards and Colored Lights Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 15:13:49 -0400 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 In-Reply-To: <000f01c482f4$ab870440$35d01842@stny.rr.com> Importance: Normal X-SLUIDL: 31948197-98E6484F-BC1CED1F-2B1EA514 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com If my memory remembers sort of closely - the last of the owners pulled out last year. The area is slowly being demolished. Some of the pens where found to have various deficiencies and what not. There have been several ideas put forth for filling the space - leading currently is another strip mall. Cos Wayne S. Betty Cos Communications, Inc. Small business IT services. Lancaster & Atlantic Rail Road NMRA, MER, Susquehanna Div, 11 NHRS, Lancaster & PRRT&HS #7061 http://www.wsbcos.com/trainsmenu.htm at the west end of the PRR electrified zone "If we can not have what we like, we must learn to like what we have!" John Paul Jones -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com]On Behalf Of William Bigler Sent: Sunday, August 15, 2004 2:21 PM To: PRR Talk Subject: Re: [PRR] Stockyards and Colored Lights I remember the Lancaster Stockyards from the Pennsy convention that was held there several years ago. It was near the hotel, and of course, the tracks. It was behind a very good steak house. Fortunately, the steakhouse was upwind while we enjoyed a very good dinner. One afternoon we went over to the stockyards to photograph the place. Being a weekend, it was pretty inactive. However, during the photo session, a tractor trailer pulled in with a load of calves who were having intestinal problems Whew! Even getting upwind didn't help! No idea how people could stand to work in those places. Interesting to find an active, alive, and well stockyard in daily operation here in the east. I guess I thought virtually all meat came from the Midwest, and was slaughtered and packed near where the cattle were raised. But coming to think about it, there are some farms that raise beef cattle in the east. All transportation seems to be by truck now, however. Bill Bigler - 4915 Big Flats NY Modeling PRR Renovo & Williamsport WWII > Just catching up on two threads from last month: > > Lancaster Stockyards: > At one time the PRR owned the stockyards at Lancaster. Reportedly they were the largest ones east of Chicago. They were quite extensive with quarantine pens on the south side of the PRR Main. A tunnel underneath the tracks allowed animals to reach the main part of the stockyards on the north side. Reportedly one reason why the stockyards were so important was that they opened earlier than Chicago and so could be a trend setter with respect to price. > > Home Signals - Colored Lights > To the best of my knowledge and experience "Cola" never had colored lights in its PRR home signals in PRR, Conrail, or NS periods. > > Fred > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Brian J Carlson" Subject: [PRR] FOR SALE HO Scale BLI H-2A hoppers Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 21:26:39 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version 0.71, clamav-milter version 0.71 X-Virus-Status: Clean Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I purchased a 6 pack of these hoppers however, statistically I really only need 3 of them. I am offering the 3 others for sale at $28/each which if multiplied by six is the price I paid. Priority mail shipping is include in the price. These are on a first come basis. Brian J Carlson P.E. Cheektowaga NY ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 09:54:02 -0400 Subject: [PRR] Ex-PRR CV Branch Lives! From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Okay, we know the ex-PRR Cumberland Valley Branch has been alive all these years because there are many industries on it between Lemoyne and Mechanicsburg... and the yard on the east side of Mechanicsburg sees quite a bit of activity. But I hadn't seen a train on the stretch east of that Mechanicsburg yard in at least 15 years, if not 20! Well this morning at 8:30 a.m., that streak was broken! Westbound heading past West Shore Shopping Center (Karn's). ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed To: PRR-Talk From: "Donald E. Harper, Jr." Subject: [PRR] train speeds Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 11:38:48 -0500 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.609) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Just back from visiting Long Island and the Pittsburgh area. Got photos of the Montauk and Riverhead stations. Got photos of the LIRR Museum's G5 at Riverhead (they just got a $800,000 grant to restore her). Took the LIRR from Sayville to Penn Station, then Amtrak from Penn Station to Philadelphia behind electric engines and Philly to Pittsburgh behind diesels. There was some sort of equipment problem at Penn Station so we were an hour late leaving. Somewhere between Penn Station and Philly I clocked 33 seconds between mileposts. If my calculations are correct that translates to 104 mph. Do they really travel that fast or is my time off? I was happy to see that PRR position signals are still in place at numerous locations along the route. They are still in place at Haysville and Glenshaw between Pittsburgh and Conway Yard. Don Harper Texas A&M Marine Lab 5007 Avenue U Galveston, TX 77551 409/740-4540 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Cc: PRR-Talk From: Bruce Smith Subject: Re: [PRR] train speeds Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 12:54:22 -0500 To: "Donald E. Harper, Jr." X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Aug 16, 2004, at 11:38 AM, Donald E. Harper, Jr. wrote: > Just back from visiting Long Island and the Pittsburgh area. Got > photos of the Montauk and Riverhead stations. Got photos of the LIRR > Museum's G5 at Riverhead (they just got a $800,000 grant to restore > her). Took the LIRR from Sayville to Penn Station, then Amtrak from > Penn Station to Philadelphia behind electric engines and Philly to > Pittsburgh behind diesels. There was some sort of equipment problem > at Penn Station so we were an hour late leaving. Somewhere between > Penn Station and Philly I clocked 33 seconds between mileposts. If my > calculations are correct that translates to 104 mph. Do they really > travel that fast or is my time off? Don, That's about right. The stretch though Princeton Junction is just about the fastest part of the railroad. Regards Bruce Bruce F. Smith Auburn, AL http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/ "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin __ / \ __<+--+>________________\__/___ ________________________________ |- ______/ O O \_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ | | / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 \ | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__|| |/_____________________________\|_|________________________________| | O--O \0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Rob Schoenberg" Subject: [PRR] Odd Switching tractor... Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 14:09:51 -0400 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-PMX-Version: 4.6.1.107272, Antispam-Core: 4.6.1.106808, Antispam-Data: 2004.8.16.110392 X-PerlMx-Spam: Gauge=IIIIIII, Probability=7%, Report='__TO_MALFORMED_2 0, __OIMO_MSGID 0, __HAS_MSGID 0, __SANE_MSGID 0, __MIME_VERSION 0, __EVITE_CTYPE 0, __CTYPE_CHARSET_QUOTED 0, __CT_TEXT_PLAIN 0, __CT 0, __CTE 0, __HAS_X_PRIORITY 0, __HAS_MSMAIL_PRI 0, __OIMO_MUA 0, __HAS_X_MAILER 0, __ANY_OUTLOOK_MUA 0, __PORN_PHRASE_15_0 0, __MIME_TEXT_ONLY 0' Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hi all, I picked up some negatives of an odd looking rubber tired switching tractor and am wondering if anyone on the list knows anything about it! Here's a link to a scan of the photo: http://prr.railfan.net/photos/OddTractor_JerseyCity_RS.jpg The only info I have is that it's in Jersey City circa 1948. It's shown coupled up to a "normal" PRR switching tractor which is just out of frame. It has NJ license plates and it's apparently built by Euclid (the radiator and wheel hubs are marked Euclid at least..) Does anyone have any info about this beast? Thanks! Rob ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 14:03:18 -0700 (PDT) From: Frank Smith Subject: [PRR] B1 electric switchers Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 14:03:18 -0700 (PDT) From: Frank Smith Subject: [PRR] B1 electric switchers Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2004 03:30:20 -0400 From: "Vagel C. Keller, Jr." Subject: [PRR] Re: Ex-PRR CV Branch Lives! Content-Disposition: inline Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com --On Tuesday, August 17, 2004 1:10 "Jerry Britton" wrote; > Okay, we know the ex-PRR Cumberland Valley Branch has been alive all > these years because there are many industries on it between Lemoyne and > Mechanicsburg... and the yard on the east side of Mechanicsburg sees > quite a bit of activity. > > But I hadn't seen a train on the stretch east of that Mechanicsburg > yard in at least 15 years, if not 20! > > Well this morning at 8:30 a.m., that streak was broken! Westbound > heading past West Shore Shopping Center (Karn's). HA-rummppphhh!!!! Just as it may shock the Philadelphia Chapter to learn that there was a PRR west of the Catenary at Enola, you might be interested to learn that the Cumberland Valley RAILROAD lives south of Mechanicsburg, Jerry! To wit, Hagerstown to Shippensburg, and "WhateveritscalledBetweenHager&Winchester,VA" to boot. I don't know what it's called between Shippensburg and Harrisburg, but neither, it seems, do the dilatantes Roberts and Messner, if their labeling of the Camelback bridge as the CVRR bridge is any indication. Last year I actually photographed a NSdap freight northbound on the original Franklin RR, south of the ex-WM Lurgan/ex-CSX crossing, entering the ex-CV highline at south end of Chambersburg. BTW, the NS rape of PRR/the Commaonwealth has entered a new stage ... scrapping of track above the hump at Hollidaysburg has begun. Thank you, Arlen. George Pickett would be proud. Vagel Keller ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2004 05:32:28 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: [PRR] train speeds From: Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com >> Somewhere between Penn Station and Philly I clocked 33 seconds >> between mileposts. Some shopping can yield a 'tachymeter scaled' watch, which does the conversion automatically. 8)>> >> If my calculations are correct that translates to 104 mph. Do >> they really travel that fast or is my time off? In past years I've gotten 120 plus. > That's about right. The stretch though Princeton Junction is just > about the fastest part of the railroad. ...varying with equipment limits, etc.... I was in Amcoach.... best dwp ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Tue, 17 Aug 2004 21:53:35 -0500 Subject: Re: [PRR] Odd Switching tractor... X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 5,7-34 From: jeffrey d thomas Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I do not have any info. about that specific tractor unit. however, it is a Euclid tractor that is the same as those used to pull bottom-dump trailers for construction work. I have an old Euclid reference book where I might be able to find some info. on this tractor. Do you happen to know about what year that photo was taken. It would help me narrow down my search in the serial number guide I have. On Mon, 16 Aug 2004 14:09:51 -0400 "Rob Schoenberg" writes: > Hi all, > > I picked up some negatives of an odd looking rubber tired switching > tractor > and am wondering if anyone on the list knows anything about it! > Here's a > link to a scan of the photo: > http://prr.railfan.net/photos/OddTractor_JerseyCity_RS.jpg > > The only info I have is that it's in Jersey City circa 1948. It's > shown > coupled up to a "normal" PRR switching tractor which is just out of > frame. > It has NJ license plates and it's apparently built by Euclid (the > radiator > and wheel hubs are marked Euclid at least..) > > Does anyone have any info about this beast? > > Thanks! > > Rob > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2004 07:56:20 -0400 Subject: [PRR] "Black Gold, Black Diamonds" From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: <9EBA6362-F10D-11D8-ACC3-000393835C88@pennsyrr.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Has anyone had any contact with Eric Hirsimaki, author of the "Black Gold, Black Diamonds" series on Pennsy dieselization? The publisher was Mileposts Publishing, who doesn't seem to have a web site. It was to be a five volume series, and it's been many, many years since volume two came out. Anyone know if the series is indeed continuing? ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2004 09:06:06 -0400 From: Stephen Bartlett Subject: Re: [PRR] train speeds X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at out001.verizon.net from [151.203.111.5] at Wed, 18 Aug 2004 08:05:24 -0500 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com One brand to look for is the Robic timer, an electronic stopwatch which can be programmed to calculate speed for any desired distance. It does multiple laps, so a button click at the mileposts gives the previous mule's speed while continuing to read the next mile. http://www.robictimers.com/ Steve Bartlett davep wrote: ... Some shopping can yield a 'tachymeter scaled' watch, which does the conversion automatically. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: RBurg74133@aol.com Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2004 11:35:10 EDT Subject: Re: [PRR] "Black Gold, Black Diamonds" X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Jerry, Eric Hirsimaki is apparently alive and well. He wrote an article on turbines in CLASSIC TRAINS (FALL). Lives in the Cleveland area. I am eagerly awaitig future volumes of his PRR books. Ray Burghart SPF ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2004 21:36:15 -0500 Subject: [PRR] Part of Marietta Branch in operation again X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0,8,13-14 From: jeffrey d thomas Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I just spent the weekend in Southeastern Ohio, and discovered that part of the Marietta branch has been repaired and is being operated by a tourist railroad. The Buckeye Central Railroad, apparently has moved it's operations from Buckeye Lake, to Byesville, Ohio. They, or some local government agency, repaired the flood damaged line from Byesville, south to Derwent, and operate trains on the weekends. The conductor told me they hope to operate clear out to Cumberland on the old B&O trackage that branches off the Marietta line at Derwent. The line from Byesville, all the way to the end of track south of Cumberland, is heavy, welded rail. This trackage would let them take riders out to "The Wilds", a huge nature preserve in the old mine reclamation areas near Cumberland. The railroad has a very nice website with some history of these rail lines. www.buckeyecentralrailroad.org Jeff thomas Denton, Tx. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 18 Aug 2004 21:36:15 -0500 Subject: [PRR] Part of Marietta Branch in operation again X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0,8,13-14 From: jeffrey d thomas Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I just spent the weekend in Southeastern Ohio, and discovered that part of the Marietta branch has been repaired and is being operated by a tourist railroad. The Buckeye Central Railroad, apparently has moved it's operations from Buckeye Lake, to Byesville, Ohio. They, or some local government agency, repaired the flood damaged line from Byesville, south to Derwent, and operate trains on the weekends. The conductor told me they hope to operate clear out to Cumberland on the old B&O trackage that branches off the Marietta line at Derwent. The line from Byesville, all the way to the end of track south of Cumberland, is heavy, welded rail. This trackage would let them take riders out to "The Wilds", a huge nature preserve in the old mine reclamation areas near Cumberland. The railroad has a very nice website with some history of these rail lines. www.buckeyecentralrailroad.org Jeff thomas Denton, Tx. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: mittner@webtv.net (Gary Mittner) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 10:48:47 -0400 Subject: [PRR] Last Run Date MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com List, What was the date of that last steam operation on the PRR supposedly regarding an I1sa and hopper train in or around Cresson/Galitzin/Altoona area? Thanks, Gary Come visit my PRR Pages: Photos, Models, Historical Items and Art Work! PRR K4s Loco Pics: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/ PRR G5s, T1, J1 J1a, M1, M1a, N1s, etc. etc.: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/prr_loco_index.html and...... PRR Pics, P&LE Pics, PRR Memorabilia and Misc. Models: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/indexpics.html ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: mittner@webtv.net (Gary Mittner) Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 10:48:47 -0400 Subject: [PRR] Last Run Date MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com List, What was the date of that last steam operation on the PRR supposedly regarding an I1sa and hopper train in or around Cresson/Galitzin/Altoona area? Thanks, Gary Come visit my PRR Pages: Photos, Models, Historical Items and Art Work! PRR K4s Loco Pics: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/ PRR G5s, T1, J1 J1a, M1, M1a, N1s, etc. etc.: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/prr_loco_index.html and...... PRR Pics, P&LE Pics, PRR Memorabilia and Misc. Models: http://www.angelfire.com/film/prrpics/indexpics.html ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: John Frantz Subject: [PRR] B6 or B8? Date: Fri, 20 Aug 2004 23:51:03 -0400 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new .250 at suscom.net Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Listers, I was overviewing some pictures and wanted to know what=20 the differences were between these two classes. I'm=20 guessing it would be mostly appliances because there is no=20 major overall appearance changes between classes. TIA -John ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2004 04:02:13 -0500 Subject: [PRR] PRR Talk- E-8 #5898 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 2,5-6 From: caples5@juno.com Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Yes this locomotive is a former PRR unit. Before being sold to ST. Louis , Iron Mountain and Southern. It ran on the Reading , Blue Mountain, And Northern in Reading PA. I last saw this locomotive about 5 years ago and the paint job/ body was looking rough at that time. I haven't seen it since so I can't comment on it's present condition. Later, John Caples ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Ted Andrews" Subject: [PRR] Looking for an SD-9 and an SD-35 Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2004 10:05:07 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hi everyone: I am looking for the following: P2K SD-9 in PRR (either road number) Atlas SD-35 in PRR (no number) If any of you have these engines and are thinking of selling, please = contact me off list.=20 Thanks! Ted Andrews Carmel, Indiana ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] B6 or B8? Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2004 09:02:17 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-reply-to: X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcSHMoc5gZFWq6wNRImx/KcEGd4pMAB3nlrA Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Since no one has responded (yet) I'll give it a shot off the top of my head. As I recall the two classes were not similar. The B8 had a distinctly smaller boiler than the B6. Of course the B6 was the dominant switcher on the PRR. The B8 must have been built for some designated special service. regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of John Frantz Sent: Friday, August 20, 2004 11:51 PM To: PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: [PRR] B6 or B8? Listers, I was overviewing some pictures and wanted to know what the differences were between these two classes. I'm guessing it would be mostly appliances because there is no major overall appearance changes between classes. TIA -John ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2004 10:20:26 -0400 Subject: [PRR] The Keystone Modeler & Periodical Index From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: <945B804A-F50F-11D8-A57C-000393835C88@pennsyrr.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com The PDF version of the August TKM was posted on the Society's web site over the weekend. Be reminded that a searchable index of TKM exists on the Keystone Crossings web site: http://kc.pennsyrr.com/forms/periodicals/ The index also contains entries for The Keystone, Pennsy Journal, The Pennsy (only a few issues), and Rails Northeast (PRR entries only). ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2004 14:27:13 -0700 (PDT) From: Doug Kisala Subject: [PRR] B6 and B8 differences From: "Wayne S. Betty" Subject: RE: [PRR] B6 or B8? Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2004 20:56:11 -0400 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-reply-to: <200408231300.i7ND0Ya03563@smtp-bedford-dr.mitre.org> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Importance: Normal X-SLUIDL: 6257E852-8AC94723-89FE76B7-08AEC338 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Howdy All: Direct from PPIII Juniata, BLW & Lima built 267 B8 (1903-1913), 20x24 cylinders, 56-inch drivers, 205psi, 143450 weight Juniata built 238 B6sb (1916-1926), 22x24 cylinders, 56-inch drivers, 205psi, 177350 weight Briefly checking the 1944 MP229 http://www.wsbcos.com/mp229/mp229.htm there was still a good number of these machines in service. Also checked my 1952 Classification and Description of Locomotives and Tenders - they are still listed there. Not bad for a non-superheated machine. Twenty-seven where converted to B8a saddle tank They would have looked very similar in there basic lines, the B8 used a 55s66a tender, while the B6sb used the 60s66a tender, both had Belpaire fire boxes, but the B8 used piston valve gear while the B6sb used Walsaherts valve gear. Cos Wayne S. Betty Cos Communications, Inc. Small business IT services. Lancaster & Atlantic Rail Road NMRA, MER, Susquehanna Div, 11 NHRS, Lancaster & PRRT&HS #7061 http://www.wsbcos.com/trainsmenu.htm at the west end of the PRR electrified zone "If we can not have what we like, we must learn to like what we have!" John Paul Jones -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com]On Behalf Of Andy Miller Sent: Monday, August 23, 2004 9:02 AM To: 'John Frantz'; PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: RE: [PRR] B6 or B8? Since no one has responded (yet) I'll give it a shot off the top of my head. As I recall the two classes were not similar. The B8 had a distinctly smaller boiler than the B6. Of course the B6 was the dominant switcher on the PRR. The B8 must have been built for some designated special service. regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of John Frantz Sent: Friday, August 20, 2004 11:51 PM To: PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: [PRR] B6 or B8? Listers, I was overviewing some pictures and wanted to know what the differences were between these two classes. I'm guessing it would be mostly appliances because there is no major overall appearance changes between classes. TIA -John ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Ted Andrews" Subject: [PRR] PRR in the Movies alert!! Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2004 22:57:48 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com PRR Listers: I was watching Turner Movie Classics this evening. They are showing the = following movie: The Major and the Minor, (1942), starring Ginger Rogers and Ray Milland. = The movie plot is a woman (Rogers) disguises herself as a little girl = and ends up in a military academy. The beginning of the movie takes place on the EB Broadway Limited and = has some great action shots of the Broadway heading out of Chicago and = going across the 4-tracked mainline in Pennsylvania pulled by K-4 3768 = (fully streamlined) Great action shots!!! Ted Andrews ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Ted Andrews" Subject: [PRR] PRR in the Movies alert!! Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2004 22:57:48 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com PRR Listers: I was watching Turner Movie Classics this evening. They are showing the = following movie: The Major and the Minor, (1942), starring Ginger Rogers and Ray Milland. = The movie plot is a woman (Rogers) disguises herself as a little girl = and ends up in a military academy. The beginning of the movie takes place on the EB Broadway Limited and = has some great action shots of the Broadway heading out of Chicago and = going across the 4-tracked mainline in Pennsylvania pulled by K-4 3768 = (fully streamlined) Great action shots!!! Ted Andrews ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2004 10:11:59 -0400 Subject: [PRR] N Scale Passenger Cars Coming From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: <904AE1F3-F5D7-11D8-B6A0-000393835C88@pennsyrr.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com As many know, the Centralia Car Shops / InterMountain partnership has already produced N scale PRR P85b coaches and 6-6-4's in other roads. The "N Horizons" column of "N Scale Railroading" magazine publicizes that 4-4-2's, 10-5's, 13 BR, and 18 RMT cars are all coming in ready-to-run and in PRR livery! All are pre-war cars. While some of these cars have been discussed verbally, on lists, and in private circles, I mention it here as it has now appeared "in print" in a national publication. And don't forget the previous note on PRR P70FBR's from Wheels Of Time! ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: Jerry @ Pennsy Subject: [PRR] Re: Branchline Passenger car survey sort of Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2004 21:44:20 -0400 To: PRR-talk X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I'm floating the following for a third party. Please share your=20 thoughts... > =A0 > 1)=A0 Would you be interested in the Branchline passenger cars in RTR? > =A0 > 2)=A0 Would you prefer these cars continue to be available only in = kits? > =A0 > 3) If you are interested what is a reasonable price for these cars in=20= > RTR? ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS jerry@pennsyrr.com Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Cich" Subject: RE: [PRR] Re: Branchline Passenger car survey sort of Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2004 21:23:38 -0500 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.6604 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: <48E159FA-F638-11D8-B99E-000A95C04372@pennsyrr.com> Importance: Normal Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Appropriate question, since I am now taking a break from working on Centwood. Here are my answers: 1. No. 2. No. As long as I can get the kits I want, selling these cars also in RTR is a good idea. I'm all for more profits for Branchline so they can re-invest some of them for the tooling for the 7th, 8th, etc bodystyles. 3. N/A Andy Cich -----Original Message----- I'm floating the following for a third party. Please share your thoughts... >   > 1)  Would you be interested in the Branchline passenger cars in RTR? >   > 2)  Would you prefer these cars continue to be available only in kits? >   > 3) If you are interested what is a reasonable price for these cars in > RTR? ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 08:25:51 -0700 Subject: [PRR] Rail Road History From: Greg Ritacco Message-Id: <0C33FB6A-F6AB-11D8-A606-000A959FDA52@surewest.net> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) X-TST: smtp1 SNWK3 0.31-80 ip=216.93.193.171 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hi Group, With traffic a bit light these days, there is a question in the back of my mind I've been wondering about. When was the word pair Rail Road replaced with the single word Railroad? My informal look into the question shows the one word usage in play pretty much by 1892, and roughly about the same time tenders went from P. R. R. to PENNSYLVANIA. Does anyone know how that came about? Thanks, Greg Ritacco ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "STEPHEN HOXIE" Subject: Re: [PRR] Re: Branchline Passenger car survey sort of Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 11:22:20 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-ELNK-Trace: 65fbc22f705d6e9971639b933de7ae6f7e972de0d01da940e57354b2105df1bd730ed4fbce6c6f30350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 165.121.225.169 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I agree with Andy--very appropriatre question since I have finished my Centwood, except for diaphragms. Beautiful kit. My answers are also the same as Andy's-- 1. No. 2. No. But if RTR will help B/L do the kits I need, more power to them. Parlor cars, anyone? 3. N/A Steve Hoxie Pensacola FL ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andy Cich" To: "PRR-talk" Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 9:23 PM Subject: RE: [PRR] Re: Branchline Passenger car survey sort of > Appropriate question, since I am now taking a break from working on > Centwood. > > Here are my answers: > > 1. No. > > 2. No. As long as I can get the kits I want, selling these cars also in RTR > is a good idea. I'm all for more profits for Branchline so they can > re-invest some of them for the tooling for the 7th, 8th, etc bodystyles. > > 3. N/A > > > Andy Cich > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 12:27:41 -0400 Subject: [PRR] Branchline Question From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Yesterday I posted a question about Branchline passenger cars for a third party. I asked the list to "share comments". Unfortunately, I didn't note that some of the responses were private, to me. They were deleted. I am not tabulating responses. The person looking for the responses is lurking on the list. If you sent a response privately to me, please repost. Thanks. ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 12:27:41 -0400 Subject: [PRR] Branchline Question From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Yesterday I posted a question about Branchline passenger cars for a third party. I asked the list to "share comments". Unfortunately, I didn't note that some of the responses were private, to me. They were deleted. I am not tabulating responses. The person looking for the responses is lurking on the list. If you sent a response privately to me, please repost. Thanks. ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: Bruce Smith Subject: Re:::[PRR] Re: Branchline Passenger car survey sort of Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 11:48:50 -0500 To: "PRR-Talk TALK''" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Aug 24, 2004, at 8:44 PM, Jerry @ Pennsy wrote: > I'm floating the following for a third party. Please share your=20 > thoughts... >> =A0 >> 1)=A0 Would you be interested in the Branchline passenger cars in = RTR? No >> 2)=A0 Would you prefer these cars continue to be available only in = kits? If someone else wants RTR, it doesn't bother me. >> 3) If you are interested what is a reasonable price for these cars in=20= >> RTR? I would think $60-70 list would be competitive. Its an interesting=20 idea. However, the "3rd party" needs to consider that Walthers will=20 enter that market before they can with the same, or nearly the same=20 cars. Therefore, their market share will be restricted to those who=20 want the detail of the Branchline cars without having to build the=20 kits, and are willing to pay a premium. Obviously, this is a MUCH=20 smaller market than the RTR market. Regards Bruce Bruce F. Smith Auburn, AL http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/ "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin=20 Franklin __ / \ __<+--+>________________\__/___ ________________________________ |- ______/ O O \_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ | | / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 \ | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__|| |/_____________________________\|_|________________________________| | O--O \0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0= ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Dave Pfeiffer" Subject: [PRR] Re: Branchline Passenger car survey sort of Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 13:33:19 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at out012.verizon.net from [141.158.54.133] at Wed, 25 Aug 2004 12:31:28 -0500 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Jerry, I am not interested in RTR cars. I always prefer kits, so my answers are: 1. No. 2. Yes. (I don't care if they are available RTR ALSO, but I won't buy them.) 3. N/A. Dave Pfeiffer ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: Subject: [PRR] branchline survey Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 15:12:45 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com hello, all... i will continue to buy the heavyweight sleepers in kit config., = and if they appear in rtr. format, i'll most likely pick up some of = them as well. a fair price for the cars, all up and running would be $ 60- $ = 65....imho. now lets get them thinking about some new car types. = how about an 8 section club lounge car. can you say " lotos club " ????!! = jaygee ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: Subject: [PRR] branchline survey Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 15:12:45 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com hello, all... i will continue to buy the heavyweight sleepers in kit config., = and if they appear in rtr. format, i'll most likely pick up some of = them as well. a fair price for the cars, all up and running would be $ 60- $ = 65....imho. now lets get them thinking about some new car types. = how about an 8 section club lounge car. can you say " lotos club " ????!! = jaygee ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 15:37:16 -0400 From: "Dr. Edmond L. Freed" Subject: Re: [PRR] Re: Branchline Passenger car survey sort of Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com "Dr. Edmond L. Freed" wrote: > "Jerry @ Pennsy" wrote: > > > I'm floating the following for a third party. Please share your > > thoughts... > > > > 1)  Would you be interested in the Branchline passenger cars in RTR? > > Yes >   > > > 2)  Would you prefer these cars continue to be available only in kits? > > No. A partial disability makes it impossible for me to build kits such as these. Therefore, guys like me would not be able to share these great cars. Let's not be selfish. > > > > 3) If you are interested what is a reasonable price for these cars in > > > RTR? > > ??? A fair price would be nice. $60.00 or so. > Eddie ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: hanel29@att.net Subject: Re: [PRR] Re: Branchline Passenger car survey sort of Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 22:51:09 +0000 > From: "Andy Cich" > Subject: RE: [PRR] Re: Branchline Passenger car survey sort of From: "Gregg Mahlkov" Subject: Re: [PRR] Rail Road History Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 19:00:49 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Greg, There is NO date. There are still TWO "Rail Road" companies, the Long Island Rail Road and the Indiana Rail Road. About the only one no longer used is Rail Way, although Railway is almost as common as Railroad in the USA and in almost universal use in other English speaking countries. Gregg Mahlkov ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg Ritacco" To: Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2004 11:25 AM Subject: [PRR] Rail Road History > Hi Group, > With traffic a bit light these days, there is a question in the back of > my mind I've been wondering about. When was the word pair Rail Road > replaced with the single word Railroad? My informal look into the > question shows the one word usage in play pretty much by 1892, and > roughly about the same time tenders went from P. R. R. to PENNSYLVANIA. > Does anyone know how that came about? > Thanks, > Greg Ritacco > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 18:11:27 -0500 From: Morgan Bilbo Subject: Re: [PRR] Branchline Question X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Jerry Britton wrote: Yesterday I posted a question about Branchline passenger cars for a third party. I asked the list to "share comments". Unfortunately, I didn't note that some of the responses were private, to me. They were deleted. I am not tabulating responses. The person looking for the responses is lurking on the list. If you sent a response privately to me, please repost. Thanks. Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS I was one of those who sent it privately, so here tis my opinion/ Jerry Here's my thoughts. Not necessarily how many I would buy, etc. IF IF IF Branchline were to offer passenger cars in HO. They Must Be Specific Railroad Exact - the correct car ALL THE WAY!, I would like to suggest the many forms of P70's (& PB70's) for PRR. They could do the different roofs, ends, underbodies, etc. And - full interiors, diaphragms, etc. Make them so damn good they'd make all current cars on the market look like toys. That's what BLI did for engines. Raise the quality bar high.. Not being a non-PRR expert, I don't know how many other roads used P70's in their own version. An alternative for Branchline is to try to bring out as generic a Pullman as they can, with railroad specific detail as much as they can. The Loco mfgrs are doing that. And if BLI sells a $300 engine for a while, and now improves it in the K4 to the $450 range, I'm sure Branchline could do the same. They should offer the kits as well as RTR. As to price? That's something they have to use their marketing tools for. Walthers sells for what? $25 to $35. But IF the cars had interiors, and were especially nice, they could name their own price. And would Branchline offer trucks with them? I am a firm believer in that no one should offer couplers in their kits. Just use a universal pocket. Now for you, if they do these in HO, why not in N at the same time? Even O too. I wonder why the stuff they offer in HO is different than in N and vice versa. Mfgrs should try to hit more gauges. All IMHO. Morgan Bilbo, Ferroequinologist, Organic Gardener ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: abendschein@comcast.net Subject: Re: [PRR] Rail Road History Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 00:54:08 +0000 > From: "Greg Ritacco" > Subject: [PRR] Rail Road History From: "Greg Johnson" Subject: [PRR] Re: Branchline Passenger car survey Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 20:56:04 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com 1) Y 2) N 3) $50-$60 I love to build kits, but having a 600 sq. ft. railroad, as well as family, work and church obligations, means that some excellent R-T-R items find a home on my layout. I am sure there are plenty of other "railroad builders" as opposed to "railroad model builders" that would rather utilize their precious hobby time in other areas (ie... scenery, benchwork, weathering, structures), rather than passenger car construction. If I could just get rid of this silly obligation of having to go to work every day, I would have time to build everything! Regards, Greg Johnson "patiently awating the R-T-R Branchline cars" ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Aidrian Bridgeman-Sutton" Subject: FW: [PRR] Re: Branchline Passenger car survey sort of Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 19:27:08 -0700 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com ~> 1)=A0 Would you be interested in the Branchline passenger cars in = RTR? Coaches Probably not, since these are only accurate for NYC and possibly some associated companies. Any other road needs modifications that are easier to make if the car is still in pieces.=20 Pullmans Possibly, depending on price and paint schemes=20 ~> 2)=A0 Would you prefer these cars continue to be available only in kits? Not really as long as they are still available in kit form ~> 3) If you are interested what is a reasonable price for these cars in ~> RTR? Gut feeling says $60 or so. They will produce a premium model, provided the running issues are sorted out (truck and frame foul on straight track and the standard wheelsets are a bit dodgy) /abs=20 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.742 / Virus Database: 495 - Release Date: 8/19/2004 =20 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Wayne S. Betty" Subject: RE: [PRR] Rail Road History Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 23:09:48 -0400 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 In-Reply-To: <000c01c48af7$5ea36be0$0a699e0c@DDPXT351> Importance: Normal X-SLUIDL: 47CC2E6E-30A640CA-B50D3E19-0EBDF6BD Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Strasburg Rail Road too! Cos Wayne S. Betty Cos Communications, Inc. Small business IT services. Lancaster & Atlantic Rail Road NMRA, MER, Susquehanna Div, 11 NHRS, Lancaster & PRRT&HS #7061 http://www.wsbcos.com/trainsmenu.htm at the west end of the PRR electrified zone "If we can not have what we like, we must learn to like what we have!" John Paul Jones -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com]On Behalf Of Gregg Mahlkov Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2004 7:01 PM To: Greg Ritacco; PRr-talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] Rail Road History Greg, There is NO date. There are still TWO "Rail Road" companies, the Long Island Rail Road and the Indiana Rail Road. About the only one no longer used is Rail Way, although Railway is almost as common as Railroad in the USA and in almost universal use in other English speaking countries. Gregg Mahlkov ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg Ritacco" To: Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2004 11:25 AM Subject: [PRR] Rail Road History > Hi Group, > With traffic a bit light these days, there is a question in the back of > my mind I've been wondering about. When was the word pair Rail Road > replaced with the single word Railroad? My informal look into the > question shows the one word usage in play pretty much by 1892, and > roughly about the same time tenders went from P. R. R. to PENNSYLVANIA. > Does anyone know how that came about? > Thanks, > Greg Ritacco > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 23:50:55 -0400 From: RamblingReck Subject: Re: [PRR] Re: Branchline Passenger car survey sort of Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Yes, I would be interested in RTR. I would guess that a reasonable price would be something close to the Intermountain car. John Ryan Jerry @ Pennsy wrote: > I'm floating the following for a third party. Please share your > thoughts... > >> >> 1) Would you be interested in the Branchline passenger cars in RTR? >> >> 2) Would you prefer these cars continue to be available only in kits? >> >> 3) If you are interested what is a reasonable price for these cars in >> RTR? > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: OhThoseVoices@aol.com Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 05:33:44 EDT Subject: [PRR] branchline passeger car survey X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Would like to see rtr,and kits available 15/20.00 I feel that the scratchbuilding sector of our hobby is going away,but some of us still like the building of kits(not much room for a complete railroad),but also the rtrgroups will have a nice product available. Jeff Jacobs ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 20:38:23 +0900 From: "Jeremy & Soni Helms" Subject: [PRR] Broadway Limited X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hello all, I was wondering if anyone knew of someone who has attempted a Proto 87 = conversion on a BLI steam locomotive? I am looking to see if it is = possible since that seems to be how I am leaning for modeling these = days. I need to find out to see if this can be done since it will play = into what era I amy model. Thanks for any pointers. Jeremy Okinawa, Japan ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Cc: From: Bruce Smith Subject: Re: [PRR] Broadway Limited Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 07:56:04 -0500 To: "Jeremy & Soni Helms" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Aug 26, 2004, at 6:38 AM, Jeremy & Soni Helms wrote: > Hello all, > > I was wondering if anyone knew of someone who has attempted a Proto 87 > conversion on a BLI steam locomotive? I am looking to see if it is > possible since that seems to be how I am leaning for modeling these > days. I need to find out to see if this can be done since it will > play into what era I amy model. Thanks for any pointers. Jeremy, Intriguing idea. Which locomotive? I ask because to date BLI has only produced large mainline locomotives, and while yes, you might "convert" them to P87 standards, where the heck would you run them? Even the most rabid of P87 gurus admits that P87 is pretty much limited to small, switching style layouts. Or is the loco to be a "hanger queen"? Regards Bruce Bruce F. Smith Auburn, AL http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/ "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin __ / \ __<+--+>________________\__/___ ________________________________ |- ______/ O O \_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ | | / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 \ | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__|| |/_____________________________\|_|________________________________| | O--O \0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 22:43:22 +0900 From: "Jeremy & Soni Helms" Subject: Re: [PRR] Broadway Limited From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] Broadway Limited Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 10:10:46 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcSLc8qcK8MuVNjQSOS55HhR8h/r+AAApVPw In-reply-to: <001001c48b72$a87d40d0$c6c6e9d2@helms7sa7p6ida> Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com The USRA light 2-8-2 is not too improbable on a branchline RR. regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Jeremy & Soni Helms Sent: Thursday, August 26, 2004 9:43 AM To: Bruce Smith Cc: prr-talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] Broadway Limited Bruce and all, I thought the same thing but got to thinking what of a long straight diorama that the trains just ran through and had staging on either end of the diorama? I am not sure but I do know that I will be building freight car kits slowly but surely over the next 8 or more years as I await military retirement and start a new career after that. I enjoy highly detailed stuff so it would be to show off the models. Still just contemplating. I am also contemplating not going that far and only using the semi-scale wheelsets but using sargeant scale couplers. Just was curious on the topic. Jeremy > Jeremy, > > Intriguing idea. Which locomotive? I ask because to date BLI has > only produced large mainline locomotives, and while yes, you might "convert" > them to P87 standards, where the heck would you run them? Even the > most rabid of P87 gurus admits that P87 is pretty much limited to > small, switching style layouts. Or is the loco to be a "hanger queen"? > > > Regards > Bruce ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Cc: "'Jeremy & Soni Helms'" , From: Bruce Smith Subject: Re: [PRR] Broadway Limited Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 09:41:55 -0500 To: "Andy Miller" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Aug 26, 2004, at 9:10 AM, Andy Miller wrote: > The USRA light 2-8-2 is not too improbable on a branchline RR. Excellent point! Not wanting an L2s I had ignored it... but you could build a neat PRR granger scenario, with the L2S being the "road power" and a B6 or H10 as local switching power. N6B cabins, flat terrain and grain elevators would stamp an indellible "Lines West" impression in the mind of the viewer. Regards Bruce Bruce F. Smith Auburn, AL http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/ "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin __ / \ __<+--+>________________\__/___ ________________________________ |- ______/ O O \_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ | | / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 \ | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__|| |/_____________________________\|_|________________________________| | O--O \0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 14:40:39 -0400 Subject: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: <6D52E465-F78F-11D8-A424-000393835C88@pennsyrr.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Off-topic, but yet relevant, to 1950's modelers... Classic Metal Works has announced, for shipment in November, 1954 R-190 tractors and Fruehauf 32' Aerovan Trailers in both HO and N scales. Other than Undecorated and Chicago Express, they are also being offered in Mid-States and Cooper-Jarrett. What parts of the country did these latter two roam in... around Pennsylvania by chance? ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 14:40:39 -0400 Subject: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: <6D52E465-F78F-11D8-A424-000393835C88@pennsyrr.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Off-topic, but yet relevant, to 1950's modelers... Classic Metal Works has announced, for shipment in November, 1954 R-190 tractors and Fruehauf 32' Aerovan Trailers in both HO and N scales. Other than Undecorated and Chicago Express, they are also being offered in Mid-States and Cooper-Jarrett. What parts of the country did these latter two roam in... around Pennsylvania by chance? ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 15:04:51 -0400 From: Dan Cupper Subject: Re: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Greetings to Jerry and the list: All three -- along with Spector and Eastern -- are depicted aboard the PRR TrucTrain in the 1956 Grif Teller calendar titled Dynamic Progress. PRR provided original photos to Teller for his use in creating the painting -- those photos contain trailers bearing all of the above trucking firms' names. Dan Cupper Jerry Britton wrote: > Off-topic, but yet relevant, to 1950's modelers... > > Classic Metal Works has announced, for shipment in November, 1954 > R-190 tractors and Fruehauf 32' Aerovan Trailers in both HO and N scales. > > Other than Undecorated and Chicago Express, they are also being > offered in Mid-States and Cooper-Jarrett. What parts of the country > did these latter two roam in... around Pennsylvania by chance? > ----------------------------------------------------------- > Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS > Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. > "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! > http://kc.pennsyrr.com > "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... > http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 15:10:13 -0400 Subject: Re: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers From: Jerry Britton X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Thursday, August 26, 2004, at 03:04 PM, Dan Cupper wrote: > All three -- along with Spector and Eastern -- are depicted aboard the > PRR TrucTrain in the 1956 Grif Teller calendar titled Dynamic > Progress. PRR provided original photos to Teller for his use in > creating the painting -- those photos contain trailers bearing all of > the above trucking firms' names. Great info, Dan! Now, the following is not known to be 100% correct, but at least one source I have perused indicates that... * Initial TrucTrain service in 1954 was for PRR owned trailers only. Third party trailers were not accepted until March 1955. * Fruehauf 32' two axle trailers were not ordered by the PRR (themselves) until March 1955. Until then they used existing 24' and 26' trailers plus new 150 recently purchased 30' Fruehauf single axle trailers. Still, looking forward to these models. ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 15:16:29 -0400 Subject: Re: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers From: Jerry Britton X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Thursday, August 26, 2004, at 03:04 PM, Dan Cupper wrote: > All three -- along with Spector and Eastern -- are depicted aboard the > PRR TrucTrain in the 1956 Grif Teller calendar titled Dynamic > Progress. All, for reference... http://kc.pennsyrr.com/art/images/1956.jpeg Thanks, again, Dan, so easy to forget what is already on my web site! ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: RDG2124@aol.com Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 15:25:56 EDT Subject: [PRR] Pennsy P70 Coach in HO RTR X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Queried Walthers about the rumor of them producing this car. The response was that they are only CONSIDERING this. No information as to whether this would be an original version or a later modified version. Time for those of us interested in this car to let Walthers know that we are. As the only decent P70 coaches out there are either brass or the hard to find ALCO models, this car would be a strong seller. I inquired about it at the local hobby shop but the buyer that was handling the Walthers orders recently quit the shop. The new buyer is not aware of any proposed new products questionnaire sent from Walthers to their retailers that included the P70. Thank you, Evan Leisey RCT&HS 346 PRRT&HS 7487 PRRT&HS (Phila.) 2036 CNJ 2003 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Park Varieties" Subject: Re: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 15:37:33 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I believe I have a video entitled "Diesels Roar On The Pennsy" or something like that that shows several TTX trains going by. Cooper-Jarrett and Mid-States trailers were in several trains in quantity. Frank Brua ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jerry Britton" To: "PRR-Talk LIST" Sent: Thursday, August 26, 2004 2:40 PM Subject: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers > Off-topic, but yet relevant, to 1950's modelers... > > Classic Metal Works has announced, for shipment in November, 1954 R-190 > tractors and Fruehauf 32' Aerovan Trailers in both HO and N scales. > > Other than Undecorated and Chicago Express, they are also being offered > in Mid-States and Cooper-Jarrett. What parts of the country did these > latter two roam in... around Pennsylvania by chance? > ----------------------------------------------------------- > Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS > Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. > "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! > http://kc.pennsyrr.com > "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... > http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: KEMACPRR@aol.com Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 15:40:34 EDT Subject: Re: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Jerry and the list. I was fortunate enough about 20 years ago to pick up two flatcars and 7 trailers that were built for the PRR in 1954 to be used at trade shows to show customers what their new F-39 flats with trailers would look like. They are about 3/4'' scale and one came with a display section of track. I've heard that there were 6 flats made . I've seen them in the Pennsy magazine . The trailers I have were custom painted and lettered for then customers of the PRR. Interestingly most were only done on one side with the other done in a PRR truc train scheme. The ones I have are the following : Eastern Motor Express, Liberty Motor Freight Lines Inc. ,Chicago Express , Long Transportation , Kelleher , Mid States. Cooper Jarrett and TransAmerican were also early PRR Truc -Train customers. -----------Ken McCorry ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Park Varieties" Subject: [PRR] Power Chassis For P2K FA Units Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 15:47:51 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com What would be a good power chassis to use under a P2K HO FA diesel? I = spent a lot of time detailing the shells and am growing more upset each = day with the poor running qualities of the power chassis. I don't know if the truck spacing is correct but has anyone ever = considered or used the Walthers Trainline FA chassis? Thanks. Frank Brua ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Park Varieties" Subject: [PRR] Power Chassis For P2K FA Units Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 15:47:51 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com What would be a good power chassis to use under a P2K HO FA diesel? I = spent a lot of time detailing the shells and am growing more upset each = day with the poor running qualities of the power chassis. I don't know if the truck spacing is correct but has anyone ever = considered or used the Walthers Trainline FA chassis? Thanks. Frank Brua ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 15:54:36 -0400 From: TGREGMRTN@aol.com Subject: [PRR] Improving the Bowser H21...(from PRR Pro) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On the PRR Pro Group Dean Payne writes... "Wasn't there a note on this list about an upcoming article on improving Bowser's H21? Did I miss it or has it been delayed? Dean Payne" YIKES! I guess I can't keep anything a secrete... Yes, It is on the bench with a GLa... Cat's out of the bag now... Yes, part of our on going saga of "Making Bowser Better". Alas, it is just in the "cracked the box" mode as I am trying to finish a couple of display cars for th California State Railways Museum's Gift Shop... So it will get started in anohter week of so. Also, I am committed to doing some work with Ben Hom and my Brother on some Headend articles for a magazine (RMC). So please be apteint as I have a nearly full plate. Funny thing is that my good friend Mike Beradley memtions that the folks at Bowesr are producing the H21 without the reinforced top rib, but I recently ordered several with that specifically in the order and guess what...? you got it my undec's can with the rib... OH Well, Just more fodder for the article. Watch for it in TKM. "Making Bowser Better" is on going Byline and will include all the Bowser cars over time (some special bashes as well). It's a "baby steps" idea that helps you except the challenge to do just that... Greg Martin ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "PennsyRRfan" Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 20:37:39 GMT Subject: RE: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers From: Jerry Britton [mailto:jerry@pennsyrr.com] Subject: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers From: "STEPHEN HOXIE" Subject: Re: [PRR] Power Chassis For P2K FA Units Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 16:33:47 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-ELNK-Trace: 65fbc22f705d6e9971639b933de7ae6f7e972de0d01da9407d5f4f49130715f9b40a2b0ec8c3072c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 199.174.135.214 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hi Frank--Which FA, FA1 or FA2? Here is what I have done: FA1: From a Kato RS2 obtain the motor/flywheels and trucks. Strip the P2K chassis of everything. With your trusty Dremel cut away any metal that interferes with trucks. Runs like only a Kato can. FA2: From a Atls/Kato RS3 remove the hoods, cab and walkways. Drop the remaining chassis into the FA2 body. You will have to fashion a way to attach the body; I used four pieces of 1/4 x 1/4 styrene glued to the inside of the body at four locations then drilled thru the frame. Lots of room to add weight. Again, runs like only a Kato can. Steve Hoxie Pensacola FL ----- Original Message ----- From: "Park Varieties" To: "PRR-Talk" Sent: Thursday, August 26, 2004 2:47 PM Subject: [PRR] Power Chassis For P2K FA Units What would be a good power chassis to use under a P2K HO FA diesel? I spent a lot of time detailing the shells and am growing more upset each day with the poor running qualities of the power chassis. I don't know if the truck spacing is correct but has anyone ever considered or used the Walthers Trainline FA chassis? Thanks. Frank Brua ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Michael Hauk" Subject: [PRR] Northern Central roundhouse plans Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 17:59:11 -0400 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <27455.78091@dsop.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I'm looking for plans for wooden board-and-batten or brick roundhouse, circa late 19th / early 20th century. Did the Northern Central have standard design plans, and anyone have any idea if such might be available anywhere? Thanks, Mike Hauk ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: RDG2124@aol.com Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 20:01:29 EDT Subject: Re: [PRR] Power Chassis For P2K FA Units X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com The Atlas ALCO RS units will fit with little modification. Believe it was a fellow named Herzog, who had an article on his Leigh & New England layout, mentioned repowering the FA/FB units with the chassis and drive from the Atlas RS units. Something was also mention about the truck spacing being off by a foot or a half a foot. From the photos in the article, the repowered units look great. Evan Leisey RCT&HS 346 PRRT&HS 7487 PRRT&HS (Phila.) 2036 CNJ 2003 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Aidrian Bridgeman-Sutton" Subject: RE: [PRR] Broadway Limited Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 19:49:46 -0700 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 In-reply-to: <4A52884E-F75F-11D8-9378-000A958DAD46@vetmed.auburn.edu> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com And so while the great ones depart to their dinner, The secretary stays, growing thinner and thinner Racking his brain to record and report What he thinks that they think that they ought to have thought. ~-----Original Message----- <> Roundhouse queen perhaps? I had a quick squint at my USRA heavy mike and the only issue I can see would be finding suitable wheels and figuring out some form of compensating gear. If you have a lathe you might be able to turn the drivers to P87 profile, but there is a possible problem with this approach. Face off the back and you'll get have problems with the flange, face the front of the tyre and you might have a problem when it takes of the front of the spokes. The alternative might be to source a set of drivers from one of the specialist UK suppliers. These generally have plastic centres and are bored for 1/8" axles so you will need to finish turn to P87 profile - British P4 is slightly different - add counterweights from styrene sheet and figure out electrical pickup and axles. Look at www.sharmanwheels.com for 4mm wheels in P4 profile; their S182 which is a 4mm scale, 4' 7"diameter, 15spoke, wheel with 24inch crank throw and crank pin in line with the spoke might be as close as you can get for the USRA mikes. Other makers include Alan Gibson, Ultrascale and KM products. I have heard distant rumours that the Gibson tool room may be tuning up for some US prototype P87 drivers IMO, compensating gear will be needed for an 8 coupled engine even if it is sprung. That will be more of a challenge due to the construction of the frame, which doesn't leave much room for levers and axle boxes. I have a feeling you may be looking at some radical modifications here. What I would recommend is that you seek out some of the specialist UK magazines such as Model Railway Journal as well as some of the excellent books on the subject. P4 has been around for 35 years odd in one form or another and there's a lot of experience with finescale standards that you can tap into HTH Aidrian --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.744 / Virus Database: 496 - Release Date: 8/24/2004 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 08:07:07 -0400 From: "James L. McDaniel" Subject: Re: [PRR] Broadway Limited Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Bruce: make that an L1s with the same "a B6 or H10 as local switching power. N6B cabins, flat terrain and grain elevators" and it could also be Delmarva! All you need is more trees...lots more trees. The "grain rush" is starting here by the way with summer wheat and soon lots and lots of soybeans, many of which move by ex-PRR rail and car float to Tidewater. Jim McDaniel, Delmarva correspondent ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: Bruce Smith Subject: [PRR] Proto 87 drivers (was Broadway Limited) Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 07:42:53 -0500 To: "PRR-Talk TALK''" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Aug 26, 2004, at 9:49 PM, Aidrian Bridgeman-Sutton wrote: > Look at www.sharmanwheels.com for 4mm wheels in P4 profile; their S182 > which is a 4mm scale, 4' 7"diameter, 15spoke, wheel with 24inch crank > throw and crank pin in line with the spoke might be as close as you can > get for the USRA mikes. > > Other makers include Alan Gibson, Ultrascale and KM products. I have > heard distant rumours that the Gibson tool room may be tuning up for > some US prototype P87 drivers For drivers in the US, try Greenway Products (http://www.greenwayproducts.com/a_drivers.shtml) and NWSL. I'm not sure of the P87 status of the former, but IIRC the latter can be used to get new P87 tires. Regards Bruce Bruce F. Smith Auburn, AL http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/ "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin __ / \ __<+--+>________________\__/___ ________________________________ |- ______/ O O \_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ | | / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 \ | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__|| |/_____________________________\|_|________________________________| | O--O \0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Cc: "PRR-Talk TALK''" From: Bruce Smith Subject: [PRR] Setting the location (Delmarva) was Broadway Limited Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 07:48:03 -0500 To: jlmcdaniel@esva.net X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Aug 27, 2004, at 7:07 AM, James L. McDaniel wrote: > Bruce: make that an L1s with the same "a B6 or H10 as local > switching power. N6B cabins, flat terrain and grain elevators" and > it could also be Delmarva! All you need is more trees...lots more > trees. > > The "grain rush" is starting here by the way with summer wheat and > soon lots and lots of soybeans, many of which move by ex-PRR rail and > car float to Tidewater. Jim, et al, Maybe that H120s would work for you, but in my era (1944), the Delmarva Division had 34 2-8-0s consisting of 6 H6sb and 28 H9s. Nary an H10s in sight . Some additional cars would also set the "scene" as Delmarva, including reefers for the seafood (and fruit?) traffic, as well as the poultry industry. Regards Bruce Bruce F. Smith Auburn, AL http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/ "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin __ / \ __<+--+>________________\__/___ ________________________________ |- ______/ O O \_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ | | / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 \ | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__|| |/_____________________________\|_|________________________________| | O--O \0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "William Bigler" Subject: [PRR] Railfest '04 Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 11:42:13 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Anyone have any specifics about events planned for this year's Railfest in Altoona Oct. 2/3? The museum website just says more info coming late July. Can't find anymore on Google. Thanks! Bill Bigler - 4915 Big Flats NY Modeling PRR Renovo & Williamsport WWII ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 11:53:37 -0400 Subject: Re: [PRR] Railfest '04 From: Jerry Britton X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Friday, August 27, 2004, at 11:42 AM, William Bigler wrote: > Anyone have any specifics about events planned for this year's > Railfest in > Altoona Oct. 2/3? The museum website just says more info coming late > July. > Can't find anymore on Google. I received the mailing with the order form for tickets, including excursion tickets, several weeks ago. But as I do not plan to attend this year, I threw it out. Sorry. But the info was distributed, so it's out there somewhere! ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Chany, Christopher" Subject: [PRR] Walthers Passenger cars Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 12:44:35 -0400 From: "Kevin Lehman" Subject: Re: [PRR] Railfest '04 Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 12:53:43 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com The E-8`s will pull railfest excursions, including 3 times Saturday and = Sunday (10:20 am 12:30 pm 3:15 pm) round trips around Horseshoe curve = and thru Gallitzin tunnels. Rolling stock is back in resigned museum = yard. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 13:04:18 -0400 Subject: Re: [PRR] Railfest '04 From: Jerry Britton X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Friday, August 27, 2004, at 12:53 PM, Kevin Lehman wrote: > The E-8`s will pull railfest excursions, including 3 times Saturday > and Sunday (10:20 am 12:30 pm 3:15 pm) round trips around Horseshoe > curve and thru Gallitzin tunnels. Rolling stock is back in resigned > museum yard. Although I do not recall the particulars, they are also offering an excursion fare from Harrisburg to Altoona and back, and also an overnight trip to Pittsburgh. ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 13:10:39 -0400 Subject: Re: [PRR] Walthers Passenger cars From: Jerry Britton X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Friday, August 27, 2004, at 12:44 PM, Chany, Christopher wrote: > If anyone has gotten the new flyer from Walthers to order their new > catalog: > they will notice that the new heavy weights are on it. > > Do any of these look PRR? I've heard (not from Walthers) that Walthers will be doing * 12-1 (plan 3410-A) -- Yes for Pennsy * 8-1-2 (plan 3973) -- Pennsy had La Reine only; other 8-1-2's were plan 3979 * 14S (plan 3958) -- Yes, for Pennsy * 3-2-Obs -- ?? > > Also hiding behind the B&O cars is a PRR car attached to a R50. Is > that a > new car coming out or one of the old ones? Haven't seen the photo, can't comment. ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Bennett Levin" Subject: Re: [PRR] Railfest '04 Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 13:47:36 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com NOT TRUE..... See more recent information. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jerry Britton" To: "Kevin Lehman" Cc: "PRR-talk" ; "William Bigler" Sent: Friday, August 27, 2004 1:04 PM Subject: Re: [PRR] Railfest '04 > On Friday, August 27, 2004, at 12:53 PM, Kevin Lehman wrote: > > > The E-8`s will pull railfest excursions, including 3 times Saturday > > and Sunday (10:20 am 12:30 pm 3:15 pm) round trips around Horseshoe > > curve and thru Gallitzin tunnels. Rolling stock is back in resigned > > museum yard. > > Although I do not recall the particulars, they are also offering an > excursion fare from Harrisburg to Altoona and back, and also an > overnight trip to Pittsburgh. > ----------------------------------------------------------- > Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS > Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. > "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! > http://kc.pennsyrr.com > "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... > http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: PKMac101@aol.com Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 13:53:12 EDT Subject: [PRR-FAX] Minature 12 volt light bulb HELP List, I am in need of two minature 12 volt light bulbs with a bayonet style base. This is the same size as a flashlight bulb. The number is GE 257. It is a flasher bulb. I did find a place that can order them but I must order a min of 12 plus shp from Cal.,Don't need 12. If you have two spares or know where I can get two please email me off line please with price and or info. Thank you in advance. Pat McKinney Altoona,Pa. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/raYplB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PRR/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: PRR-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: PKMac101@aol.com Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 13:53:12 EDT Subject: [PRR] Minature 12 volt light bulb HELP X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com List, I am in need of two minature 12 volt light bulbs with a bayonet style base. This is the same size as a flashlight bulb. The number is GE 257. It is a flasher bulb. I did find a place that can order them but I must order a min of 12 plus shp from Cal.,Don't need 12. If you have two spares or know where I can get two please email me off line please with price and or info. Thank you in advance. Pat McKinney Altoona,Pa. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 13:57:05 -0400 Subject: Re: [PRR] Railfest '04 From: Jerry Britton X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Friday, August 27, 2004, at 01:47 PM, Bennett Levin wrote: > NOT TRUE..... > > See more recent information. Where? Bennett... when did this change? I got the mailer about a month ago, I think. I don't know why they don't have the mailer online. You'd "think" they'd want to make it easy for prospective attendees! > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jerry Britton" > To: "Kevin Lehman" > Cc: "PRR-talk" ; "William Bigler" > > Sent: Friday, August 27, 2004 1:04 PM > Subject: Re: [PRR] Railfest '04 > > >> On Friday, August 27, 2004, at 12:53 PM, Kevin Lehman wrote: >> >>> The E-8`s will pull railfest excursions, including 3 times Saturday >>> and Sunday (10:20 am 12:30 pm 3:15 pm) round trips around Horseshoe >>> curve and thru Gallitzin tunnels. Rolling stock is back in resigned >>> museum yard. >> >> Although I do not recall the particulars, they are also offering an >> excursion fare from Harrisburg to Altoona and back, and also an >> overnight trip to Pittsburgh. >> ----------------------------------------------------------- >> Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS >> Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. >> "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! >> http://kc.pennsyrr.com >> "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... >> http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> - >> For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. >> >> > > > ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: PKMac101@aol.com Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 14:15:31 EDT Subject: Re: [PRR] Railfest '04 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com List, I am told that there are no excursions around the Horseshoe Curve this year. There are to be trips on the Nitnany Bald Eagle from Tyrone to Port Matilda on Sat & Sun. 4 trips on Sat & 3 trips on Sun. OTHER DETAILS I DO NOT HAVE. Pat McKinney ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Cc: "PRR-Talk TALK''" From: Bruce Smith Subject: Re: [PRR] Walthers Passenger cars Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 13:50:10 -0500 To: Jerry Britton X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Aug 27, 2004, at 12:10 PM, Jerry Britton wrote: > On Friday, August 27, 2004, at 12:44 PM, Chany, Christopher wrote: > >> If anyone has gotten the new flyer from Walthers to order their new >> catalog: >> they will notice that the new heavy weights are on it. >> >> Do any of these look PRR? > > I've heard (not from Walthers) that Walthers will be doing > > * 12-1 (plan 3410-A) -- Yes for Pennsy Duplicates the Branchline model. > * 8-1-2 (plan 3973) -- Pennsy had La Reine only; other 8-1-2's were > plan 3979 A different source has this model as plan 3979A, duplicating Branchline. > * 14S (plan 3958) -- Yes, for Pennsy I can only find one PRR car with this plan, Samuel Morse (13 of plan 3959A) > * 3-2-Obs -- ?? Supposedly plan 3959D, however I find not plan 3959D cars in Tom Madden's database. The PRR did have one 3959J, Joel Chandler Harris and several 3959 cars were painted PRR red in the 1930s and those, and a number of others were sold to the PRR in 1942 for conversion to "workers" coaches. Hmm, I wonder how close the plans are ... The 36 seat diner is a NYC prototype (plan 7020-A) and the paired window coach is a B&O prototype (plan 2882-B) Regards Bruce Bruce F. Smith Auburn, AL http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/ "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin __ / \ __<+--+>________________\__/___ ________________________________ |- ______/ O O \_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ | | / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 \ | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__|| |/_____________________________\|_|________________________________| | O--O \0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 15:02:25 -0400 Subject: Re: [PRR] Railfest '04 From: Jerry Britton In-Reply-To: <104.4f372741.2e60dd49@aol.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Just received confirmation that excursions WERE planned for RailFest but those plans changed. No comment from source on reason(s) for change. Might I suggest that we avoid the subject of excursions so it doesn't get ugly, but discussion of other aspects of RailFest is welcome. Thank you. ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Kevin Lehman" Subject: Re: [PRR] Railfest '04 Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 14:51:10 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I got info from " The Standard ", Railroaders Memorial Museum flyers, = which I got last week. If it isn't true, I am sorry. What is pulling = excursions? ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Bennett Levin" Subject: Re: [PRR] Railfest '04 Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 15:16:33 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com It is my understanding that the E units are going to the museum for static display and will be open for inspection. The details are still being worked on. Bennett ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jerry Britton" To: "PRR-Talk LIST" Sent: Friday, August 27, 2004 3:02 PM Subject: Re: [PRR] Railfest '04 > Just received confirmation that excursions WERE planned for RailFest > but those plans changed. No comment from source on reason(s) for change. > > Might I suggest that we avoid the subject of excursions so it doesn't > get ugly, but discussion of other aspects of RailFest is welcome. Thank > you. > ----------------------------------------------------------- > Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS > Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. > "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! > http://kc.pennsyrr.com > "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... > http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Subject: [PRR] TrucTrain Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 15:32:46 -0400 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: PRR-Talk Digest - 08/27/04 Thread-Index: AcSL9GmkW269VrN5TLGqw1ksGJMQYQAd9BTA From: "Drye, John" To: "PRR-Talk" Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Dan Cupper writes: All three -- along with Spector and Eastern -- are depicted aboard the=20 PRR TrucTrain in the 1956 Grif Teller calendar titled Dynamic Progress.=20 PRR provided original photos to Teller for his use in creating the=20 painting -- those photos contain trailers bearing all of the above=20 trucking firms' names. ------------------------- Anyone else wonder whether this is more than a coincidence? Interesting = that artwork nearly 50 years old can still influence production = decisions today. Now, if we could only get an appropriate flat car in N = scale! John Drye ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Subject: [PRR] TrucTrain Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 15:32:46 -0400 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: PRR-Talk Digest - 08/27/04 Thread-Index: AcSL9GmkW269VrN5TLGqw1ksGJMQYQAd9BTA From: "Drye, John" To: "PRR-Talk" Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Dan Cupper writes: All three -- along with Spector and Eastern -- are depicted aboard the=20 PRR TrucTrain in the 1956 Grif Teller calendar titled Dynamic Progress.=20 PRR provided original photos to Teller for his use in creating the=20 painting -- those photos contain trailers bearing all of the above=20 trucking firms' names. ------------------------- Anyone else wonder whether this is more than a coincidence? Interesting = that artwork nearly 50 years old can still influence production = decisions today. Now, if we could only get an appropriate flat car in N = scale! John Drye ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Ted Andrews" Subject: RE: [PRR] TrucTrain Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 19:59:34 +0000 From: "Bob Zoeller" Subject: Re: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 16:43:14 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Jerry, where did you see that announcement or did you get a flyer? It is not on their website that I can find. Will the trailers be available separately or do you have to buy with tractors? Any part numbers or was this just a press release? Bob Zoeller ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jerry Britton" > Off-topic, but yet relevant, to 1950's modelers... > > Classic Metal Works has announced, for shipment in November, 1954 R-190 > tractors and Fruehauf 32' Aerovan Trailers in both HO and N scales. > > Other than Undecorated and Chicago Express, they are also being offered > in Mid-States and Cooper-Jarrett. What parts of the country did these > latter two roam in... around Pennsylvania by chance? ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2004 00:43:15 -0500 Subject: [PRR] PRR streamlined diners From: Frederick Ripley Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2004 00:43:15 -0500 Subject: [PRR] PRR streamlined diners From: Frederick Ripley Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2004 07:58:15 -0400 From: "James L. McDaniel" Subject: [PRR] Re: Setting the location (Delmarva) was Broadway Limited Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Oops, should have been H9s as pointed out by Bruce. It's the thought that counts....and the mass poultry industry came later to Delmarva. Perdue and Holly Farms (Tyson) came along in the early 70's well after the era of the real Delmarva Division. Reefers were everywhere both for local products -- mostly vegetables like taters (sweet) and arsh (white) taters as well as beans, greens, cabbage, on and on. There was less fruit, mostly strawberries and some peaches. I understand there were also lots of through reefers from the south to Philly & NY that came by car float, which traffic was one of the original reasons AJ Cassatt built the NYP&N. I have read somewhere that in the 1920s, Northampton and Accomack Counties (Virginia) were the two most productive farm counties (in dollars) in the US. Jim MCDaniel, easily corrected in Delmarva ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2004 10:20:56 -0700 (PDT) From: Geoffrey Van Dooren Subject: [PRR] Minimum radius for Walthers cars From: "Douglas Nelson" Subject: RE: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2004 10:50:57 -0700 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 In-Reply-To: X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Importance: Normal Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Any photos available? Doug Nelson -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Jerry @ Pennsy Sent: Friday, August 27, 2004 4:57 PM To: Bob Zoeller Cc: PRR-talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers On Aug 27, 2004, at 5:43 PM, Bob Zoeller wrote: > Jerry, where did you see that announcement or did you get a flyer? It > is > not on their website that I can find. > > Will the trailers be available separately or do you have to buy with=20 > tractors? > > Any part numbers or was this just a press release? Okay, guys, walking the fine line here... I got the info from one of my=20 distributors. Was trying to present in a non-dealer manner. Please keep=20 that in mind. Here are the part numbers and SUGGESTED RETAIL PRICES.=20 The N scale listings follow the HO listings. =A0 1954 R-190 TRACTOR W/ 32' FRUEHAUF AEROVAN TRAILER DUE 11/04 = 31101=A0=A0=A0 HENNIS=A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 $15.00 31102=A0=A0=A0 = ROADWAY=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 $15.00 31103=A0=A0=A0 P-I-E=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 $15.00 =A0 32' FRUEHAUF AEROVAN TRAILER 2 PACK DUE 11/04 31104=A0=A0=A0 CHICAGO EXPRESS=A0=A0=A0 $15.00 31105=A0=A0=A0 MID-STATES=A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 = =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 $15.00 31106=A0=A0=A0 COOPER-JARRETT=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 $15.00 31107=A0=A0=A0 UNDECORATED=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 =A0$15.00 =A0 1954 R-190 TRACTOR TRUCK DUE 11/04 31108=A0=A0=A0 CHICAGO EXPRESS=A0=A0=A0 $10.00 31109=A0=A0=A0 = MID-STATES=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0$10.00= 31110=A0=A0=A0 COOPER-JARRETT=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 $10.00 =A0 1954 INTERNATIONAL R-190 SEMI-TRACTOR TRUCK DUE 11/04 31111=A0=A0=A0 RED=A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 $10.00 31112=A0=A0=A0 GREEN=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0$10.00 31113=A0=A0=A0 WHITE=A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 $10.00 =A0 1954 INTERNATIONAL R-190 UNDEC. DELIVERY VANS DUE 11/04 30178=A0=A0=A0 RED CAB/WHITE = VAN=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0$10.00 30179=A0=A0=A0 DK GREEN CAB/SILVER VAN=A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0$10.00=A0 30180=A0=A0=A0 YELLOW CAB/SILVER = VAN=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0$10.00 =A0 N 1954 R-190 TRACTOR W/ 32' FRUEHAUF AEROVAN TRAILER DUE 11/04 = 51101=A0=A0=A0 HENNIS=A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 $16.00 51102=A0=A0=A0 = ROADWAY=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 $16.00 51103=A0=A0=A0 P-I-E=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 $16.00 =A0 N 32' FRUEHAUF AEROVAN TRAILER 2 PACK DUE 11/04 51104=A0=A0=A0=A0CHICAGO EXPRESS=A0=A0=A0 $16.00 51105=A0=A0=A0 MID-STATES=A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 = =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 $16.00 51106=A0=A0=A0 COOPER-JARRETT=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 $16.00 51107=A0=A0=A0 UNDECORATED=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 =A0$16.00 =A0 N 1954 R-190 TRACTOR TRUCK DUE 11/04 51108=A0=A0=A0 CHICAGO EXPRESS=A0=A0=A0 $11.00 51109=A0=A0=A0 = MID-STATES=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0$11.00= 51110=A0=A0=A0 COOPER-JARRETT=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 $11.00 =A0 N 1954 INTERNATIONAL R-190 SEMI-TRACTOR TRUCK DUE 11/04 51111=A0=A0=A0 RED=A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 $11.00 51112=A0=A0=A0 GREEN=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0$11.00 51113=A0=A0=A0 WHITE=A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0=A0 $11.00 =A0 N 1954 INTERNATIONAL R-190 UNDEC. DELIVERY VANS DUE 11/04 50178=A0=A0=A0 RED CAB/WHITE = VAN=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0$11.00 50179=A0=A0=A0 DK GREEN CAB/SILVER VAN=A0=A0=A0 =A0=A0$11.00=A0 50180=A0=A0=A0 YELLOW CAB/SILVER = VAN=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0$11.00 ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS jerry@pennsyrr.com Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone = Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: SUVCWORR@aol.com Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2004 15:18:20 EDT Subject: Re: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Jerry, Did you contact say if these were all diecast or diecast underframe and plastic bodies? Rich Orr In a message dated 8/28/2004 1:56:11 PM Eastern Daylight Time, dougnelson@mindspring.com writes: Okay, guys, walking the fine line here... I got the info from one of my distributors. Was trying to present in a non-dealer manner. Please keep that in mind. Here are the part numbers and SUGGESTED RETAIL PRICES. The N scale listings follow the HO listings. 1954 R-190 TRACTOR W/ 32' FRUEHAUF AEROVAN TRAILER DUE 11/04 31101 HENNIS $15.00 31102 ROADWAY $15.00 31103 P-I-E $15.00 32' FRUEHAUF AEROVAN TRAILER 2 PACK DUE 11/04 31104 CHICAGO EXPRESS $15.00 31105 MID-STATES $15.00 31106 COOPER-JARRETT $15.00 31107 UNDECORATED $15.00 1954 R-190 TRACTOR TRUCK DUE 11/04 31108 CHICAGO EXPRESS $10.00 31109 MID-STATES $10.00 31110 COOPER-JARRETT $10.00 1954 INTERNATIONAL R-190 SEMI-TRACTOR TRUCK DUE 11/04 31111 RED $10.00 31112 GREEN $10.00 31113 WHITE $10.00 1954 INTERNATIONAL R-190 UNDEC. DELIVERY VANS DUE 11/04 30178 RED CAB/WHITE VAN $10.00 30179 DK GREEN CAB/SILVER VAN $10.00 30180 YELLOW CAB/SILVER VAN $10.00 N 1954 R-190 TRACTOR W/ 32' FRUEHAUF AEROVAN TRAILER DUE 11/04 51101 HENNIS $16.00 51102 ROADWAY $16.00 51103 P-I-E $16.00 N 32' FRUEHAUF AEROVAN TRAILER 2 PACK DUE 11/04 51104 CHICAGO EXPRESS $16.00 51105 MID-STATES $16.00 51106 COOPER-JARRETT $16.00 51107 UNDECORATED $16.00 N 1954 R-190 TRACTOR TRUCK DUE 11/04 51108 CHICAGO EXPRESS $11.00 51109 MID-STATES $11.00 51110 COOPER-JARRETT $11.00 N 1954 INTERNATIONAL R-190 SEMI-TRACTOR TRUCK DUE 11/04 51111 RED $11.00 51112 GREEN $11.00 51113 WHITE $11.00 N 1954 INTERNATIONAL R-190 UNDEC. DELIVERY VANS DUE 11/04 50178 RED CAB/WHITE VAN $11.00 50179 DK GREEN CAB/SILVER VAN $11.00 50180 YELLOW CAB/SILVER VAN $11.00 ----------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: RickTipton@aol.com Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2004 15:42:56 EDT Subject: [PRR] Re: PRR-Talk Digest - 08/27/04 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com In a message dated 8/27/04 1:12:24 AM Eastern Daylight Time, PRR-Talk@dsop.com writes: > Subject: Re: [PRR] Broadway Limited > From: "Bruce Smith" > Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 09:41:55 -0500 > > On Aug 26, 2004, at 9:10 AM, Andy Miller wrote: > > >The USRA light 2-8-2 is not too improbable on a branchline RR. > > Excellent point! Not wanting an L2s I had ignored it... but you could > build a neat PRR granger scenario, with the L2S being the "road power" > and a B6 or H10 as local switching power. N6B cabins, flat terrain and > grain elevators would stamp an indellible "Lines West" impression in > the mind of the viewer. > > Regards > Bruce Tasty -- Eaton Ohio comes immediately to mind because of its passenger and freight stations -- there are several nice small towns to model on the Richmond Branch or Fort Wayne Branch, the prototype stomping grounds for the five L2s out of Pendleton/Undercliff in Cincinnati. Rick Tipton - Louisville KY Building a new Panhandle Route in HO (Pennsylvania RR Buckeye Div. 1966-1968) And Remembering PRR Lines West ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2004 13:22:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Doug Kisala Subject: Re: [PRR] Re: Branchline Passenger car survey sort of Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2004 15:53:04 -0500 Subject: [PRR] Re: TrucTrain From: John Sheets From: "Jerry Breon" Subject: [PRR] HO S2 Turbine Date: Sun, 29 Aug 2004 08:24:16 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Not sure how long it has been up, but I just noticed that Challenger = Imports has now posted pilot model photos of their upcoming S2 at: http://www.challengerimports.com/ Jerry Breon Birdsboro, PA ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Jerry Breon" Subject: [PRR] HO S2 Turbine Date: Sun, 29 Aug 2004 08:24:16 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Not sure how long it has been up, but I just noticed that Challenger = Imports has now posted pilot model photos of their upcoming S2 at: http://www.challengerimports.com/ Jerry Breon Birdsboro, PA ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Sun, 29 Aug 2004 12:25:21 -0400 (GMT-04:00) From: ealauterbach@earthlink.net Subject: [PRR] Walthers Heavyweights X-Mailer: Earthlink Zoo Mail 1.0 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I saw the ad in the latest MR and they look really nice. Which of these did Pennsy have? Also, any word yet on the B60b that Walthers is coming out with? Thanks, Eric ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Sun, 29 Aug 2004 13:31:24 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Re: [PRR] HO S2 Turbine From: smithbf@vetmed.auburn.edu X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com > Not sure how long it has been up, but I just noticed that Challenger > Imports has now posted pilot model photos of their upcoming S2 at: > http://www.challengerimports.com/ > Jerry Breon > Birdsboro, PA And the note at the bottom of the page that "Pennsylvania Railroad Classes H8, H9, and H10 2-8-0's" will be forthcoming as well. Regards Bruce Bruce Smith Auburn, AL ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Douglas Nelson" Subject: RE: [PRR] Walthers Heavyweights Date: Sun, 29 Aug 2004 14:28:40 -0700 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.6626 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <13802196.1093796722443.JavaMail.root@huey.psp.pas.earthlink.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Three of the Walthers heavyweight Pullmans (12-1 Plan 3410-A, 8-1-2 Plan 3979-A, and the 14 section Plan 3958) were assigned to the PRR and = operated by Pullman (when built to ca. 1948). These three cars were also bought = by the PRR ca. 1948 after the Pullman breakup. The 3-2-observation Plan = 3959-D apparently was not assigned to the PRR when built. PRR did purchase a single 3-2-obs ca. 1948. These models look excellent and these cars could be found mixed in with lightweight cars on most trains through the 1950s. Doug Nelson -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of ealauterbach@earthlink.net Sent: Sunday, August 29, 2004 9:25 AM To: prr-talk@dsop.com Subject: [PRR] Walthers Heavyweights I saw the ad in the latest MR and they look really nice. Which of these = did Pennsy have? Also, any word yet on the B60b that Walthers is coming out with? Thanks, Eric ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Subject: RE: [PRR] PRR streamlined diners Date: Sun, 29 Aug 2004 17:06:59 -0500 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [PRR] PRR streamlined diners Thread-Index: AcSNaqaEpiJHO8NmQ6et4y1PJbOsugAqWOhA From: "Cadwell, Marvin L" To: "Christopher Baker" , "Frederick Ripley" , X-OriginalArrivalTime: 29 Aug 2004 22:06:59.0898 (UTC) FILETIME=[81A809A0:01C48E14] Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Budd built, fluted diner,class D82bR, #4504, painted in FOM colors and displayed at the 1939 World's Fair is shown on P 59 of Blardone and Tilp's "Pennsylvania Railroad - Passenger Car Painting and Lettering", Published by the PRRT&HS. -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com]On Behalf Of Christopher Baker Sent: Saturday, August 28, 2004 8:48 PM To: Frederick Ripley; PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: RE: [PRR] PRR streamlined diners The Pennsy did own some prewar Budd-built diners that were painted in the FOM scheme. Later, these cars received the postwar all-Tuscan scheme but eventually the paint was stripped and the cars operated in natural stainless (albeit some with black-painted roofs). While technically not part of the East-West fleet of trains, the South Wind is one noteworthy example where a Budd-built, fluted diner was painted. I've seen pictures of others in various PRR books, but I'm not within easy reach of my resources at the moment to give more details. Chris Baker PRRT&HS #1918 -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com]On Behalf Of Frederick Ripley Sent: Saturday, August 28, 2004 12:43 AM To: PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: [PRR] PRR streamlined diners Hello all, Did the PRR own any single-unit diners that were streamlined, fluted, and painted tuscan red (in east-west service)? Thanks, Fred ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: Bruce Smith Subject: Re: [PRR] Walthers Heavyweights Date: Mon, 30 Aug 2004 08:15:24 -0500 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Aug 29, 2004, at 4:28 PM, Douglas Nelson wrote: > The 3-2-observation Plan 3959-D > apparently was not assigned to the PRR when built. PRR did purchase a > single 3-2-obs ca. 1948. Not exactly . According to Chuck Blardone in his article on wartime coach conversions (The Keystone, Summer 2001, vol 34, no 2), the PRR purchased 21 3-2-lounge-obs cars for conversion to PUW134. I found the following plan 3959 cars listed in Tom Madden's database as purchased by PRR in 1942. I realize that these cars were gutted and rebuilt to coaches upon purchase, but I believe that the window arrangement was unchanged - although I'll have to check my Keystone. I'm anxious to see how feasible the conversion is from the Walthers car. Central Falls Central Ferry Central Grove Central Mills Central Mine Central Route Central Provinces Central Mountains Ponce De Leon John Kinzie Leif Ericson Mark Beaubien Baffin Bay The car noted by Doug above was Joel Chandler Harris, which started as 3959, was converted to 3959C (10/8/29) then 3959G (6/2/37) and finally 3959J (5/17/40). Interesting, this car wore Southern two tone green (10/8/29), was repainted Pull. Std. (6/6/31), repainted to Southern Two-tone green (11/27/33), then to Pull. Std. (7/30/34) and finally PRR Red MDD4973, probably in 1948 at purchase. As I noted previously, in fact there are NO plan 3959D in Tom Madden's database at all, leading me to wonder what car Walthers is modeling (note that the database is not complete). Regards Bruce Bruce F. Smith Auburn, AL http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/ "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin __ / \ __<+--+>________________\__/___ ________________________________ |- ______/ O O \_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ | | / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 \ | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__|| |/_____________________________\|_|________________________________| | O--O \0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Douglas Nelson" Subject: RE: [PRR] Walthers Heavyweights Date: Mon, 30 Aug 2004 10:58:37 -0700 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hi Bruce and list: =20 The Pullman Passenger Car Catalog shows 29 3-2-obs Plan 3959-D built in = 1925 for service on B&O (4), NYC (20), and Southern (5). More minutia to = file in the back of our brains. The other 3-2-obs purchased by PRR apparently = were never listed amount PRR-owned sleeping cars due to their conversions to coaches. =20 Doug Nelson -----Original Message----- From: Bruce Smith [mailto:smithbf@vetmed.auburn.edu]=20 Sent: Monday, August 30, 2004 6:15 AM To: Douglas Nelson Cc: prr-talk@dsop.com Subject: Re: [PRR] Walthers Heavyweights On Aug 29, 2004, at 4:28 PM, Douglas Nelson wrote: The 3-2-observation Plan 3959-D apparently was not assigned to the PRR when built. PRR did purchase a single 3-2-obs ca. 1948. Not exactly . According to Chuck Blardone in his article on wartime = coach conversions (The Keystone, Summer 2001, vol 34, no 2), the PRR purchased = 21 3-2-lounge-obs cars for conversion to PUW134. I found the following plan 3959 cars listed in Tom Madden's database as purchased by PRR in 1942. I realize that these cars were gutted and rebuilt to coaches upon = purchase, but I believe that the window arrangement was unchanged - although I'll = have to check my Keystone. I'm anxious to see how feasible the conversion is = from the Walthers car. Central Falls Central Ferry Central Grove Central Mills Central Mine Central Route Central Provinces Central Mountains Ponce De Leon John Kinzie Leif Ericson Mark Beaubien Baffin Bay The car noted by Doug above was Joel Chandler Harris, which started as = 3959, was converted to 3959C (10/8/29) then 3959G (6/2/37) and finally 3959J (5/17/40). Interesting, this car wore Southern two tone green (10/8/29), = was repainted Pull. Std. (6/6/31), repainted to Southern Two-tone green (11/27/33), then to Pull. Std. (7/30/34) and finally PRR Red MDD4973, probably in 1948 at purchase. As I noted previously, in fact there are NO plan 3959D in Tom Madden's database at all, leading me to wonder what car Walthers is modeling = (note that the database is not complete). Regards Bruce Bruce F. Smith=20 Auburn, AL http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/ "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin __ / \ __<+--+>________________\__/___ ________________________________ |- ______/ O O \_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ | | / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 \ | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__|| |/_____________________________\|_|________________________________| | O--O \0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Tom Mahon" Subject: [PRR] Photo Contest Criteria Date: Mon, 30 Aug 2004 20:57:21 -0400 X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Good Evening, Had a great time last Saturday with the NE Chapter of the PRRT&H at the Berkshire Scenic Railway in Lenox, MA. Ted Garner and Jack Trowill set up a nice day. Thanks, guys. I recently resigned from two committees in my community and then volunteered to try to run a Railroad Photo and Graphic Arts Contest at our (Bedford (NH) Boomers) train show in November. Would appreciate it if anyone with experience in this type of activity would contact me off list and offer their words of wisdom and kind support. I need the real basics: size of submissions, categories (at this point merely looking at Open and under 14 or 15), who or if anyone is usually responsible for mounting or framing, identifying entries so that they can be returned, etc. Waivers, disclaimers and other possible legal stuff. As you can see, basic, basic, basic. Oh, it's also OK to question my sanity. Thanks. Tom Mahon Merrimack, NH ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2004 07:39:40 -0400 Subject: [PRR] TANGENT - Maintenance This Evening From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: <722F9AFE-FB42-11D8-8E12-000393835C88@pennsyrr.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com The servers at Desktop Solutions (DSOP.COM), which includes the PENNSYRR.COM domain, will be under maintenance this evening, in the window between 8 and 11 p.m., ET. Following a flood last month, the servers were moved to an alternate location. Now that the office has been refurbed, it is time to move them back. Downtime will actually be less than 45 minutes, but it is hard to predict ahead of time exactly when the move will take place. Thank you for your patience during this downtime. ---------------------------------------- Listmaster Desktop Solutions of Pennsylvania, Inc. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2004 08:15:24 -0400 Subject: [PRR] N Scale PRR P85b Coaches From: Jerry Britton Message-Id: <6FA1F828-FB47-11D8-8E12-000393835C88@pennsyrr.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Public Service Announcement... InterMountain (Centralia Car Shops) has shipped the N scale PRR P85b coaches in the KEYSTONE scheme. Reservations were very low on this version, but they still ran it. They opted to not even list it in their monthly releases! In fact, they only ran enough to cover dealer reservations. As a result, InterMountain is sold out. Dealers who had "spares" on order may have them in stock. If you are interested, you'd better snatch them up quick! Though InterMountain is sold out, some of the second run P85b's in PENNSYLVANIA letterboard scheme remain in the dealer channel. InterMountain and CCS will consider a third run based on additional reservations. ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Walter Prusick" Subject: [PRR] "fishbelly" hoppers Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2004 18:25:28 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Guys, Did any of the railroads which interchanged with the Pennsy in the Western PA area have a fishbelly hopper (ala Stewart Hobbies) on/in their roster? If so which one/s and whom should I contact to get some information? I intended to do a couple of GLca, until I got around to Mr. Teichmoeller's book. Close (maybe) but no cigar. Thanks in advance, Walt Prusick ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] "fishbelly" hoppers Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2004 18:33:08 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 In-reply-to: <000a01c48fa9$6ccf81c0$03669b04@stargate.net> Thread-index: AcSPqaL9B0Q+aLI2Qb+aGBWrY0eyDAAAKfZA Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com N&W. Class H1, I believe. I have several Stewarts which I run in a N&W cut with ECW H2a's. regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Walter Prusick Sent: Tuesday, August 31, 2004 6:25 PM To: PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: [PRR] "fishbelly" hoppers Guys, Did any of the railroads which interchanged with the Pennsy in the Western PA area have a fishbelly hopper (ala Stewart Hobbies) on/in their roster? If so which one/s and whom should I contact to get some information? I intended to do a couple of GLca, until I got around to Mr. Teichmoeller's book. Close (maybe) but no cigar. Thanks in advance, Walt Prusick ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Cc: "PRR-TALK" , From: Bruce Smith Subject: Re: [PRR] PRR (S2) Tarnish Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2004 07:57:23 -0500 To: "Sam Vastano" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.618) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Aug 2, 2004, at 6:38 AM, Sam Vastano wrote: > Group, > > I am in the midst of working on a Brass S2 and the engine is very > tarnished... I am talking Black in some areas... I was looking for > ideas to remove the tarnish and not the details.... > > Any ideas out there? Sam, By the far the easiest (best?) way I know is to grit-blast it. If you then want to paint it, you are all set as the brass now has "tooth" to hold the paint, and if you want to leave it unpainted, you can polish it with beads in the grit blaster and clear coat it. I have used Tarn-X, but if there is a clear coat, you will need to strip it first, and you can get somewhat uneven tarnish removal. Regards Bruce Bruce F. Smith V.M.D., Ph.D. Scott-Ritchey Research Center 334-844-5587, 334-844-5850 (fax) http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/ "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin __ / \ __<+--+>________________\__/___ ________________________________ |- ______/ O O \_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ | | / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 \ | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__|| |/_____________________________\|_|________________________________| | O--O \0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] Re: Fwd: FW: NEW PRODUCTS: ALCO RSD15 & PRR K4s Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2004 09:57:07 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-reply-to: <20040805134222.66991.qmail@web52603.mail.yahoo.com> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcR68uSm7jt2M8P/TZicoHMTxYiBOgAAJ1Wg Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com How did BLI figure out that since my wife bought a new bicycle she "owes me one" ;-) I guess they just figured there must still be more cash they can suck out of me. Well, I'll just have to put off the mortgage for another month. I hope this engine will follow their recent practice and include an optional traction tire. At last, a detailed K4 that pulls! My J1 with traction tire has hauled 50 cars up the long curving 2% grade at the North Shore Club! Something to supplement my Bowser K4's. regards, Andy Miller The MITRE Corp -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of Bill Daniels Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 9:42 AM To: PRR-Talk Subject: [PRR] Re: Fwd: FW: NEW PRODUCTS: ALCO RSD15 & PRR K4s OOps...forgot about the list not accepting mime... Anyways, there was a SECOND announcement from BLI which in the rush of excitement for the RDS15 is the K4s (hmmm...does anybody on this list care? ;-) in THREE versions...classic (pre-1938), and modernized (beauty treatment) with and without drop coupler. It is the first of a new series called Platinum Paragon. Priced at $450.00, delivery expected in October. ===== Bill Daniels Las Vegas, NV __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - Send 10MB messages! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Ken Hough " Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 14:50:37 -0500 Subject: Re: [PRR] PRR Steam loco headlights Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 16:34:04 -0400 From: Don Murphy Subject: Re: [PRR] Re: BLI K-4s Annoucement X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at out006.verizon.net from [4.41.106.228] at Fri, 6 Aug 2004 15:34:06 -0500 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I paid $200.00 for the Red Ball a year ago at a train show.I couldn't get my wallet out fast enough! $160 for a PFM K4 about 10 years ago at a show. Two years ago I bought a mint PFM L1 for $300.00at another show. I consider these all to be good deals. I grew up looking at the PFM ads on the back cover of model rairoad mags. The $49.00 and $59.00 prices were out of reach of this 12 year old then but the prices I pay for the same models today are bargains compared to new Railworks or Key models. Its nice to be able to fix them with solder instead of plastic glue. Easier to strip the paint off too. But there is a thrill to removing a T1 from the box, placing it on the track and having it run and make realistic noise right from the box! Don Murphy John Sheets wrote: >Don > > >>I own several BLI engines and think they're great but the $450.00 price >>tag on the K4 makes me think of what a great deal my PFM and Red Ball >>K4s are! >> >> > >Funny, I thought the same thing, except can you imagine what they would cost >today? Think I paid $79 or $99 > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] P70 Coach Wheel Diameter Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2004 11:48:51 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 In-reply-to: <36.5ef405e0.2e45aac0@aol.com> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcR8MhQPqg7wTGVQT7uuaZYpyUJmGQB9kQjg Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Yes regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of RDG2124@aol.com Sent: Friday, August 06, 2004 11:47 PM To: PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: [PRR] P70 Coach Wheel Diameter What size wheels were used on these coaches? 36" Dia.? Thank you, Evan Leisey RCT&HS 346 PRRT&HS 7487 PRRT&HS (Phila.) 2036 CNJ 2003 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Bob Zoeller" Subject: Re: [PRR] BLI cars Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 20:50:54 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I mentioned this on the Passenger Car List, with the question whether this was the same prototype Walthers announced a car for at the Train show for fall delivery. Bob Zoeller ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "PRR-Talk" Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2004 4:45 PM Subject: [PRR] BLI cars > Don't know if this has beenn discussed earlier or not. From the Trains web page at Kalmbach: > > We just received word that Broadway Limited Imports will be producing HO scale models of General American 53'-6" wood express refrigerator cars with factory-installed grab irons and Kadee couplers in more than a dozen roadnames, and in multiple numbers. Look for complete details in tomorrow evening's News & Products update. > Best wishes, > Terry > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Bennett Levin" Subject: Re: [PRR] NEC Corridor Date: Sat, 14 Aug 2004 21:04:33 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2727.1300 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Razor Blades! Bennett ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Frantz" To: Sent: Saturday, August 14, 2004 8:43 PM Subject: [PRR] NEC Corridor Gents and All, I had to travel yesterday from Baltimore to Philadelphia and i must say that it being the fist time i've riden this stretch that I had a great time. Getting on at penn Satation in baltimore i found a seat in the last car at the seat closest to the rear of the train. As it so happened the conductor was at this end punching tickets. I politely asked if he would mind me standing at the rear door to observe the passing ROW. He had no objections and i rode most of the hour trip watching out the rear door. Not quite the Observation lounge of the 120, but still an experience. I was suprised at the number of brick/wood construction towers that are still standing. One thing that I was sad to see while riding SEPTA north from 30th street was that the B60b and REA car that used to sit at the rear of the power plant in penn Coach have disappeared. Would anybody know what happened to them? A little kindness can still go a long way in cooperating with AMTRAK employees. Regards, John ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Benjamin Hom" Subject: Re: [PRR] PRR Talk St. Louis Prototype Modelers Meet Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 17:32:17 -0700 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4910.0300 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com John Caples asked: "Anyone from this list going to this meet? I would like to meet other PRR fans at this show." I'll be there. See you on Saturday! Ben Hom ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Wayne S. Betty" Subject: RE: [PRR] B1 electric switchers Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 17:35:30 -0400 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <20040816210318.36260.qmail@web41904.mail.yahoo.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Importance: Normal X-SLUIDL: D1482D17-5EB04163-9EE07E4E-8B7D67EA Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I'll have to look it up- but off the top of my head (it's a bit mushy lately) the B1s ran with a full switch crew. Crew reduction didn't happen until the advent of the 45 ton limit. Engines below 45 tons gross could be operated with just an engineer and no fireman was needed. I think this was negotiated about 1946 (Rule book guys - jump in here) - the result was the GS4. The B1, weighing in at 78 tons was weigh (a poor pun) over the limit. Hopefully someone else can confirm the full crew too. Cos Wayne S. Betty Cos Communications, Inc. Small business IT services. Lancaster & Atlantic Rail Road NMRA, MER, Susquehanna Div, 11 NHRS, Lancaster & PRRT&HS #7061 http://www.wsbcos.com/trainsmenu.htm at the west end of the PRR electrified zone "If we can not have what we like, we must learn to like what we have!" John Paul Jones Subject: [PRR] B1 electric switchers Hi, Does anyone know how many crewman operated a B1 electric in a yard? Was it just an engineer or was there a fireman as well? And was this different from when the units were coupled together in the 1920s? Thanks for any info. Frank Smith ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Subject: RE: [PRR] Part of Marietta Branch in operation again Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 08:36:34 -0500 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [PRR] Part of Marietta Branch in operation again Thread-Index: AcSFmXD1+GDggDd1RsibEDLoiRfPLAAVxmjg From: "Cadwell, Marvin L" To: "jeffrey d thomas" , Cc: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Aug 2004 13:36:35.0503 (UTC) FILETIME=[8BF6B3F0:01C485F1] Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com If one opens up the Buckeye Central Website and clicks on "Other RRs & = Railroad Items of Interest, one can open up the following web-site: =20 http://www.rosecity.net/trains/station.html The St. Louis & Iron Mountain Railway claims that its (restored) E8 = locomotive is ex PRR #5989. Anybody have any further information on this? -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com]On Behalf Of jeffrey d thomas Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2004 9:36 PM To: PRR-Talk@dsop.com Cc: PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: [PRR] Part of Marietta Branch in operation again I just spent the weekend in=20 Southeastern Ohio, and discovered that part of the Marietta branch has been repaired and is being operated by a tourist railroad. The Buckeye Central Railroad, apparently has moved it's operations from Buckeye = Lake, to Byesville, Ohio. They, or some local government agency, repaired the flood damaged line from Byesville, south to Derwent, and operate trains on the weekends. The conductor told me they hope to operate clear out to Cumberland on the old B&O trackage that branches off the Marietta line = at Derwent.=20 The line from Byesville, all the way to the end of track south of Cumberland, is heavy, welded rail. This trackage would let them take riders out to "The Wilds", a huge nature preserve in the old mine reclamation areas near Cumberland. The railroad has a very nice website with some history of these rail lines. www.buckeyecentralrailroad.org Jeff thomas Denton, Tx. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "STEPHEN HOXIE" Subject: Re: [PRR] Last Run Date Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 11:30:55 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 X-ELNK-Trace: 65fbc22f705d6e9971639b933de7ae6f7e972de0d01da94092e5a81dac8b67c23ffd3bb6e10c0d37350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 199.174.139.210 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Hi Gary--From the Keystone, March 1977, p. 11, "On Monday November 25, 1957, engineman W. E. Densol of the Pittsburgh Division pulled out of Cresson eastbound past MO tower with fifty hopper cars of coal and an I1sa locomotive. He rounded the Horseshoe Curve at 9:20 am and dropped his train at Juniata Scales. When the engine was put in the roundhouse at East Altoona, the last revenue steam run on the PRR was finished. It is fitting that the last steam operation had an I1sa, coal, and the Horseshoe Curve together for one last time." Steve Hoxie Pensacola FL ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Mittner" To: Sent: Thursday, August 19, 2004 9:48 AM Subject: [PRR] Last Run Date > List, > > What was the date of that last steam operation on the PRR > supposedly regarding an I1sa and hopper train in or around > Cresson/Galitzin/Altoona area? Thanks, Gary > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Sam Vastano" Subject: Re: [PRR] PRR in the Movies alert!! Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2004 10:37:56 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 24 Aug 2004 14:36:12.0849 (UTC) FILETIME=[B44B2210:01C489E7] Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Group, Just for the heck of it I wanted to see what that movie sells for so I looked it up on e-bay.... Pretty pricy for such an old movie. VHS was 68.00 and someone was selling the 16MM version for over 100.00 Sam V ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ted Andrews" To: "PRR Talk" Sent: Monday, August 23, 2004 11:57 PM Subject: [PRR] PRR in the Movies alert!! PRR Listers: I was watching Turner Movie Classics this evening. They are showing the following movie: The Major and the Minor, (1942), starring Ginger Rogers and Ray Milland. The movie plot is a woman (Rogers) disguises herself as a little girl and ends up in a military academy. The beginning of the movie takes place on the EB Broadway Limited and has some great action shots of the Broadway heading out of Chicago and going across the 4-tracked mainline in Pennsylvania pulled by K-4 3768 (fully streamlined) Great action shots!!! Ted Andrews ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Andy Miller" Subject: RE: [PRR] branchline survey Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 15:41:51 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Thread-index: AcSK1wIJSgrrW5AqRRqk51Z+Wm9SOgAAGNBQ In-reply-to: <001001c48ad7$81f782e0$0401a8c0@johng> Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com I (again) want to nominate some of the more common single vestibule cars; a 6-6 POPLAR car, and/or an 8-5 CLOVER car. Last time I did this a long discussion ensued as to which of several variations should be done. "Frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn!" Anything would be better than nothing. Nothing is what we have now. I would be far happier with a 4084B standing in for a 4084A than with the Bachmann thing. regards, Andy Miller -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com] On Behalf Of trainmonster@stargate.net Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2004 3:13 PM To: PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: [PRR] branchline survey hello, all... i will continue to buy the heavyweight sleepers in kit config., and if they appear in rtr. format, i'll most likely pick up some of them as well. a fair price for the cars, all up and running would be $ 60- $ 65....imho. now lets get them thinking about some new car types. how about an 8 section club lounge car. can you say " lotos club " ????!! jaygee ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: SUVCWORR@aol.com Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2004 16:54:50 EDT Subject: Re: [PRR] Branchline Question X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com ALL: The responses can be sent directly to me. I only sent the original message to Jerry because I wasn't sure it fit within the guidelines of the group. That being said, I am not an agent for Branchline. I am a dealer and as such was asked my opinion regarding RTR passenger cars and how my customers felt about RTR passenger cars. To get a better idea of what people thought (the bigger the pool, the more accurate the response), I wanted to present the question to the list. So please don't flood Jerry's mailbox. I am keeping tab and will report the results. Thanks. Rich Orr ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Chany, Christopher" Subject: RE: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 14:51:33 -0400 From: Jerry Britton [mailto:jerry@pennsyrr.com] Subject: [PRR] TANGENT - 1950's Trailers Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2004 15:58:43 -0400 From: Jeff Warner Subject: Re: [PRR] Power Chassis For P2K FA Units Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Frank: I am running a set of Reading FA-1's over the Walthers Trainline chassis. They fit fine with only minor modifications needed. I can't comment on the prototypically correctness of the Walthers trucks. I could send a .JPG of my units if you'd like to see them. There were 2 runs of P2K FA's. The newer one is much better than the older one (older had the moving fans, newer did not). What problem are you having with them? Jeff Warner > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004 15:43:39 -0400 Subject: Re: [PRR] TrucTrain From: Jerry Britton X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com On Friday, August 27, 2004, at 03:32 PM, Drye, John wrote: > Anyone else wonder whether this is more than a coincidence? > Interesting that artwork nearly 50 years old can still influence > production decisions today. Now, if we could only get an appropriate > flat car in N scale! As for the original F30d's... Patience!!! ;-) We also need correct PRR trailers. I prefer the earlier 24-26' versions. Again, patience!!! ;-) ----------------------------------------------------------- Jerry Britton, SPF Member, PRRT&HS Pennsylvania Railroad, Eastern Region, 1954 in N Scale. "Keystone Crossings" - Home of the "PRR-Talk" mailing list! http://kc.pennsyrr.com "Merchandise Service" - Model railroad products... http://merchandise.pennsyrr.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Christopher Baker" Subject: RE: [PRR] PRR streamlined diners Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2004 21:47:33 -0400 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1441 Importance: Normal Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com The Pennsy did own some prewar Budd-built diners that were painted in the FOM scheme. Later, these cars received the postwar all-Tuscan scheme but eventually the paint was stripped and the cars operated in natural stainless (albeit some with black-painted roofs). While technically not part of the East-West fleet of trains, the South Wind is one noteworthy example where a Budd-built, fluted diner was painted. I've seen pictures of others in various PRR books, but I'm not within easy reach of my resources at the moment to give more details. Chris Baker PRRT&HS #1918 -----Original Message----- From: PRR-Talk@dsop.com [mailto:PRR-Talk@dsop.com]On Behalf Of Frederick Ripley Sent: Saturday, August 28, 2004 12:43 AM To: PRR-Talk@dsop.com Subject: [PRR] PRR streamlined diners Hello all, Did the PRR own any single-unit diners that were streamlined, fluted, and painted tuscan red (in east-west service)? Thanks, Fred ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!! From: "Al Buchan" Subject: RE: [PRR] HO S2 Turbine Date: Sun, 29 Aug 2004 11:48:48 -0400 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2742.200 Sender: Precedence: List List-Software: LetterRip Pro 4.04 by LetterRip Software, LLC. List-Subscribe: List-Digest: List-Unsubscribe: X-LR-SENT-TO: dsop.com Jerry, et al.: Re: I just noticed that Challenger Imports has now posted pilot model photos of their upcoming S2 PRRT&HS modeling committee member Joe Acri has been working with Challenger imports on this model. Al ----------------------------------------------------------------------- For assistance with this list, please visit http://lists.dsop.com. !!NEXT MESSAGE!!